Freezing tracks in S5

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Erik Putrycz
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2005/09/15 23:00:14 (permalink)

Freezing tracks in S5

I was wondering if there was any improvement in the freeze function... especially if it would use 32bit files instead of 24... which could prevent some unexpected clipping

Erik.

www.ens-music.com
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    DonM
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    RE: Freezing tracks in S5 2005/09/16 22:51:44 (permalink)
    Erik:
    I noticed no replies to your post - what is 'Unexpected Clipping" besides the obvious?

    -D

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    #2
    Erik Putrycz
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    RE: Freezing tracks in S5 2005/09/16 23:07:30 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: DonM

    Erik:
    I noticed no replies to your post - what is 'Unexpected Clipping" besides the obvious?



    Well if the output of one of your plugin is clipping but you set a low output level on the track then you won't hear any clipping. But if you freeze the track, the frozen track will be clipping and you'll hear it. This wouldn't happen if the freezing was done in 32 bits.

    Erik
    post edited by Erik Putrycz - 2005/09/16 23:14:50
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    DonM
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    RE: Freezing tracks in S5 2005/09/17 08:50:40 (permalink)
    Eric:
    Your point is well taken - so some plugins operate at 32 bit float right? / When the data is returned to the project, the data returns at the wordlength of the project - either 16 or 24 bits - Since a project currently doesn't support housing 32 bit internally(only processing eh?). So does bounce have the same issues? I need to try this to better understand your question, but if this issue were as you say (and I trust your are not making this up) then why wouldn't every frozen track exceed 16 or 24 bit DBFS?

    Anybody?

    -D
    post edited by DonM - 2005/09/17 08:57:48

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    Erik Putrycz
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    RE: Freezing tracks in S5 2005/09/17 12:37:09 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: DonM

    Eric:
    Your point is well taken - so some plugins operate at 32 bit float right? / When the data is returned to the project, the data returns at the wordlength of the project - either 16 or 24 bits - Since a project currently doesn't support housing 32 bit internally(only processing eh?). So does bounce have the same issues? I need to try this to better understand your question, but if this issue were as you say (and I trust your are not making this up) then why wouldn't every frozen track exceed 16 or 24 bit DBFS?


    All plugins operate at 32 bit float, and when a track is frozen then the 32 bit float is converted to 24 or 16 bit I believe (probably with dithering?) and that's a possible source of clipping. Sound forge can use internally 32 bit files to prevent these issues for instance and I think Fruity loops is working on 32 bit by default.
    And the issue is easy to reproduce. I had bad surprises on some of my projects when I started hearing clipping that wasn't there before.

    Erik.

    www.ens-music.com
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    dreamkeeper
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    RE: Freezing tracks in S5 2005/09/17 13:12:23 (permalink)
    OMG! Thanks for the heads up!

    Just tried - so the volume fader doesn't have any effect on the level of the frozen audio. But the trim fader has, it will even reset to 0dB after freezing. Is that logical? Hm... I don't think that it has anything to do with 16,24 or 32bit files, although I understand that with higher bit depth you can set synth output lower (safer) without losing resolution. Same story as with recording audio I guess?

    werner
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    DonM
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    RE: Freezing tracks in S5 2005/09/17 13:24:02 (permalink)
    Erik;
    does bouncing have the same issue?
    -D

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