RobertB
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Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
When I was in high school and college, my dad and I used to go fishing a lot. Buchanan Creek feeds the headwaters of the Colorado River, high in the Colorado Rockies. This was one of our favorite spots. This is my first attempt at recording acoustic guitar, and any suggestions are welcome. There is no drum track because the guitar track is fairly percussive and drums seemed redundant. I am open to suggestion there as well. Fishing Buchanan Creek
post edited by RobertB - 2006/11/25 19:16:15
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fep
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/25 19:06:17
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Real nice Robert, I think you caught that outdoors woodsy feel real well. I'm seeing the creek, it's Colorado in Sept., the colors are changing, what's that... an elks trumpet in the background.
This stands well on it's own. But I think string bass, mandolin, some melody might be worth a try. I can here a David Grissman style treatment here with a ripping Tony Rice Guitar solo.
Good job.
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RobertB
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/25 19:22:43
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fep,
Thanks for the listen. We didn't see to many elk, but I flushed a bunch of whitetail, and ran across a bear once. 20 ft is way too close!
I'm thinking of working my dulcimer into this one. Thanks for the ideas.
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Drumz
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/25 19:32:48
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Hey Robert, good song. The acoustic guitar sounds really good, you are a talented player. I agree that the song works without drums but I think more strings in the background would work well. Like a small ensemble of orchestral strings, maybe even a horn. It sounds good like it is but could sound fuller with some accompaniment. Anyway, good job.
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mewsician2
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/25 19:37:54
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This certainly works well as it is, and I can also hear it with more accompaniment.
Sometimes it's hard to know where to stop adding instruments, but this very nice, and could certainly benefit from some variation as the song progresses.
Enjoyable, thanks.
Regards,
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chasekh
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/25 20:40:05
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Hi Robert,Very pleasant way of scratching the guitar.Changing of chords are very smooth.Sounds like effortless playing.Very good.
R.Chandrasekhar
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Sen
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/25 20:45:47
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Nice work. I would love to hear the next verion with added instruments.
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RobertB
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/25 21:13:12
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Thank you all,
Drumz, a horn..Hmmm, that's got potential.
Stephen, nice to hear from you. I've got several Foster tunes in my 5-star list. I agree, a few more instruments are in order, but you don't want to overdo it.
Chase, funny you should say that. I tried desperately to make this work in 4/4 time, but when I stopped working and let my fingers do what they wanted to do, it fell into place.
Sen, always good to hear from you. I've gotten some good suggestions here, so we'll see how the next version sounds.
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holderofthehorns
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/25 22:13:30
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Hey Robert, Would you like me to send you a "grit-eating" Mando track to match your MP3? My Upright bass is on loan until Dec-15 or I would offer that, too. I think it would be great fun to collab on a song like this long distance. (You can always throw away my track.)
post edited by holderofthehorns - 2006/11/25 22:31:37
Eric Anderson HolderOfTheHorns - It's a Viking thing.
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RobertB
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/25 22:19:22
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I'm up for it.
Send an e-mail attachment when you're ready.
I'm seeing more and more of this going on. I think it's great.
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holderofthehorns
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/25 22:30:43
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Sounds like fun.
How can I email you?
Maybe you could send me your address to holderofthehorns at Yahoo dot com. I'll keep your address private.
Eric Anderson HolderOfTheHorns - It's a Viking thing.
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RobertB
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/25 22:40:57
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I'll do that. I forgot, you can send e-mail from the forum, but you can't attach files.
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Tombo
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/25 22:58:52
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Hi Robert, Hmmm...nice piece. I like the theme and the feel. I have a few thoughts, but these are born of MY PREFERENCES only...if you listen to my stuff, you will hear from where the bias comes from... 
- Seems to me that in a piece like this, you could go for a BIGGER, more detailed guitar sound. Considering the decent (but not huge) stereo field that you are showing, the guitar sounds surprisingly small. Did you use two mics, or did you try to simulate stereo?
- Try some delay...a TOUCH...and IMHO, you need more bass!!! The guitar sounds like a dulicmer sometimes! What kind of guitar is it?
- You might benefit from some sort of vintage compression, playing with attack and release times so that the compressor keeps pace with the strum rhythm, by not closing off the release too soon, or opening up the attack to late.
- Not sure on the mic/pre you used, but the mids are a little muddy...how many mics did you use? If you used a stereo pair, I would check the wave forms for phase alignment (you can do this right in Sonar's project window).
- The mix could be a TOUCH louder... you don't have to use a limiter, but you are hitting barely -20 RMS in the R channel and less on the left. Just push up the faders a bit, or adjust your compression...if you get a few clips, so what? Most ears will tolerate a few clips. The low RMS is fine if the guitar is in a big mix (it's fine period, if you are just going to do a single, but what if this is on your CD next to a couple of full band pieces???), but for a near solo piece like this that has this happy feel and great strum, I think it could be louder.
