Not Having Much Luck With Step Gens

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Rick McNab
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2006/07/04 23:29:09 (permalink)

Not Having Much Luck With Step Gens

Kind of frustrating. I just want to do a basic house/trance type arpeggiated bass line in octaves using the step gens. I'm using the "101 Square Sub Bass" preset. Should I use the pitch step gen or the amp step gen or both, and how do I go about it. Thanks!

Also, how does the sync function work and what is it for? I just want to do a simple 16th note pattern over 1 bar. I guess that's 16 steps per bar or something. It seems like the sync function multiplies or divides against the set tempo. I can't figure it out at all.

Thanks again!
post edited by Rick McNab - 2006/07/04 23:40:59
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8 Replies Related Threads

    lawapa
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    RE: Not Having Much Luck With Step Gens 2006/07/04 23:54:42 (permalink)
    Rclick in the pitch step gens and set to jump to 12, if that is not and octive check depth. Sync sets how fast a pattern will play with the tempo. set to 1 and it should do what you want. but you can speed it up slow it down and it's still with the tempo.
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    awilki01
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    RE: Not Having Much Luck With Step Gens 2006/07/05 00:11:48 (permalink)
    Use Rapture as an instrument. If you want to make an arpeggiated bass line, use your host program. I use the piano roll view in Sonar personally.

    If you are trying an arpeggiated pattern in the step gen, I would recommend you keep the steps at octave intervals. If you try to do non-octave based arps, then what sounds good in one scale e.g. major, may sound horrible in a minor scale (due to the varying half steps in each scale. If you write an instrument for one song and it sounds good, go for it. Just remember, it may sound bad if you change scales. Keeping it at full octave intervals is safe.

    I have had limited success with creating full arps in Rapture - although it can be done. I just like doing it in my host program. I find it easier and it gives me the option to try the sound out on varying instruments - other than Rapture.


    Here is a bass line I created using Rapture, but the host is really responsible for the varying notes. Is this the kind of thing you are looking for? I used the Rapture bass preset called 'Heavy Stepper' and just added a ping delay on it.

    Here is the MP3:
    Migrating Bass Line.mp3

    Just listen to the bass. I know the kick stinks

    Adam
    post edited by awilki01 - 2006/07/05 00:27:52
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    Rick McNab
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    RE: Not Having Much Luck With Step Gens 2006/07/05 06:07:06 (permalink)
    Thanks for the replies, guys. I don't think the kick stinks. That is what I'm trying to do, and many variations thereof. I thought Rapture's step gens were sort of like built-in arpeggiators. I guess I still need a "proper" arpeggiator. Once again P5 comes on my radar screen. I will check the stepgen tutorials available so far.
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    Rick McNab
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    RE: Not Having Much Luck With Step Gens 2006/07/05 06:51:37 (permalink)
    Update: Located B Rock's step gen tutorial on P5 wiki. Using MIDI note entry is a big help. Getting comfortable with the sync function and the range function. I tried using a lead sound and just programming in some scales to see how it works. A couple of observations:

    1) Each time you play a note the step gen does not start from the beginning. Maybe there is a way to active this function.

    2) What I am looking to do (at least for now) is step sequencing and/or arpeggiation, not moving the pitch of a struck and held note over a range of values. I think I am trying to hammer a nail in with a screwdriver. Immediately apparent is that I want to adjust note durations. But there is only one note. If you adjust it's duration down, using the EG Amp, you won't hear much of the step sequence.

    So the moral of the story is: I need a proper arpeggiator/step sequencer to mess around with, and, I need to learn what Rapture's step generators are designed to do.

    You guys will get tired of hearing me say this, but we really need an organized course for learning Rapture, complete with many sound creation projects. This trial and error thing, searching through forum posts and trying to remember which tutorial was posted where is really not getting it for me. It's very time-inefficient. I was in to that when I got my DX-7 back in 1984 - just sitting around trying to figure out what every parameter did. But even that, which was a quantum leap in complication for the average musician, had a programming book that interested parties could purchase. I still have it: Yamaha DX-7 by Yashuhiko Fukuda

    With Rapture, we have this really powerful synth that requires mostly trial and error and digging through forum posts and wikis in order to learn it. That is not a scholarly or professional way to go about acquiring a new skill. That is fact, not opinion. It can be proven.

