Helpful ReplyFuture Loopsters: 1) Apple, 2) Acid, and/or 3) Rex loops

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Philip
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2010/09/12 20:41:51 (permalink)

Future Loopsters: 1) Apple, 2) Acid, and/or 3) Rex loops

... etc. (for this topic I'd prefer not to delve much into BiaB or 7Aliens-Cantana loops) but on Beatz loops.
 
What loops do you prefer/consider and/or your techniques using them?  I am new in this realm so please chime, everyone!  Novice and Pro should have some pearls to share here.
 
In Sonar:
 
1) Apple Loops are just wave files (apparently).  I find these useful for learning other genres and hooks.  By studying Apple loops (drag & drop into Sonar) ... you can follow the suggested tempo and key (hopefully spelled out on your/my loop samples).  Or you/I can Ctrl-L them into groove loops to be like Acid loops.
 
You can also seriously emulate instrument/vox samples, their compressions, Hass effects, etc. ... that these artists labors of love generously afford (royalty free after you purchase). 
 
Yes, I've recently learned a great deal from painstaking uber vox loops that are just now hitting vendors.
 
2) Acid loops become Groove Loops when dragged & dropped into Sonar ... yes: they conform to both key and tempo.  Of course you can Ctrl-L them into wave clips ... no problem.
 
Acid loops and Apple loops are mere compliments of each other and work equally well in Sonar ... IOWS, they are wave clips vs. groove clips.
 
3) Rex loops: These are those astonishing loops found in Beatscape that invoke life-changing songs to emerge out of the blue.  They also add speedy life to my dead traditional beatz (AKA, grooves and rhythms).
 
Unfortunately, they are buggish in 64 bit enviroments.  Also, 3rd party rex artists are not always trustworthy ... and many slices don't cut it in Beatscape.  Some don't play at all.
 
Warning: As a Win7-64 producer, the only Rex loops I'd partially trust are those built directly into Beatscape.  Some of you Win7-64 producers may have had better luck.  Please rebuke/refute me ... but, IIRC, Sonar Rex loopsters are frustrated in Win7-64.
 
I know I would pay good money to exploit more of these astonishing Rex loops ... if only they worked in Win7-64 Beatscape or other 64bit sequencer.
 
--------------------------------------------
 
Again, please share any thoughts, revelations, metaphysical glimpses, and/or insults concerning our inevitable future of music recording.

Philip  
(Isa 5:12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD)

Raised-Again 3http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=12307501
#1
Jonbouy
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Re:Future Loopsters: 1) Apple, 2) Acid, and/or 3) Rex loops 2010/09/12 22:37:23 (permalink) ☄ Helpful
Rex loops I find are far more flexible and I've built up quite a collection over the years.

Propellerheads Recycle is the only app that I know of that is capable of creating .rx2 files and alas (for those that have moved up to 64bit at least) it isn't 64 bit yet, nor AFAIK is the standard REX Shared Library.dll that many Rex aware players use.

I'm not sure how Beatscape manages to work as a 64bit app unless it has a custom rex library built in but I found Beatscape to be a complete mess and uninstalled it eventually, although I may give it another try being as you seem to get on well with it.  I gather Stylus RMX 1.7 is rex enabled and 64bit as well now though.

I still use Reason as my main Rex player and even the latest version 5 (although I'm still on V4) just released is still 32bit.

That, along with the fact I use Rewire and various DX and MFX plugins a lot, is one of the main reasons I'm still sticking with 32 bit currently, as I'd lose more than I'd gain presently.

I've never come across a rex file that doesn't work if it has been sliced properly but certainly the flexibility of some loops WRT to pitch shifting and usable tempo ranges varies greatly. 

Another advantage is that you can cut down many instances of soft synths in projects by freezing certain parts and Recycling loops specifically for use within a project, which is very useful thing for conserving CPU as it takes much less grunt to play back rexed audio than it does to render it directly from several hefty soft synths.  It can also save project load time and disk space to use a few well thought out loop sections instead of a whole track length of bounced audio, and sometimes they are re-usable in other projects too.
post edited by Jonbouy - 2010/09/12 22:39:54

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ba_midi
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Re:Future Loopsters: 1) Apple, 2) Acid, and/or 3) Rex loops 2010/09/13 01:52:40 (permalink) ☄ Helpful

3) Rex loops: These are those astonishing loops found in Beatscape that invoke life-changing songs to emerge out of the blue. They also add speedy life to my dead traditional beatz (AKA, grooves and rhythms). Unfortunately, they are buggish in 64 bit enviroments. Also, 3rd party rex artists are not always trustworthy ... and many slices don't cut it in Beatscape. Some don't play at all.


