schwa
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Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
I recently upgraded my PC, and am looking forward to doing some recording after some years. I was disappointed to fin I can't install my MOTU interface, the card won't fit in my new PC.
It looks as though I need to go with USB. My new PC has a bunch of USB 3.0 ports, but no firewire or thunderbolt. I have heard that USB 3 doesn't necessarily mean lower latency - my recording will be low number of concurrent tracks, but playback of many.
I'd like a rack form, and SPDIF connection. I'd like to get something good, but value is a consideration.
If you've gotten into a new interface recently, and had good luck, I'd love to hear your thoughts.
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mixmkr
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/02/28 22:44:20
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I think the SPDIF is going to narrow your search, but look for features and look and the popular brands. I'm starting to believe stuff like the RME and like (the expensive stuff) is nice, but just overkill for the home studio, unless you have the extra cash. All the sub $1000 is great value and I don't think you'll choose something you'll regret, if it has the features you need.
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schwa
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/02/29 00:58:05
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The RME products are expensive, but the MOTU products look good - if USB 2.0. Then there's the Presonus Studio 192 which is USB 3, and has some nice features. I can afford any of them, but want to make a good choice.
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Wood67
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/02/29 05:30:08
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I just moved from an old SPS-25 (Cakewalk/Edirol) to the new RME Babyface Pro. That RME is not a rack form, but by way of comparison with the 'cheaper' units my initial impressions are a little 'meh..'. I do get reduced latency (about 4-6ms), but in sonic terms I don't hear a huge difference either on monitors or headphones. Note that I've not really used the converters much for recording analogue signals, and one thing I don't like is that the analogue inputs are XLR only - most other units have a combined XLR and 1/4" socket. USB 2 is fine.
Wood Studio One 3 Pro, (Sonar Platinum), Intel i7, Win10 Pro, 32Gb ram, RME Babyface Pro, Behringer X-Touch, Presonus Faderport, Akai MPK49, Arturia KeyLab25, KRK Rokit 5 monitors, and other sonic surprises.
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TheMaartian
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/02/29 10:30:59
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schwa
I recently upgraded my PC, and am looking forward to doing some recording after some years. I was disappointed to fin I can't install my MOTU interface, the card won't fit in my new PC.
It looks as though I need to go with USB. My new PC has a bunch of USB 3.0 ports, but no firewire or thunderbolt. I have heard that USB 3 doesn't necessarily mean lower latency - my recording will be low number of concurrent tracks, but playback of many.
I'd like a rack form, and SPDIF connection. I'd like to get something good, but value is a consideration.
If you've gotten into a new interface recently, and had good luck, I'd love to hear your thoughts.
USB 3 - check S/PDIF - check rack-mountable - check XLR or TRS inputs - check solid under Win10 - check good value - check Tascam US-20x20 http://tascam.com/product/us-20x20/http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/US20x20
Intel i7 3.4GHz, 16 GB RAM, 2 TB HD Win10 Home 64-bit Tascam US-16x08 Studio One 4 Pro Notion 6 Melodyne 4 Studio Acoustica 7 Guitar Pro 7 PreSonus FaderPort Nektar P6 M-Audio BX8 D2 Beyerdynamic DT 880 Pro NI K9U XLN AK, AD2 AAS VS-2, GS-2, VA-2, EP-4, CP-2, OD Toontrack SD3, EZK
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mettelus
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/02/29 15:04:23
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Beware that some "USB 3 compatible" devices perform better on USB 2 ports. As you narrow your choices be sure to circle back for verification from users who own that interface.
ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero (Wi-Fi AC), i7-8700k, 16GB RAM, GTX-1070Ti, Win 10 Pro, Saffire PRO 24 DSP, A-300 PRO, plus numerous gadgets and gizmos that make or manipulate sound in some way.
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JonD
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/02/29 21:20:34
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mettelus
Beware that some "USB 3 compatible" devices perform better on USB 2 ports...
This is a potentially confusing statement. Let's make sure we're not confusing "compatible with USB 3" with "designed for USB 3". All USB 3 ports are theoretically backwards-compatible, so they are compatible with USB2 devices. So when you say "USB 3 compatible devices", that is theoretically including all USB 2 as well. Bottom line -- yes, it's true that it's preferable USB2 devices (even if they're labeled as "USB 3 compatible") be connected to USB 2 ports.