    The problem with forum posts digging is that to get to the meat, sometimes you have to sift through countless replies. By the time you've done that, you either forgot the original information, or got so sidetracked you lost focus on what it was you were trying to learn. Searching through forum posts is not the best way to learn, IMO. Unless you are the one asking the question, and even then, by the time the replies start coming in, you again lose focus.

    One last time: WE NEED A TEXTBOOK!
    post edited by Rick McNab - 2006/07/05 07:05:10
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    b rock
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    RE: Not Having Much Luck With Step Gens 2006/07/05 10:17:49 (permalink)
    Getting comfortable with the sync function and the range function.
    Think of the Sync setting as fractions or a multiplier of a beat, as defined by your host application. It's locked to the BPM setting there. Assuming a 4/4 key signature in the host, the default Sync setting of 4 equates to four quarter note beats, or one measure. This defines the overall 'container' size of the StepGen.

    The Step setting defines the number of divisions the StepGen will chop this overall 'size' into. In this case, you have a measure, and a (default) Step count of 16. Sixteen 16th notes add up to one measure. Up the Sync setting to 16 (beats), and the proportion has changed. You now have 4 measures of beats at 4/4, so a Step count of sixteen covers more territory. In a relative sense to the host app, the 16 steps become quarter-notes. To maintain a sixteenth-note relationship, the Steps need to be increased to 64 (four measures contain 64 sixteenth notes).
    Each time you play a note the step gen does not start from the beginning.
    Click both mouse buttons on the Sync function to set it to Off. The Freq setting takes over, and removes strict Sync'ing to the host tempo. Instead, the cycle is triggered by each MIDI Note On encountered; either "live" from your controller, or as placed in the host app. The exception here seems to be the Global L&R StepGens, which appear to remain locked in a relative proportion to the host.

    But "speed" of the StepGen is determined by the Freq setting, in Hertz (one Hz. = one cycle per second). If you're no longer concerned with Sync to tempo, this locks the StepGen to a specific Freq. If you are, then you have to do the math, and trigger your StepGens with MIDI Notes exactly on the beat. If we use the 'Sync' example above, there were 16 Steps (sixteenth notes) within a measure of 4/4 (Sync = 4).

    In a host BPM environment of 120 BPM, that's 120 quarter note beats in a minute's time. Every second contains two beats; one beat will take 1/2 second to complete (500 milliseconds). Now we translate that to Hertz (cycles per second), and make one StepGen cycle take a Freq of 0.50 (seconds) to complete. Result? Four cycles of the StepGen at .50 Freq equates to four beats of Sync at 120 BPM.
    What I am looking to do (at least for now) is step sequencing and/or arpeggiation
    This isn't it. 'Note durations' can be adjusted by using the Amp StepGen in conjunction with your Pitch StepGen "pattern", but it'll always be within the the parameters of a MIDI Note. And that overriding behavior is sculpted in the Amp EG. The longer the AMP EG envelope is (in terms of overall evolution), the longer the time that a Pitch StepGen will be heard. For step-sequencing or arpeggiation in the traditional sense, you're better off using a tool geared toward that (P5, as one example).
    Using MIDI note entry is a big help.
    It's the easiest way to get data in, especially for absolute accuracy in longer sequences. I'll go into this more later, but MIDI Note Entry is also a precise way of bringing in filter sweeps, volume changes, and other 'shapes' demanding accuracy. The key is to consider note values as simply 25 vertical level increments, and to vary those levels' value results with a StepGen's Depth control.

    For Note Entry, first have in mind the final results that you're after. The possible input notes range from middle C to two octaves above that [C5 - C7 in default Sonar/Project5 terms]. Anything under C5 acts as a 'backspace' for correction purposes. If you want to align that with Rapture for programming ease, set the StepGen Depth to 2400. An entered note now plays back at the same 'pitch' as entered.

    If your final sequence is to travel only one octave (Depth=1200 cents), you have to think of the 'level values' differently. Now a C5 entry will be the 'base note', C7 will be an octave above that, and C6 (in the middle) will translate to a tritone (enharmonically an augmented fourth or diminished fifth). At the default 4800 cents, octaves in the results are at C5 (base), G#5, C6, G#6, and C7 in the MIDI Note Entry scheme.

