Mono Panning

Author
Dave King
Max Output Level: -46.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 2862
  • Joined: 2005/11/13 14:19:48
  • Location: Connecticut, USA
  • Status: offline
2006/10/04 00:24:05 (permalink)

Mono Panning

In the Mixing Engineers Handbook, the author discusses monitoring mixes in mono to listen for phasing and balance.

Mixing Engineer, Don Smith says, "I check my panning in mono... If I want to find a place for the hi-hat for instance, sometimes I'll go to mono and pan it around and you'll find that it's really present all of a sudden, and that's the spot."

How would you do this in SONAR? Send everything to the Master Buss and set its pan to mono and then tweak the pans on the individual tracks?

Is anyone here doing this?

Dave King
www.davekingmusic.com

SONAR X2 Producer 64-Bit 
StudioCat PC
Windows 7 Home Premium, Service Pack 1 
Intel Corel i5 3450 CPU @3.10 GHz 
RAM 8 GB
M-Audio Delta 44

M-Audio MidiSport 2x2
 
#1

9 Replies Related Threads

    Slugbaby
    Max Output Level: -33.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 4172
    • Joined: 2004/10/01 13:57:37
    • Location: Toronto, Canada
    • Status: offline
    RE: Mono Panning 2006/10/04 08:18:58 (permalink)
    I think you'd mix everything in stereo, and then set the Master Buss to Mono. Then just slightly adjust the levels so that it sounds right in Mono.
    Then switch the Master back to stereo, and make sure it still sounds good.
    Then repeat until the mix works in mono and in stereo.

    That's what I try to do anyway...

    http://www.MattSwiftMusic.com
     
    Dell i5, 16Gb RAM, Focusrite 2i2 IO, Telecasters, P-bases, Personal Drama for a muse.
    #2
    deiseldave
    Max Output Level: -86 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 225
    • Joined: 2004/05/20 10:57:14
    • Status: offline
    RE: Mono Panning 2006/10/04 09:08:35 (permalink)
    I read that book and, taken in context, interperpreted that section as:
    1)route all tracks to master bus set to mono
    2)establish relative channel gains prior to any panning
    3)pan tracks to the places that they gain clarity (in mono)
    4)re-adjust track gains if neccesary as needed
    5)change master to stereo, and begin applying effects
    6)check mono often

    That said, I like to do it more like Slugbaby said (which is not all that different). Because, I like to place my tracks on an imaginary stage, develop positions, effects, and depth, and then adjust to make them work in mono.
    #3
    Slugbaby
    Max Output Level: -33.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 4172
    • Joined: 2004/10/01 13:57:37
    • Location: Toronto, Canada
    • Status: offline
    RE: Mono Panning 2006/10/04 09:28:18 (permalink)
    I think most people listen in a stereo setting, rather than one speaker. So it would be more important that the stereo mix sounds best, and just checking the mono to make sure there are no prominent issues, IMHO.
    I don't think I've ever heard of anyone adjusting the panning while listening to a mono mix...
    post edited by Slugbaby - 2006/10/04 09:42:39

    http://www.MattSwiftMusic.com
     
    Dell i5, 16Gb RAM, Focusrite 2i2 IO, Telecasters, P-bases, Personal Drama for a muse.
    #4
    DonnyAir
    Max Output Level: -66 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 1201
    • Joined: 2004/12/18 16:37:31
    • Location: Akron, Ohio
    • Status: offline
    RE: Mono Panning 2006/10/04 10:59:22 (permalink)
    3)pan tracks to the places that they gain clarity (in mono)


    But, Dave, if you are monitoring in mono, then panning won't do a thing until you switch back to a stereo reference.
    Monitoring in mono means that you are summing the stereo buss(es) into one output. Everything tracked comes out of both speakers, with no panning separation.


    Hmmmm I'm not getting this either.


    I understand the advantages to switching to a mono reference, I used to do it all the time, especially when checking for phase issues... drums were often a culprit because generally there were so many mics in one given area...
    Checking a mix in mono was also used for "compatibility", although these days that's become less crucial because so many people have stereo TV's, radios, CD players, etc.

    But I'm not getting how you would monitor in mono and be able to hear any movement whatsoever.

