stokedboss
Max Output Level: -88 dBFS
- Total Posts : 149
- Joined: 2009/03/02 18:36:14
- Location: Canada
- Status: offline
Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
Hey eveyone, I'm looking for some help. I've been having some major noise (ground hum like) from my studio monitors on a new PC build. I'm able to get rid of most of the noise if I use the ground lift on my sub that feeds my monitors. However, as soon as I boot up Sonar and the audio engine loads I get this low level hum. The only way I can make it any better is by increasing the latency of my audio interface. This has me totally baffled. If I use this same interface, with the same speaker setup with a Mac running logic - it's silent. I've checked my receptacles, and they are grounded. The noise only happens when my PC is on. I've tried removing internal components one at a time, but that doesn't resolve the problem. I'm using a EVGA 80+ Silver PS, maybe it's causing the noise? But why does the noise only happen when I'm in Sonar? If I go to the preferences menu, as soon as it loads the noise stops. Then as soon as I go back to the main view in Sonar it comes back. Anyone ever have something like this happen to them?
Sonar X2a PE, Win 7 64-bit, Intel Core i7 3770k, 8Gb Corsair XMS3 RAM, Asus P8Z77 Lk, Roland Octa-Capture.
|
mettelus
Max Output Level: -22 dBFS
- Total Posts : 5321
- Joined: 2005/08/05 03:19:25
- Location: Maryland, USA
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/11 17:41:18
(permalink)
What interface are you using, and how is it connected? It is very possible to get crosstalk inside the computer itself, so would help us better if we know the components in play (using same outlet, USB hubs, etc.).
ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero (Wi-Fi AC), i7-8700k, 16GB RAM, GTX-1070Ti, Win 10 Pro, Saffire PRO 24 DSP, A-300 PRO, plus numerous gadgets and gizmos that make or manipulate sound in some way.
|
stokedboss
Max Output Level: -88 dBFS
- Total Posts : 149
- Joined: 2009/03/02 18:36:14
- Location: Canada
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/11 17:43:48
(permalink)
I'm using a Roland Octacapture. Everything is plugged into the same UPS at the same outlet (I've tried changing outlets as well). The interface is plugged into the Motherboard directly, and I've tried multiple USB ports.
Sonar X2a PE, Win 7 64-bit, Intel Core i7 3770k, 8Gb Corsair XMS3 RAM, Asus P8Z77 Lk, Roland Octa-Capture.
|
stokedboss
Max Output Level: -88 dBFS
- Total Posts : 149
- Joined: 2009/03/02 18:36:14
- Location: Canada
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/11 17:56:55
(permalink)
Additionally, this noise only happens in Sonar. I downloaded a trial of Cubase, and it's dead silent at the same driver settings... Maybe a rouge plug-in?
Sonar X2a PE, Win 7 64-bit, Intel Core i7 3770k, 8Gb Corsair XMS3 RAM, Asus P8Z77 Lk, Roland Octa-Capture.
|
Johnbee58
Max Output Level: -72 dBFS
- Total Posts : 946
- Joined: 2014/06/21 10:45:53
- Location: Reading PA
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/11 18:35:38
(permalink)
How cramped is everything in the area of your DAW? Sounds like you may have some cables crossing each other. If a cable carrying electricity (ie power cord for PC, Monitor, etc) crosses over a speaker lead you can get that. ![](http://forum.cakewalk.com/upfiles/smiley/s1.gif) John B.
Lenovo Core i5 4460 Desktop PC (Windows 8 64 bit), Focusrite Scarlett 6i6, Nektar LX61 Keyboard MIDI Controller, Avantone Pro CV-12 tube condenser microphone, JBL LSR308 8" active monitor speakers. Cakewalk by Bandlab, Reason 7, NI Session Strings Pro, NI Strummed Acoustic Guitar, Miroslav Philharmonic, Auturia DX7 V, Garritan JABB 3, EZ Keys, EZ Drummer. "I will create music the way I want to whether a million people are listening or no one is listening." Dan Fogelberg, Singer/Songwriter-1951-2007
|
sock monkey
Max Output Level: -80 dBFS
- Total Posts : 547
- Joined: 2011/11/06 12:12:08
- Location: Tree Top Studios
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/11 18:40:41
(permalink)
☄ Helpfulby Steev 2018/11/12 10:07:53
Best way to trouble shoot is to eliminate as much as possible and see at which point the hum returns. It might always be there and just gets louder under certain circumstances. I would defiantly remove the sub from the signal path first. Do you hear anything with headphones on? You try different cables etc. Even different USB cables, make sure to use one with a ferite choke
Cakelab - Sonar X3e Studio Singer Songwriter, Solo Performer, Acoustic Duo and semi pro Sound Monkey.
