Is this legal?

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anton harris
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2005/07/07 02:18:16 (permalink)

A computer,
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a voice,
a little little bit of talent,
www.myspace.com/antzmalandluke





#1

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    RTGraham
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/07 02:26:15 (permalink)
    Hard to say. If the box is unopened, then there's probably no violation of the EULA. If the box is opened but the software was never installed, then the person currently in possession probably never implicitly agreed to the EULA, and so there's no violation of the EULA.

    But if the software was ever installed on a machine, even if the S/N wasn't registered with Cakewalk, then the user agreed to the EULA, which includes at least one clause prohibiting transfer of the software, in which case the sale is illegal.

    However, it appears that this particular sale is outside the United States, and so other factors may come into play with regard to whether the territory where the software currently resides considers the EULA and its various clauses to be valid in the first place.

    So, like I said - Hard to say.

    ~~~~~~~~~~
    Russell T. Graham
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    #2
    anton harris
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/07 02:36:47 (permalink)
    even if the S/N wasn't registered with Cakewalk, then the user agreed to the EULA, which includes at least one clause prohibiting transfer of the software, in which case the sale is illegal.
    Thats what i thought.I dont want to seem a high and righteous type but doesnt seem right to me.

    A computer,
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    a little little bit of talent,
    www.myspace.com/antzmalandluke





    #3
    johndale
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/07 03:44:26 (permalink)
    But the EULA is not valid in all countries either. So Antz, is the EULA legal in NZ?................................................JDW
    #4
    davidchristopher
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/07 12:03:38 (permalink)
    Pardon my ignorance, but can anyone explain to me why an EULA is not 'legal' in some countries? I've heard this may times before, but none has ever actually indicated why this is the case...

    David Bistolas
    www.bistolas.net
    #5
    RTGraham
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/07 13:51:35 (permalink)
    As I understand it (and I may not understand it correctly, as I'm not an attorney, but here goes:) certain states, countries, territories, etc. have legislation which prohibits limitations on liability - for example, you may have read warranty information that states that the manufacturer isn't responsible for failure, loss, etc., "except where prohibited by law."

    Similarly, some places have legislation that makes certain language in an EULA irrelevant. For those of us in the United States, the EULA is pretty binding, and on top of that the more recent Cakewalk installers make you specifically check more than one box agreeing not to duplicate the software; but I don't know what the rules are like in New Zealand (that's where the auction appears to be).
    #6
    LoopJunkie
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/07 18:18:48 (permalink)
    Pardon my ignorance, but can anyone explain to me why an EULA is not 'legal' in some countries?


    In theory an EULA could be completely illegal in every country. It's a one-sided contract drawn up by a private company. They usually put in clauses which are to their own benefit only, without proper regard to a fair balance of rights and obligations. Just because they put something on paper does not make it legal in any way.

    Even in the US some clauses (e.g. on resale) are regularly thrown out by courts as illegal and unfair to the customer.

    loop

    #7
    Grehn
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/07 18:39:47 (permalink)
    Legal.. illegal...

    You agree not to transfer the software when you install it. Once you DO transfer, you void your license to that software. That's it. You don't go to prison! People buy and sell software all the time and this isn't piracy (which is what the EULA helps to protect against). Now, if someone were making copies of this software and repackaging it for sale, that would be bad.

    I'm not saying that this is what I do - I keep every piece of Cakewalk software I buy because you can't BEAT their upgrade pricing!

    But, I'm no lawyer and could be completely wrong here...
    post edited by Grehn - 2005/07/07 18:46:51

    Cheers,
    Curt
    #8
    anton harris
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/08 02:03:12 (permalink)
    I keep every piece of Cakewalk software I buy because you can't BEAT their upgrade pricing!
    So do i and i also make a copy in case of damage to the original.Is that legal?

    A computer,
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    a little little bit of talent,
    www.myspace.com/antzmalandluke





    #9
    Lona69
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/08 02:18:57 (permalink)
    Also....I have a laptop and a desktop...am I allowed to run copies on both?

    Daddy,couldnt format drive A, so I formatted C instead
    #10
    agreatheight
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/08 02:35:28 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: Lona69

    Also....I have a laptop and a desktop...am I allowed to run copies on both?