All this offered as helpful feedback. Again, if you don't like MY guitar sound (which does vary from mix to mix), please disregard. Best, Mark Edited to correct some dumb mistakes and to clarify...
post edited by Tombo - 2006/11/25 23:21:15
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RobertB
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/25 23:16:55
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Thanks Tombo, That's what I think I was looking for. No compressors on this one, yet, but the volume is a bit low. I have only one mic. I experimented with nudging cloned tracks a few ms ahead and behind the base track, and I may have induced some phasing. I'll have a look at that. Also, it only goes 40% left on the pan. First time out the gate with recording an acoustic, and like everybody says, it's tricky. I'll definitely try your suggestions. Thanks again. btw, it's a Simon&Patrick. It actually does have a much fuller sound than I captured.
post edited by RobertB - 2006/11/25 23:40:21
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kennywtelejazz
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/26 01:38:00
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Robert, You got an acoustic guitar...... all right. I think your off to a good start with this, some nice struming and chord changes going on here. Has a bit of a Zep vibe...to it at times Do I hear a subtle synth pad underneath from time to time? if so tastefully done I like it .....if this was mine ....what I would do is make a copy of the project and do a little experimenting with some of the sections in the copy... This style of playing has a lot of built in themes and dynamic possibilitys in a few sections I can hear the tastefull introduction of some Rock Style dynamics and some more git and bass also possibly some fiddle or electric crunch... nothing overpowering of course...LOL Of course as some including your self has said that there are some things to try to do to improve what is already there... I donno ... learning by doing is a sure path to improvement...in most things... Playing an acoustic performance and recording it like you have can be fun and scary... The Nakedness of it all........I'm happy you decided to do this song... I havn't seen Buchanan Creek.....but what you said about one of mine in the past Hey Y... this has that type of energy that is held back waiting to explode........ congrats...to you .... Kenny
post edited by kennywtelejazz - 2006/11/26 01:56:57
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rbowser
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/26 11:38:21
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RobertB--Finally catching up with your post here. Nice! You're sitting at the edge of the water, in a nature trance as you wind out the steady 3/4 and become part of your surroundings.
It's great that some of your fellow guitarists have given you so much feedback on this thread. I bet some of the advice will be helpful.
Your first time for recording acoustic guitar? Wow--Impressive. What you've done with the EQ and/or miking definitely is emphasizing the aggressive twang, either by design or by happenstance.
The pads you have way under the guitar are suggesting some directions an arrangement could go in. The idea of a string ensemble seems like a very good one to me--And it'll be fun for you to see what Eric "Holder Of The Horns" comes up with.
Great!
Randy
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airmeki
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/26 13:52:06
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Hey Bob - let me tell you how much I enjoyed listening to your guitar skills! It shows how much experience and practizing you must have had with this guitar already!
And, the other thing that strikes me is the contrast from this song to the other songs you've got on your songs page. That just shows your versatility and talent!
I totally agree: You caught the outdoors with this tune!
Good luck on your collab and thanks for sharing this gem.
Heinz.
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RobertB
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/26 19:24:29
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Hi Kenny, Yeah, I'm lovin' this guitar. When I got it, I spent several hours in the acoustic room at Musicians Superstore. The guy there kept checking on me, but after a while, he realized I was on a mission, and let me do my thing. They are a god bunch there, its really cool to go in and be greeted by your name. Glad you liked the pad. I thought it brought in that sunlight dancing on the water feel. That's the Soft Piano Pad-Light from Plugsound Free. I have to agree with your statement on recording acoustic. Not much to hide behind. And there is that certain intimacy to it. I like listening to Hey Y.. from time to time. I like that restrained energy. The mountain streams have that same energy, and I'm glad that came through. Randy, Glad you stopped by. Getting that aggressive twang was intentional, but I'm sure a certain amount of dumb luck helped. Btw, this is the song that inspired the PM. Some kind of string action sounds very appealing. Yes, I am looking forward to working with Eric. Heinz, You make me feel pretty good. I've played this guitar for a few months now, and it feels like a favorite sweater. I've been playing a long time, but guys like Kenny, Mark, and Stephen have really inspired me to get with the program. Thanks everybody, for your suggestions and encouragement.
post edited by RobertB - 2006/11/26 19:58:52
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jamesg1213
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/27 11:38:49
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Hello Bob,
I was pleased to see a new track from you, and I wasn't disappointed. I liked that a lot, sounded intimate and heartfelt. The synth washes were nice, just adding a touch of sparkle here and there. Whether you add more instruments or not is your call, but I having heard your dulcimer I would say that'd be a good partner to the acoustic.
Thanks very much, enjoyed it greatly.
James
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mcourter
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/27 14:22:18
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Bob, very nice tune. The advice of others makes any from me superfluous. I like the spare sound. If it were my song, I wouldn't work bass and drums in until after the first verse. I agree a melody is needed, but you have good material to work with.
Mark
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RobertB
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/27 21:23:04
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sounded intimate and heartfelt Thank you, James. Those were good times, and I miss him something fierce sometimes. I want to add something to this, but I don't want to lose the feel of it. My biggest concern is that it might get too busy. Mark, thank you as well. I'm glad you like the spare sound. I have been working with the advice given earlier to fatten up the guitar, and it's coming along nicely. I suppose this is the hard part, just like with a watercolor, knowing when to put the brush down. ps. James, on the subject of heartfelt songs, Brave Boy looks like a go for the Spring concert!
post edited by RobertB - 2006/11/27 21:45:52
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RobertB
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/11/29 21:29:37
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Tombo(Mark),
I've been playing with your suggestions. Also using the NyquistEQ. The midrange is getting much more defined, and the guitar is sounding larger. Thanks again for your input.
Btw, mic is a Samson S12(dynamic) and pre's are in a Yamaha MG10/2 mixer. I'm still trying to find the sweet spot for the EQ's on the mixer for the guitar.
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holderofthehorns
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RE: Fishing Buchanan Creek,acoustic draught
2006/12/01 23:40:22
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Robert,
Check your email. I sent you a link to download the tracks I did.
Hope they fit for you.
Eric Anderson HolderOfTheHorns - It's a Viking thing.
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