|
bvideo
Max Output Level: -58 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1707
- Joined: 2006/09/02 22:20:02
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/11 21:01:21
(permalink)
Noise from opening Sonar could come from a humming input assigned to a track which is echo-enabled. Another possibility (?) is some "console emulator" that deliberately generates hum. Both would disappear when opening Sonar's preferences or disabling the audio engine.
W10 pro, Sonar Platinum, Alesis Multimix 16 FW, MOTU Express 128, Gigabyte Z370 HD3P, i7 8700K, 16 Gigs, ssd + 2 X 2T disks, D50-MEX, JV80, A90EX, M1REX
|
Billy86
Max Output Level: -83 dBFS
- Total Posts : 362
- Joined: 2015/03/06 16:03:26
- Location: Seattle
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/11 23:57:07
(permalink)
I’ll state the obvious. You’re running balanced cables, right?
Windows 10 x64 on a Dell/Intel i5, 500 Gig SSD, 32 gig RAM, Focusrite Scarlett 2i4, Sonar Professional, Melodyne 4 Assistant, Kurzweil SP-76 stage piano, Baldwin RP 100 digital upright, Novation Impulse 25, Breedlove Pursuit Concert Acous/Elec, Fender American Standard Tele, Fender G-DEC 30 modeling amp, Sigma DM-5 Acoustic, Ovation MCS148 Celebrity Acous/Elec. Mandolin, Roland V-Drums TD-11KV, AKG P220, Yamaha MG82CX mixer, KRK Rokit 6 Powered Monitors, PreSonus FaderPort
|
scook
Forum Host
- Total Posts : 24146
- Joined: 2005/07/27 13:43:57
- Location: TX
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/12 00:18:54
(permalink)
stokedboss Additionally, this noise only happens in Sonar. I downloaded a trial of Cubase, and it's dead silent at the same driver settings... Maybe a rouge plug-in?
Since you are trying different DAWs does CbB (use the BandLab Assistant install process) have the problem? Make sure when creating your BandLab account use the same email as your Cakewalk account.
|
Steev
Max Output Level: -84 dBFS
- Total Posts : 314
- Joined: 2006/02/04 08:24:08
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/12 10:36:21
(permalink)
sock monkey Best way to trouble shoot is to eliminate as much as possible and see at which point the hum returns. It might always be there and just gets louder under certain circumstances. I would defiantly remove the sub from the signal path first. Do you hear anything with headphones on? You try different cables etc. Even different USB cables, make sure to use one with a ferite choke
![](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcROVa8RIvZiB2azdymE0kUayBEPbkS9KEYk3tO5xCs9Qwml6K0J)
I had a similar a while back that drove me crazy for months. It ONLY happened in SONAR Platinum. Never in Pro Tools, ACID Pro, Vegas, or Sound Forge. Noise in the monitors and in the head phones, however is never seemed to find it's way into recordings. As strange as it may seem, it was a MIDI cable gone bad. The noise wasn't in the DAW itself or any audio I/O, it caused by the way Splat configures MIDI I/O upon launch. Just moving my outboard gear rack about one foot to the left caused the problem with a 5 pin dyn MIDI cable running from my Roland JV synth module to the MIDIMAN 8x8 USB patch bay interface caused a ground short.