    If you're using .mid or .ptn files to construct MIDI Note Entry sequences (recommended), the actual note length of the pattern input doesn't matter. Rapture is looking for Note heights (levels), and advances to the next Step when it receives another Note On message. For ease of use, set your Snap To in your host app to any readable increment (like a quarter note). Set the end of file limit to the number of Steps you want to enter.

    One example: A 64-Step Pitch StepGen spanning one octave of final output. Set your host app's Snap to 1/4 note, and it'll take 16 measures to complete the sequence entry. Too long for one screen? Set the Snap to 16th note, and now only four measures [1/16th of 64 Steps] cover the sequence. No more; no less. There's horizontal covered. Vertically, confine yourself between middle C and the octave above it, yet leave the StepGen's Depth at 2400 cents. Set it to 1200 cents, and the 25 (C5-C7) levels will become 'quarter-tones' of apparent pitch in the results.

    If you decide later on to change the proportion (by adjusting the Depth control), there's some easy ways to adapt the sequence. Right-click in the StepGen, and select a Snap-To increment in that. With Snap to 24, and a Depth of 2400 cents, each click will be a semitone (100 cents). With a Depth of 1200 cents, a Snap-To of 12 will yield a semitone. Press "P" on the Qwerty for a boost in getting Step values to a logical level.

    Snap-To 10 helps in Modulators that use percentage, like the Amp EG. But here's a trick for easily getting rests to accompany your Pitch StepGen sequence. Make both StepGens identical in terms of Status, Steps, and Sync (or Freq); either manually, or with right-click/Copy & Paste Step Generator. Raise the Amp StepGen Depth to 100%. Raise all of the individual Step levels to maximum; either by mouse-drawing, or using the Qwerty Up Arrow.

    Now the 'note' sequence will playback exactly as before, with or without the Amp Stepgen. Near the bottom of the display, click on only those Steps where you want a rest to occur. The Step will snap to the bottom. After success here, you can start to explore 'decays' and 'attacks' in the Amp StepGen. You do this by leading into and trailing away from 'note centers' with incremental Step levels.

    Edit: Somehow, I slipped a digit.
    post edited by b rock - 2006/07/05 10:33:42
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    awilki01
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    RE: Not Having Much Luck With Step Gens 2006/07/05 10:20:35 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: Rick McNab

    Thanks for the replies, guys. I don't think the kick stinks. That is what I'm trying to do, and many variations thereof. I thought Rapture's step gens were sort of like built-in arpeggiators. I guess I still need a "proper" arpeggiator. Once again P5 comes on my radar screen. I will check the stepgen tutorials available so far.


    I was an endless search for an arpeggiator plugin as well. And, I too thought Rapture would be a good arpeggiator, but through trial and error, I'm convinced it is not. It is a great instrument for arps though - when the arps are played through your host.

    I asked the guys over at TranceAddict.com what they use thinking that I would get a response indicating a cool VST plugin that did it for me. I was wrong. They just create the arps themselves.

    That's what I'm going to start doing. I'm going to just start using the piano roll in Sonar to create my own. I've had success so far. It's really easy. Arps are just variations of chords whereby each note is played one at a time. I know there are some really difficult arps out there that play several notes at once, but I'm not too concerned about that right now.

    It's funny. You are where I was a couple months ago when I was searching for the same thing....
    #7
    b rock
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    RE: Not Having Much Luck With Step Gens 2006/07/05 10:38:10 (permalink)
    I was an endless search for an arpeggiator plugin as well.

    VST: ERA Step Sequencer
    MFX: Rhythmic Controller (bundled in Frank's MIDI FX)
    Related, but Donationware: KarmaFX
    Commercial, Unrelated, but Cool: SFX Machine Pro
    #8
    Rick McNab
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    RE: Not Having Much Luck With Step Gens 2006/07/05 18:30:59 (permalink)
    B, MUCHO thanks for the detailed instruction. That should go on the wiki for sure. I will try that tonight.

    David - I've been thinking about what you said - creating "arps" on your own. They are really just melodic sequences. I have Sonar 4 Home Studio XL. I should be able to do it on that. I fancy P5, but really don't want to put out the dough right now. Anyway this will give me a chance to explore the step editing and piano roll method of note input with Sonar 4.

    Truthfully I am not enjoying Sonar 4 at all. Everything just seems so hard and counter-intuitive. I just want to fire up and start recording. There is so much to assign with Sonar. I know you can set up templates and the like.

    But the bottom line is I own it, so I may as well learn how to use it.
    #9
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