Pads & chords

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cb8rwh
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2005/10/03 08:58:41 (permalink)

Pads & chords

ello,

when constructing a piece I normally have around 3-4 different pads and each pad plays all of thenotes in the particicular chord. I am starting to think that this is overkill and maybe muddies the sound and that it would be better for a pad to play only 1-2 notes of the particular chord.

What do you guys do in respect to this? How do you lot construct pads/chords?

cheers

rich
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9 Replies Related Threads

    wrench45us
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    RE: Pads & chords 2005/10/03 09:55:22 (permalink)
    a lot depends on how thin and transparent a pad is, how much one can layer things up in unison -- one can think of the sound as being one synth

    so sometimes I'll let two synths play the same chord, very rarely three (usually if 1 of the 3 has a very different ADSR)

    but usually, at the very least I'll dupe and edit the original chord to an inversion on the second synth. this is very simple with the pattern editor. you just take a set of notes at the top or bottom and move them to the opposite end -- bottom or top.
    you want to keep (something close to) your melody line on the upper end

    for the duped pad, it's often useful to discard notes or a whole line of notes to keep an open feel and let one pad sound through the other

    and usually one synth more than the other has a better 'working' range

    sometimes when I do these inversions I realize it's much better than what I originally played in.
    another great trick is to raise lift up the upper voice or maybe all voices of a string pad a full fifth
    it's reharmonizing the chord structure, but once you do it and hear it, it's pretty obviously a standard practice in popular music

    and what the heck I'll give all my tricks away

    pads will differ in their attack and sustain quality. As originally played you may want to stretch out some notes for a more sustained pad -- to carry a sound through where the other synth decays off. It can create a very nice effect, like pulling a curtain back to reveal what was there all the time. or edit the durations so this does happen.

    and with string pads/sustain pads it's often very effective to simplify the original chord structures to a few notes common to most of the progression. if the most common note can be held and raised to the top of that string/sustained pads range holds some tension

    all this gets even more interesting when one starts working with simple bass notes and what inversion gets played down deep and this whole reharmonization that can occur when one drops the bass note to a new root.
    ex. simple CEG in right hand, play C in bass root, the try with A in bass, then F, then B
    this allows a certain progression to proceed in the upper reaches and upon the inevitable repetition one can (judiciously) reharmonize the existing progression to add some color

    that's almost every trick I know on this subject


    post edited by wrench45us - 2005/10/03 10:06:23


     


    #2
    fac
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    RE: Pads & chords 2005/10/03 10:36:12 (permalink)
    One thing I like is having two or three pads playing basically the same chords but in different ways.

    For example, suppose you have a common chord sequence: C - G - F - Am

    The first pad plays those chords as close to each other so it stays in the same register always. Maybe the filter slowly opens and closes to add some movement.

    The second pad also plays the chords but always moving through different octaves, going from middle to high registers, then back, and so on.

    A third pad could have different functions: it could be used to emphasize a transition, for example, using it for the Am chord just before the song goes somewhere else. It can also be used to play long single notes that go along with the chords, maybe sixths or sevenths. Don't be afraid to use more complex harmonies.. you know, whatever sounds good to you.

    Like wrench says, pay attention to the sound of each pad. If you layer three low-pass filtered supersaw pads, it *will* sound muddy. My "first" pad is usually a dark, warm, LPF'ed sawtooth, but the second one may be band-passed PWM instead. One of them can be a bit static while the other is more rhythmic, I don't know.




    http://facproductions.net

    Lots of gear. Not enough time.
    #3
    cb8rwh
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    RE: Pads & chords 2005/10/03 12:53:22 (permalink)
    Thanks for the replies guys.

    Some great ideas to try out. I do use some of those - such as different inversions to keep chords in the same octave for one pad and maybe move the second pad around.

    I have, for the last 2 tunes i have made, started to have 1 pad which plays a pretty high octave range chordal progression (7th-8th) a have it very quiet in the mix - just to give try an dgive a brightness. I think I needed that as my pads have been too similar and they get muddy. I am definitely going to reduce the notes played by all the pads together - will give some much needed space.

    I have also started to try and mess with the adsr, to bring in some sounds later. Having just got cameleon is good in this respect as you can control the morphing of sounds - have only just started to play with cameleon but it looks awesome for pads!

    Thanks for the responses.

    rich
    #4
    triscuit
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    RE: Pads & chords 2005/10/03 13:52:28 (permalink)
    Great topic........I always have trouble getting my pads to sound right.

    For me the type of pad that I am using is dependent on the song. If I'm using very quick chord changes the pad will have to be pretty thin but still supporting everything in the song. I don't remember where I read this but some one said: if you took the pad out of the song it would sound like you are pulling the rug out from underneath it. I like this idea but sometimes the pad is just way too broad (spectrum wise). Especially it can muck up a good bass line. Sometimes I just go ahead and cut off the whole bottom of the spectrum just to make room for my bass line. This should be done is rare cases as usually you want the pad to breath with your bass line a little.
    Again when I'm doing very quick chord changes I try to make the pad very tight and not have too much delay or sustain as you don't want your chord changes running into each other. When I do a more swooshy ambient piece I relax that philosophy a little but not too much because you still don't want you chords to sound way too ran together.
    When I am doing a nice ambient piece I usually still only use 1 pad. I usually make it one big phatty pad though. Usually playing my bass line also. I guess I should probably get away from making the pad play the bass part but it sounds cool.
    Then once I have a big massive pad I might have another "pad" Doing filter sweeps. I like to make this a very high frequency tempered pad. Usually with some noise so you can get a nice glimmer shimmer when you do a filter sweep.
    Well I guess that’s really all I have to say about that topic. I'll be interested in what other people have to say.
    #5
    wrench45us
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    RE: Pads & chords 2005/10/03 21:17:03 (permalink)

    this is a great topic
    thanks everyone for sharing
    gives me ideas


     