Steev on Bandlab.com Custom built workstation. Windows 10 Pro x64. SONAR Platinum. Cakewalk by Bandlab.Sony Sound Forge Pro 10, ACID Pro 7, Vegas Pro 11Pro Tools. ASRock 990FX mobo, AMD FX 8370 8-Core. 16 gb DDR3 PC1866 G Skill Ripjaws X RAM. AMD FirePro V4900 1gb DDR5 accelerated graphics card. Behringer X Touch DAW ControllerFocusrite Scarlett 18i20 gen 2, OctoPre MkllWestern Digital 500GB SSD bootdrive, WD 500GB 10k rpm VelociRaptor for DAW projects . 2x1 TB WD Caviar Black SATA3 storage drives
|
poetnprophet
Max Output Level: -88 dBFS
- Total Posts : 128
- Joined: 2016/07/23 12:56:57
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/12 19:26:48
(permalink)
Billy86 I’ll state the obvious. You’re running balanced cables, right?
Can you elaborate?
|
slartabartfast
Max Output Level: -22.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 5289
- Joined: 2005/10/30 01:38:34
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/12 19:57:50
(permalink)
|
poetnprophet
Max Output Level: -88 dBFS
- Total Posts : 128
- Joined: 2016/07/23 12:56:57
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/12 20:26:55
(permalink)
yes I understand the difference well enough, "thanks" for the link, but I just want to know where he was going with that. I've had a hum issue for some time as well, so I'm always looking for insight and the way it was stated there is something wrong obviously wrong with balanced cables...
|
azslow3
Max Output Level: -42.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 3297
- Joined: 2012/06/22 19:27:51
- Location: Germany
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/12 20:59:48
(permalink)
I remember there was adiscussion about some fancy crosstalk in Roland interfaces... Have you already tried to disconnect everything except monitors (including headphones), turn off gain on all inputs and disable direct monitoring? When Sonar engine is running, ASIO is continuously transferring in/out. When testing in Cubase, have you used exactly the same settings for the rate/latency and bit depth? And if not yet done, try different USB cable, also on different port. I had rather fancy effects when VS-20 was connected with a bad cable
Sonar 8LE -> Platinum infinity, REAPER, Windows 10 pro GA-EP35-DS3L, E7500, 4GB, GTX 1050 Ti, 2x500GB RME Babyface Pro (M-Audio Audiophile Firewire/410, VS-20), Kawai CN43, TD-11, Roland A500S, Akai MPK Mini, Keystation Pro, etc. www.azslow.com - Control Surface Integration Platform for SONAR, ReaCWP, AOSC and other accessibility tools
|
stokedboss
Max Output Level: -88 dBFS
- Total Posts : 149
- Joined: 2009/03/02 18:36:14
- Location: Canada
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/12 21:14:09
(permalink)
Thanks for the reply's guys.
I seemed to have narrowed it down to something in my projects, but I still can't figure out what it is. If I open a Cakewalk demo song it's pretty much silent but if I open one of my projects it hums... so strange. Even if I mute all of the tracks including my interface output it's still there.
Sonar X2a PE, Win 7 64-bit, Intel Core i7 3770k, 8Gb Corsair XMS3 RAM, Asus P8Z77 Lk, Roland Octa-Capture.
|
stokedboss
Max Output Level: -88 dBFS
- Total Posts : 149
- Joined: 2009/03/02 18:36:14
- Location: Canada
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/12 21:50:33
(permalink)
Okay I eliminated the hum. I engaged the ground lift on both my monitors and my sub, and I eliminated my UPS and plugged everything directly into the wall. Now there is just the slight static sound of the speakers being on, in any project! Pretty strange still though, why would the UPS make noise only on certain projects? I can't explain it.
Sonar X2a PE, Win 7 64-bit, Intel Core i7 3770k, 8Gb Corsair XMS3 RAM, Asus P8Z77 Lk, Roland Octa-Capture.
|
jpetersen
Max Output Level: -61 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1499
- Joined: 2015/07/11 20:22:53
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/13 21:54:28
(permalink)
I have hum problems with my Roland Octas, solved only by lifting ground or isolating transformers on the inputs (used to be standard equipment on studio mixers). But if it is project-dependent it must be open channels on those projects.
|
mettelus
Max Output Level: -22 dBFS
- Total Posts : 5321
- Joined: 2005/08/05 03:19:25
- Location: Maryland, USA
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/13 22:33:46
(permalink)
Some plugins process audio without the transport running (iZotope's Vinyl will throw you for a loop if you forgot you put it in a project since inserting noise is "what is does"). Global FX bypass (E) is always good to check if something appears project dependent.
ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero (Wi-Fi AC), i7-8700k, 16GB RAM, GTX-1070Ti, Win 10 Pro, Saffire PRO 24 DSP, A-300 PRO, plus numerous gadgets and gizmos that make or manipulate sound in some way.
|
Kamikaze
Max Output Level: -45 dBFS
- Total Posts : 3013
- Joined: 2015/01/15 21:38:59
- Location: Da Nang, Vietnam
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/14 00:24:45
(permalink)
Is your 'Direct Mixer' set to 0 (-) ?
|
stokedboss
Max Output Level: -88 dBFS
- Total Posts : 149
- Joined: 2009/03/02 18:36:14
- Location: Canada
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/20 17:06:09
(permalink)
Hey everyone, thanks for the reply's. Looks like my issue is back. It was clean for about a week and now it's doing it again. There has to be some kind of interference that I'm picking up. I've now tried using a modified extension cord to physically lift the ground to everything with no change. I've used different USB cables in different ports. I've removed the sub and plugged the interface directly into the monitors. I even bought Mogami cables to go from the interface to the monitors. I've tried a different video card in my PC - Still the same. I'm starting to run out of ideas here. The sound used to be project dependent, since it's come back it does it all the time, but gets worse when an audio engine kicks in - Sonar or Studio One. I've ordered some ferrite chokes off the net to try putting on the USB cable, but that seems like a long shot because the interface isn't powered with USB. If I remove the USB cable from the interface the sound goes away. However even if I plug it into say a port on my mac it comes back -- but ONLY when my PC is running. There has to be something inducing the noise from my PC but I don't know what. I've tried unplugging everything in the case that isn't necessary to run. Extra Hard drives, SSD's, etc. but there's still no change.
Sonar X2a PE, Win 7 64-bit, Intel Core i7 3770k, 8Gb Corsair XMS3 RAM, Asus P8Z77 Lk, Roland Octa-Capture.
|
Base 57
Max Output Level: -86 dBFS
- Total Posts : 249
- Joined: 2014/12/26 16:30:14
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/20 17:57:28
(permalink)
Do you have any MIDI devices? MIDI is an often overlooked source of ground loops.
|
Cactus Music
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 8424
- Joined: 2004/02/09 21:34:04
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/20 20:22:49
(permalink)
The best test you could perform right now is to swap out your audio interface. Is there a friend or a music store you could borrow from? You could even order one on line make the test and send it back if the hum remains. If it goes away then there you go,,, keep it.
|
tlw
Max Output Level: -49.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 2567
- Joined: 2008/10/11 22:06:32
- Location: West Midlands, UK
- Status: offline
Re: Need Help Resolving Noise When Sonar Runs
2018/11/21 03:09:00
(permalink)
stokedboss If I remove the USB cable from the interface the sound goes away. However even if I plug it into say a port on my mac it comes back -- but ONLY when my PC is running. There has to be something inducing the noise from my PC but I don't know what. Is this with the PC connected to the UPS? If so it might be that the UPS isolates the PC from nasties in the mains by using a switching unity gain power supply. They can sometimes kick all kinds of noise back into the mains, especially if they produce a very stepped “fake” sine wave output. What’s the Mac? Laptop with psu in the cable or an iMac/Mac Pro with built in psu? If a laptop, is the noise there with the Mac disconnected from the mains and the PC on? It’s not impossible that it’s the PC’s own psu that’s the culprit, or even something else on the same ring main - e.g. light dimmers, fridges, washing machines.....
Sonar Platinum 64bit, Windows 8.1 Pro 64bit, I7 3770K Ivybridge, 16GB Ram, Gigabyte Z77-D3H m/board, ATI 7750 graphics+ 1GB RAM, 2xIntel 520 series 220GB SSDs, 1 TB Samsung F3 + 1 TB WD HDDs, Seasonic fanless 460W psu, RME Fireface UFX, Focusrite Octopre. Assorted real synths, guitars, mandolins, diatonic accordions, percussion, fx and other stuff.
|