Propellerhead haven't updated their drivers for 64bit, from what I understand, which is why Rex is difficult in 64bit.

However, you might want to consider using beat slicers.  They do much of what a rex file becomes.  Slices.  And some of the slicers are very easy to use -- if you need that.   Slicers also can be a very creative thing to play with.

As for loops in general, I have terrabytes worth.  Funny thing is, while I do use them from time to time, I tend to end up making my own more often than not.   Then maybe I'll add in a loop more like layering than as a fundamental track.

The problem with loops in general is that they are short things.  Loops.   That means taking more time to handle breaks, fills, or arrangement changes that need more than the loop at those moments.

I do like using them for layering - and for when I'm just plain lazy of course ;)

There are an ENORMOUS amount of sources for loops/wavs/one-shots/construction kits, etc. these days.  Some good, many junk, many rehashed (after all, everyone is trying to milk that money out of us with as little effort as necessary to do so;) ) but there are some sites/vendors that have good reputations and do tend to provide enough good stuff to warrant putting up with some of the filler that will, without fail, be included.

The harder part is keeping things organized ;)

PS- I don't mean to down anyone, but I personally thought beatscape was a waste of my time.  And CW stopped supporting it before it even got to a version 2.  I think the inherent design was alien to many -- even those of us who work with loops/slicers/etc.


post edited by ba_midi - 2010/09/13 01:58:28

Billy Arnell (ba-midi)

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#3
Philip
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Re:Future Loopsters: 1) Apple, 2) Acid, and/or 3) Rex loops 2010/09/13 17:46:05 (permalink)
Well, Jonbuoy and Ba_Midi,

You've both certainly enlighted me on many levels and I thank you!

Sonar-64 Beatscape inspired me tremendously, despite the fatal crashs

(FWIW ... it usually only crashes Sonar when I've editted the beats near the end codons and/or written MIDI lengths that exceed the end segment of the beat (on "manual play")

Propellerhead's Reason is Win-64-bit compatible (according to microsoft http://www.microsoft.com/Windows/compatibility/windows-7/en-us/Details.aspx?type=Software&p=Reason&v=PROPELLERHEAD%20SOFTWARE&uid=4&l=en&pf=3&pi=7&c=Music%20%26%20MP3&sc=Other&os=64-bit)

... but rex files and rx2s in Reason/Record ... I don't completely understand the bad rap their getting in 64 bit and have read negative reports from their restricted forums and such.  Propellerhead support seems to be email ... ouch!

Doubtless, beat-slicers may befit my 'simpler' level in this thing ... so I'll research them.  I'm still open to Rea$on as a 32bit handler in Win-64 if you (Jonbuoy or Billy) or others $eriously recommend them. 

I've used 32bit BiaB, SoundForge, and CDA, without any serious issues in Win7 (parallel-to-but-outside Sonar64).

Philip  
(Isa 5:12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD)

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Jonbouy
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Re:Future Loopsters: 1) Apple, 2) Acid, and/or 3) Rex loops 2010/09/13 18:12:24 (permalink) ☄ Helpful
Yes Philip as I understand it everything will run fine on Win7 64bit but you'd have to use a 32bit Sonar install to use Rewire in any way.

But being able to create your own rex loops with Recycle is the most fun and is a standalone process anyway. 

And if you are happy working with Beatscape then I'd stick with it at least until Propellerheads can get their 64bit act together, although the Dr Octorex player in Reason 5 does look interesting being able to hold 8 loops per instance and being able to trigger between any slice in any of them or have them all layered sounds too much fun to resist.

Propellerheads stuff tends to be expensive at the outset but the upgrade path is not too bad, support is good too although their stuff is renowned for being rock solidly stable and devoid of any frills so the likelihood is you won't ever need them anyway.

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batsbrew
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Re:Future Loopsters: 1) Apple, 2) Acid, and/or 3) Rex loops 2010/09/15 15:58:00 (permalink)
used to use acid.

moved to ezdrummer. much better.
imho, for me anyways.

now, onto superior.

not looking back.


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