    #6
    wrench45us
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    RE: Pads & chords 2005/10/05 18:38:18 (permalink)

    revival of topic
    given my recnt online research
    esp as regards drop 2 / open voicing


    http://www.outsideshore.com/primer/primer/ms-primer-6-1-1-4.html

    voicing for saxaphone, trumpet, trombone -- really it's relevant
    http://webpages.charter.net/dbristol4/tutorial/solisax.htm

    and
    http://www.saxontheweb.net/Coats/OrchSax2.html

    http://www.saxontheweb.net/Coats/OrchSax3.html
    note the comments on the harmonically rich saxaphone

    First, the saxophone is very rich in harmonics. In fact, the fundamental and first two overtones are all very nearly the same strength. When several of the larger saxophones are harmonized closely in their low register a muddy sound can result. The strong, rich harmonics clash and jumble together. So, I advise that when you harmonize a tenor and baritone sax in their low registers, to keep them at least a perfect fourth, or more, apart. However, close clustering of notes higher up can give a very homogenized effect.


     


    #7
    b rock
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    RE: Pads & chords 2005/10/05 20:07:57 (permalink)
    what the heck I'll give all my tricks away
    In that spirit, I'd like to offer some options that let your software do some of the heavy lifting:

    Limit Polyphony: Say you're playing in some four note chords, and you need to add some passing chords or voice leading to the phrasing. Set your polyphony limit to three notes, and let voice-stealing subtract from your bass line and add a new voice on top. It's the same thing with overlapping envelopes with a long release, or use of the sustain pedal.

    Start with the maximum number of simultaneous notes [ex. 8], and reduce the polyphony down in single increments. You'll get a surprisingly different "texture" characteristic with each setting. It also helps to thin down some complex chords, and works well with two combined pad synths. It's an interesting effect as both synths dance around chord positions as the voices are stolen and added back.

    Echoed Voices: Set this up: A single delay, no feedback, sync'ed to tempo and level-controlled by a slider or automation. You can overlap chord changes and bring in just a little flavor of the previous chord by fading in the single delay. It doesn't get too busy-sounding, and you can fade it in on only select transitions. Try it at 100% wet followed by a reverb for an overpowering effect.

    Layers of Scales: Load up your pad synth, and create a new layer. Enable MIDI Override for both layer and original track. In the layer, add a Transpose MFX instance, and set it to a complimentary scale [in Key/Scale] for your chord progression. In the Options menu, make sure that "MIDI Override Follows Current Track" is ticked.

    Arm both tracks, and start recording. By using the up & down Qwerty arrows while playing, you can shift between your played chord progression and a new phrasing created by the shifted layer in an alternate scale. Both track and layer create a pattern, which can later be combined by a Bounce To Track.

    This yields a lot of interesting variations, yet it remains separately editable until the Bounce. Of course, there's no reason to limit yourself to a single added layer. If you just want to shift by something simple, like fifths, skip the Transpose plugin and set the Transpose function in the layer's Track Inspector to +7 or -5.

    Oscillator Crossfades: It might be obvious, but I'll mention it anyway. If you're only using two of four oscillators, use those spares transposed to different intervals. Then set up the levels in MIDI Remote Controls to fade between each set with some adjacent controller sliders or similar. For example,bring in two oscillators on the Mod Wheel, and two come in transposed on the Pitchbend.

    No one likes to use multiple instances of the same synth if they don't have to; sometimes that's the only way to go. But in something like Dimension, the samples are only added once to memory. Take advantage of those unused Elements and reference that single wavsample. Set up intervals in the additional Elements, and selectively trigger the Elements or crossfade between them. There's hardly any hit on available resources.

    Great thread.
    #8
    wrench45us
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    RE: Pads & chords 2005/10/06 08:10:17 (permalink)

    golly,
    b-rock actually thinks like a 21st century electronic musician !!!

    now i feel so early 20th century

    one day after i discover drop 2 voicing i find there's a technical way to open things up by limiting polyphony and tweaking transposing

    these are great ideas that never would have occurred to me
    thanks


     


    #9
    b rock
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    RE: Pads & chords 2005/10/08 10:55:18 (permalink)
    i feel so early 20th century
    Nothing wrong with that. It was a period of extreme innovation. Considering the tool set available, even more so than today. I'd be happy to be locked in any time period that pushed the envelope. Man, I'd love to see what the software/computing explosion in music will bring in 2105. Thank God for reincarnation.

    Jan, I saved this link quite a while back with you in mind. I guess this is as appropriate a place as any to drop it in. It probably contains information less advanced than your explorations, and it's geared more to DJ work. But there are applications for the sample freaks among us. Someone might find this useful if they follow your lead and can't "find their way home".




    Glad you found those tech tips useful. That's how my brain works: it's been digitized.
    #10
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