    Solo- in -place, or "SIP", would allow you this luxury, but SIP is a stereo monitor mode, not a mono one.

    Unless... ding ding ding!!... (the light just went on).... he is placing his hi hat track at center detente and then panning it, while referencing in stereo, to a spot in the spectrum that he likes.


    Is my bet.

    FWIW

    http://www.donnythompson.com
    #5
    rbowser
    Max Output Level: -10 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 6518
    • Joined: 2005/07/31 14:32:34
    • Status: offline
    RE: Mono Panning 2006/10/04 15:27:14 (permalink)
    I'll admit that I've always blithely ignored that expert advice to check your mixes in Mono, even though the reasoning always sounded convincing enough. Maybe I'm just lazy.

    But, when Donny asked just now, "...if you are monitoring in mono, then panning won't do a thing until you switch back to a stereo reference..."--I understand the confusion there, but the point is that in Mono, as you move a track around in the stereo field, even though you won't be hearing the results of the panning, you Will hear the results of phasing and signal cancellation. There will be sweet spots where a given instrument or track is going to pop out more, other positions where it's going to be masked, depending on the pan setting. That's the idea.

    Randy
    rbowser

    Sonar X3e Studio
    Roland A-800 MIDI keyboard controller
    Alesis i|O2 interface
    Gigabyte Technology-AMD Phenom II @ 3 GHz
    8 Gb RAM 6 Core Windows 7 Home Premium x64
    with dual monitors
    #6
    Dave King
    Max Output Level: -46.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 2862
    • Joined: 2005/11/13 14:19:48
    • Location: Connecticut, USA
    • Status: offline
    RE: Mono Panning 2006/10/04 17:09:26 (permalink)
    Yes, Randy's got it right. He's saying pretty much the same thing as explained in the book.

    Now that I think I know how to do it, I'll give it a whirl on my next mix.

    Thanks!

    Dave King
    www.davekingmusic.com

    SONAR X2 Producer 64-Bit 
    StudioCat PC
    Windows 7 Home Premium, Service Pack 1 
    Intel Corel i5 3450 CPU @3.10 GHz 
    RAM 8 GB
    M-Audio Delta 44

    M-Audio MidiSport 2x2
     
    #7
    deiseldave
    Max Output Level: -86 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 225
    • Joined: 2004/05/20 10:57:14
    • Status: offline
    RE: Mono Panning 2006/10/04 20:00:32 (permalink)
    But, Dave, if you are monitoring in mono, then panning won't do a thing until you switch back to a stereo reference.
    Monitoring in mono means that you are summing the stereo buss(es) into one output. Everything tracked comes out of both speakers, with no panning separation.


    What Randy said. At least that's what the book referenced talks about. I personally haven't been able to hear a substantial difference (panning in mono), which is why I mix in the fashion that Slugbaby described.
    #8
    gullfo
    Max Output Level: -86 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 232
    • Joined: 2004/10/15 01:48:08
    • Location: Old Tappan, NJ
    • Status: offline
    RE: Mono Panning 2006/10/06 17:39:14 (permalink)
    one thing I see repeatedly in books and posts is using a single speaker to monitor in mono as the "ghost" image from stereo speakers running on a mono input is not the same thing... I have a spare JBL Control 1 monitor I use for this purpose as it has a range similar to my main monitors so the quality is relatively good but its pure mono... it mostly eliminates position and room influences as well since it is a true single source... as Randy pointed out, the mono panning does alter the relationship of the mix and I prefer to do this instead of eq'ing if possible.
    post edited by gullfo - 2006/10/06 17:55:10


    Glenn 
    www.runnel.com


    #9
    vexx
    Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 24
    • Joined: 2006/10/06 19:23:57
    • Status: offline
    RE: Mono Panning 2006/10/08 20:59:42 (permalink)
    Always, always check your mixes in MONO.

    Most mixers (hardware & software) can switch the master outputs to Mono. In a nutshell if there's something wrong you'll hear parts disappear. A good example of this is using spacial enhancment processing..if used wrong it'll be like witnessing a magic trick when switched to Mono.
    #10
    Jump to:
    © 2024 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1