thunderkyss
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Markers locked to SMPTE??
Is there any reason for the markers to lock to smpte?? I mean I can't lock anything else, or even snap to SMPTE, why the markers??
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DonM
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RE: Markers locked to SMPTE??
2005/11/20 19:34:26
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I just thought about this this week - here's my take - If you ever record a project and change the projects time settings (e.g. BPM) notice everything jumps around - at least the M:B:T and SMPTE resolve themselves and the markers will remain in linear time. That's my take on it - anyone else?
-D
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brucie
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RE: Markers locked to SMPTE??
2005/11/21 04:28:28
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The fact that you can't lock anything else to SMPTE is a big problem (for me!) with Sonar, and if you search the forum you will find out that it is a pretty big issue. Hopefully it is going to be resolved soon.
The problem arises when, for example, you are working with film. In a film, events occur always at the same time, eg a door slam or a car skid or even the start of a new cue. Lets a dorr slams exactly at 10:00:01:10 (ie one second in 10 frames into the film). You sit down and find the sound effect for the door and place it in the right place. YOu then look at the great music you have recorded, and the director says, "well it is a little fast, could you slow it down?"
So you change the tempo in Sonar, NOW nothing is locked to a location in time, so the music tempo slows down and that is great, but every sound effect, music cue moves to work with the new tempo as they are not locked to a position. So if we slow the music down by 1bpm, the clip may now be located at 10:00:01:01 which is 9 frames out
Okay you say well you just move the clip back! We yes, but I learnt the hard way and had a peice with all most 500 sfx's music cues and stings, which all moved! Yes there is control z, but what a PITA to sit an replace all that work!
This isn't so relevant in music production, although it is nice to be able to lock a clip anyway so that you can't move it or edit it. You can do this i pretty much everyother program, so I use Samplitude now to do my post production and music in Sonar.
Hope that helps
All the best
Neil
Neil S. Bruce Msc B.Eng(Hons) Dip(Mus) Sound Designer, Composer and Audio Engineer - Manchester Tel : +44 (0)7771 877690 Web : www.spencerbruce.com
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mcgooze
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RE: Markers locked to SMPTE??
2005/11/21 07:15:25
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☄ Helpfulby Steve_Karl 2016/03/11 05:10:09
ditto with everything brucie said!!! I get omf files from our video guys, so I can do a score. They have all the on camera audio put in place & synced to picture. Since I haven't started writing music for it yet, I don't know what tempo to start the project at. As soon as I change tempo, all those clips move around. The work around is to bounce each track of audio to a single clip, starting at the beginning of the project, but that's not ideal for a bunch of reasons. I really wish we could lock clips to SMPTE time!!!!!
To answer the original question, locking markers is primarily a tool for working with video. It's a way to set hit points that won't change when the project tempo changes.
regards,
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waltern
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RE: Markers locked to SMPTE??
2005/11/21 20:38:04
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I'm in agreement with all that's been said above. Locking markers, helps, but sadly, this is not a viable way to score to picture.
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mcgooze
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RE: Markers locked to SMPTE??
2005/11/21 20:46:02
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well, in fairness.... I score to picture all the time using only Sonar. The lack of ability to lock clips is a bad omission that needs to be addressed. However, the workaround I mentioned above is still less of a bummer than having to use multiple programs slaved together (perhaps even on multiple machines, yuck!) via timecode. Hate timecode, hate it, hate it, hate it!!!  greg
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thunderkyss
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RE: Markers locked to SMPTE??
2005/11/21 20:55:17
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ORIGINAL: mcgoo
To answer the original question, locking markers is primarily a tool for working with video. It's a way to set hit points that won't change when the project tempo changes.
regards,
So you change tempo, your hitpoits move, but your markers don't?? Still not seeing the point.
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mcgooze
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RE: Markers locked to SMPTE??
2005/11/21 21:05:34
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☄ Helpfulby Steve_Karl 2016/03/11 05:09:58
ok- say you're working on a 30 second TV spot. At the end of the spot, there's a logo animation that ends with a little starburst, and you want your music to hit the final downbeat on that starburst. You find the point in the visuals, drop a locked marker where it happens, and no matter what you do to the tempo, that marker is still where the starburst happens. Then drop a locked marker where you want to start your music. Play to the picture freehand to come up with a basic idea & then figure out your tempo. If you were playing at 120 bpm but you weren't quite hitting your target, you can adjust your tempo up or down to make it work... you can even use "fit to time" to accomplish this. It takes being creative and geeky at the same time, but it works. The problem we've been discussing is if the spot had voice over or on camera audio, all that audio got moved around while you were flipping tempo changes right & left. regards, greg
post edited by mcgoo - 2005/11/22 08:28:48
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T.S.
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RE: Markers locked to SMPTE??
2005/11/21 23:08:27
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ORIGINAL: thunderkyss
So you change tempo, your hitpoits move, but your markers don't?? Still not seeing the point.
Hehe thunderkyss, the whole point is that your "hit points" don't move and the locked markers are keyed to these hit points. Absolutely, we need to be able to lock clips. T.S.
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brucie
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RE: Markers locked to SMPTE??
2005/11/22 05:53:11
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So you change tempo, your hitpoits move, but your markers don't?? Still not seeing the point. No your hit points DON'T move .....when you change the tempo of the music, the picture does not change, you are not speeding up or slowing down the picture, just the music. Locked markers stay at the time location where the hit occurs. But if you have recorded a musical sting in your music, say a sax fall or a violin run to a cymbal crash, then these will no longer be in the right place once you change the tempo. See my example above. If you need any more help, just give us a shout. All the best Neil
Neil S. Bruce Msc B.Eng(Hons) Dip(Mus) Sound Designer, Composer and Audio Engineer - Manchester Tel : +44 (0)7771 877690 Web : www.spencerbruce.com
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djoni
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RE: Markers locked to SMPTE??
2005/11/24 00:12:52
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☄ Helpfulby Steve_Karl 2016/03/11 05:09:38
I also need sonar to lock events to time. It is very important if you work with video/film. Until then, sonar cannot be categorized as a music software for film
Ekaya Productions
Sonar Platinum, Intel - 6 Core i7 overclocked 4.5GHz with HT 12meg cache w/ 32GB RAM, UAD-2 QUAD & OCTO, Tascam DM-4800, 1xMackie CU & 2xExtenders...
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tarsier
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RE: Markers locked to SMPTE??
2005/11/24 10:49:41
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ORIGINAL: djoni
I also need sonar to lock events to time. It is very important if you work with video/film. Until then, sonar cannot be categorized as a music software for film
 Oh, it can be categorized as music software for film... just not sfx/dialog/editing software for film! Yes, please Cakewalk let us lock events to time!
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Infinite5ths
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RE: Markers locked to SMPTE??
2006/05/11 17:13:00
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I missed this thread about lock to SMPTE too. I also need this feature.
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