Apparent audio engine problems in 4.0.3

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lightninrick
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2005/08/13 17:30:32 (permalink)

Apparent audio engine problems in 4.0.3

I'm running Sonar 4.0.3 PE -- the first patch for this release -- on a Dell 8350 with 512MB ram, lots of hard drive, Windows XP Home SP1. Soundcard is an Echo Mia. All drivers updated to current versions as of the installation of Sonar 4.0, about 18 months ago.

Sonar 4.0.2 ran fine. With 4.0.3 installed, audio on a not-particularly plugin-heavy piece with a couple of dozen audio tracks starts to stutter, and continues to stutter for minutes -- I can't stop it.

I reviewed the notes on the latest 4.0.3 release, and the most common symptom is not the one I have. I will try the new patch anyway. If that doesn't work, any advice appreciated. My last resort is to reload 4.0.2.

Thanks, lightninrick
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    glazfolk
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    RE: Apparent audio engine problems in 4.0.3 2005/08/13 17:57:08 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: lightninrick
    With 4.0.3 installed, audio on a not-particularly plugin-heavy piece with a couple of dozen audio tracks starts to stutter, and continues to stutter for minutes -- I can't stop it.


    Out of interest (well, a little more than just interest...) which plug in is it? Is it only one, or is there a pattern? Thanks.

    Geoff Francis - Huon Delta Studios

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    juca
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    RE: Apparent audio engine problems in 4.0.3 2005/08/13 18:06:22 (permalink)
    Hi:
    You can to make a try:
    1- with Sonar closed, to delete the Aud.ini and Ttsseq.ini files from the Sonar 4 folder;
    2- open Sonar and permit the Waveprofiler to run. After it stop, renew your used path for wavedata and picture folder and also other settings as I/O buffers etc;
    3- Close Sonar and run the VSTConfig routine;
    4- Open Sonar, load a problematic project and verify if the problemas was gone.
    I suggest this procedure because the audio engine and the VST wrapper was modified with the 4.0.3 update, so the INI files should to be modified also for to reflect the new parameters and default values. My initial problems when installing 4.0.3 was gone after I make what I´m suggesting for you.
    Please post the results here.
    Good luck!
    post edited by juca - 2005/08/13 18:14:26

    ****** Juca Nascimento ******
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    lightninrick
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    RE: Apparent audio engine problems in 4.0.3 2005/08/14 09:35:35 (permalink)
    I'v tried two different projects, both were "on the line" in terms of performance in 4.0.2, both produce that wierd stuttering failure that lasts and lasts in 4.0.3.

    One uses multiple instances of Ozone on tracks and buses in various configurations (mostly just EQ on the tracks), plus PSP Mixpressor, 2-3 instances of VST Little Duck, Sonitus FX compressors and EQ, various other VST plugs...

    The other is much more stripped-down, 1 instance each of Ozone (EQ only) and PSP mixpressor, a few Sonitus EQs, one instance of Little Duck, Dreamstation, etc.

    The thing is that these projects ran under 4.0.2, with one or two brief moments of instabiltiy in particular passages. Under 4.0.3, they produce dropouts that make a wierd stuttering noise that goes on for minutes at a time, during which the machine will not respond to any input at all.

    8/14/2005 - See my message below regarding the fix, which involved re-installing the drivers for my soundcard.

    Thanks, lightninrick

    post edited by lightninrick - 2005/08/14 10:22:14
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    lightninrick
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    RE: Apparent audio engine problems in 4.0.3 2005/08/14 10:11:19 (permalink)
    Thanks for the advice, will test as per your recommendations.

    Based on other comments in this forum, I re-installed 4.0.3, then removed and re-installed the driver for my soundcard (Echo Mia). Tested with the project that was blowing up, and it seems to run fine now. In fact, the projects seem at this point to run more smoothly under 4.0.3 than under 4.0.2. So this is progress.

    Thanks, Lightninrick
    post edited by lightninrick - 2005/08/14 10:23:24
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    lightninrick
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    RE: Apparent audio engine problems in 4.0.3 2005/08/14 11:56:04 (permalink)
    After re-installiing 4.0.3 and the soundcard, I followed Juca's instructions:
    "1- with Sonar closed, to delete the Aud.ini and Ttsseq.ini files from the Sonar 4 folder;
    2- open Sonar and permit the Waveprofiler to run. After it stop, renew your used path for wavedata and picture folder and also other settings as I/O buffers etc;
    3- Close Sonar and run the VSTConfig routine;
    4- Open Sonar, load a problematic project and verify if the problemas was gone. "

    This procedure made matters much worse, though I may not have executed it perfectly, of course. I ended up re-loading my 4.0.2 setup via Norton Ghost, re-installing 4.0.3, then re-installing the soundcard. At this point the system seems stable when tested with the two previous test projects, and performance is predictable. I haven't had a reoccurrence of the stuttering playback problem. The engine works fine until the CPU load is in the neighborhood of 80%, at which point dropouts begin. If I keep the CPU down around 70% usage, no problems, and I got one of the problem projects down from 80% CPU to 70% by archiving a few tracks that had plugins installed but not enabled.

    So in this case sound card re-installation was the most important fix.

    Will report on further developments if any.

    Thanks all, lightninrick
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    RTGraham
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    RE: Apparent audio engine problems in 4.0.3 2005/08/14 14:20:46 (permalink)
    I have noticed that the audio engine in 4.0.3 is "hard to kill" - if I try to play back a project at too low a latency, playback will st-t-t-t-t-t-t-u-u-u-u-t-t-t-t-e-e-e-r-r-r-r instead of just dropping out. It costs me a lot of time, waiting for playback to finally die, when a simple dropout would have allowed me to raise my latency.

    If this really isn't a processor-hungry project, perhaps try adjusting your I/O buffer settings (which affect disk buffer size) on the Advanced page in Audio Options. Doubling the value is a useful testing technique (if you're at the 128 default, try 256; if you're at 256, try 512, etc.). I haven't figured out the logic to it yet, but I have a couple of projects that force me to use a setting of 1024, but that setting causes problems in other projects. It might be related to which disk I'm streaming from.

    I don't know if this information will be much use, but maybe it'll get your brain gears moving in a direction that will point you to some solution you haven't tried yet.

    ~~~~~~~~~~
    Russell T. Graham
    Keys, Vocals, Songwriting, Production
    russell DOT graham AT rtgproductions DOT com
    www DOT myspace DOT com SLASH russelltgraham
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