    Good question. I am not sure of the Cakewalk verbage but for most softwares, technically no, you are not allowed. Most companies prohibit softwares from being loaded on more than one machine at the same time. It's to make sure some guy in an office with 200 computers doesn't buy only one of say, Microsoft Word, and installs it on all of the machines - I've seen it done. He needs to buy 200 licenses, one per machine. Realistically though, most companies don't mind if you load software on an extra machine - as long as they are not being operated simeutaneously (I guess that's where the abuse lies).
    post edited by agreatheight - 2005/07/08 02:44:34

    wish i was ocean size, no one moves you no one even tries...

    Eric Hartmann
    agreatheight@msn.com
    #11
    agreatheight
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/08 02:40:13 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: anton harris
    I also make a copy in case of damage to the original.Is that legal?


    Another good question. Again, I am not sure of Cake's exact verbage, but most companies prohibit ANY copying of their software in the User Agreement. However, generally speaking making a copy of a copywrited materials for back-up purposes falls under what's called 'fair use' and is ok. So really, what you agree to and what is legal are not necessarily the same thing, like Loop said.
    post edited by agreatheight - 2005/07/08 02:45:12

    wish i was ocean size, no one moves you no one even tries...

    Eric Hartmann
    agreatheight@msn.com
    #12
    harmony gardens
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/08 02:54:50 (permalink)
    I skipped Sonar 2, but I have Pro Audio 8 and 9, Sonar 1, 3 and 4,,,, would it be wrong for me to pick up a copy of Sonar 2 XL in order to get the DR-008 and the plugs I don't have???
    #13
    LoopJunkie
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/08 05:02:26 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: harmony gardens

    I skipped Sonar 2, but I have Pro Audio 8 and 9, Sonar 1, 3 and 4,,,, would it be wrong for me to pick up a copy of Sonar 2 XL in order to get the DR-008 and the plugs I don't have???


    What would stop you?

    loop

    #14
    harmony gardens
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/08 05:24:30 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: LoopJunkie

    ORIGINAL: harmony gardens

    I skipped Sonar 2, but I have Pro Audio 8 and 9, Sonar 1, 3 and 4,,,, would it be wrong for me to pick up a copy of Sonar 2 XL in order to get the DR-008 and the plugs I don't have???


    What would stop you?





    So Loop,,, are you saying it's easier to get forgiveness than permission??
    #15
    pharaoh
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/08 05:37:44 (permalink)
    I think it's clear that Cakewalk put a condition that you're not allowed to sell the product (which I think it's illigal requirement !!) but we agreed on it so it's illigal to buy this.
    but making your own backup copy i think it's legal as long as you won't distribute it to anybody.
    #16
    wvujazzman
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/08 07:53:55 (permalink)
    Actually, at least in the EULA for Office XP, Microsoft does allow installation on a desktop computer AND a portable notebook, as long as they're owned by the same person. Again, the theory is that the same person isn't using both systems at the same time.

    Eric
    #17
    Grehn
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/09 07:07:44 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: anton harris

    I keep every piece of Cakewalk software I buy because you can't BEAT their upgrade pricing!
    So do i and i also make a copy in case of damage to the original.Is that legal?


    Yes, you are allowed to make one copy for archival purposes.

    Cheers,
    Curt
    #18
    Grehn
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/09 07:10:37 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: Lona69

    Also....I have a laptop and a desktop...am I allowed to run copies on both?


    Nope! Paragraph 1 of the EULA states that you are allowed to install the software on ONE PC only and to contact them for a license for additional machines. It gives the phone number but I have no idea what the pricing is - I wouldn't expect it to be bad...


    Cheers,
    Curt
    #19
    Grehn
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/09 07:12:42 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: wvujazzman

    Actually, at least in the EULA for Office XP, Microsoft does allow installation on a desktop computer AND a portable notebook, as long as they're owned by the same person. Again, the theory is that the same person isn't using both systems at the same time.

    Eric


    That's Microsoft's agreement. Cakewalk doesn't allow it. Read your EULA!! It's not THAT long!!!

    Cheers,
    Curt
    #20
    Casaubon
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    RE: Is this legal? 2005/07/14 00:22:28 (permalink)
    Does any company post their EULA on their web site to be viewed before purchase?
    #21
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