SonarPlat/CWbBL, Win 10 Pro, i7 2600K, Asus P8Z68 Deluxe, 16GB DDR3, Radeon HD5450, TC Electronic Impact Twin, Kawai MP11 Piano, Event ALP Monitors, Beyerdynamic DT770 Pro, Too Many Plugins, My lucky hat.
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Wood67
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/01 05:45:48
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JonD
All USB 3 ports are theoretically backwards-compatible, so they are compatible with USB2 devices.
Worth noting 'theoretically' here. I couldn't get my RME to install when hooked up to USB 3, but it worked fine when in a USB 2 port. Had a series of email exchanges with RME (excellent customer service btw) but we couldn't determine anything with certainty. Depends as much on the mobo and other configuration I suspect.
Wood Studio One 3 Pro, (Sonar Platinum), Intel i7, Win10 Pro, 32Gb ram, RME Babyface Pro, Behringer X-Touch, Presonus Faderport, Akai MPK49, Arturia KeyLab25, KRK Rokit 5 monitors, and other sonic surprises.
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Jim Roseberry
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/01 08:37:55
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☄ Helpfulby Wood67 2016/03/01 09:35:41
Many USB audio interfaces have issues with 3rd-party USB3 controllers.
(Liken the situation to using a non-TI chipset Firewire controller with Firewire audio interfaces.)
Prior to the Z77 chipset (and derivatives), literally *all* USB3 ports were provided by 3rd-party controllers as USB3 hadn't (yet) been integrated into the Intel chipset.
With current generation motherboards, many have additional USB3 ports (in addition to the Intel USB3 ports).
These are provided via 3rd-party controllers. Avoid using these with USB audio/MIDI interfaces.
To address the OP's question:
You won't go wrong with RME
MOTU's new AVB line is very good
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TheMaartian
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/01 11:11:08
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Also remember that plugging a USB 2 device into a USB 3 hub will bring the entire hub down to USB 2 speeds. Same with an old USB 1.1 device (like some of the older audio i/f's) plugged into a USB 2 or 3 hub. A hub will operate at the speed of the slowest device plugged into it.
Intel i7 3.4GHz, 16 GB RAM, 2 TB HD Win10 Home 64-bit Tascam US-16x08 Studio One 4 Pro Notion 6 Melodyne 4 Studio Acoustica 7 Guitar Pro 7 PreSonus FaderPort Nektar P6 M-Audio BX8 D2 Beyerdynamic DT 880 Pro NI K9U XLN AK, AD2 AAS VS-2, GS-2, VA-2, EP-4, CP-2, OD Toontrack SD3, EZK
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steveo42
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/01 14:41:23
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Add me to the list of happy MOTU AVB users. I have an Ultralite AVB and it's working flawlessly for me. Very low latency, solid drivers and great sound.
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SuperG
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/03 19:05:23
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Jim Roseberry
Many USB audio interfaces have issues with 3rd-party USB3 controllers.
(Liken the situation to using a non-TI chipset Firewire controller with Firewire audio interfaces.)
Prior to the Z77 chipset (and derivatives), literally *all* USB3 ports were provided by 3rd-party controllers as USB3 hadn't (yet) been integrated into the Intel chipset.
With current generation motherboards, many have additional USB3 ports (in addition to the Intel USB3 ports).
These are provided via 3rd-party controllers. Avoid using these with USB audio/MIDI interfaces.
To address the OP's question:
You won't go wrong with RME
MOTU's new AVB line is very good
Had to find this out the hard way. Interestingly, I found the lower the latency, the less crackling. Anyway, I'm springing for a PCI-E Fireware card. I have a Motu Ultralight Mk3.
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schwa
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/03 20:52:12
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My new computer is an HP Envy 850, and I believe it has the Intel USB 3.
I'm considering the USB 2 MOTU (88, 896) and the Presonus Studio 192. I'm definitely interested in hearing what's working well among the newer offerings.
Is there anything compelling about the AVB line?
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SuperG
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/03 21:20:17
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schwa
My new computer is an HP Envy 850, and I believe it has the Intel USB 3.
I'm considering the USB 2 MOTU (88, 896) and the Presonus Studio 192. I'm definitely interested in hearing what's working well among the newer offerings.
Is there anything compelling about the AVB line?
Nothing really, it's just the latest interface that's hot. In your case with your USB3 PC, you''ll need to get an I/O card for either AVB, USB2, or Firewire - depending on how you choose for an audio device.
post edited by SuperG - 2016/03/03 21:42:59
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steveo42
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/04 08:42:08
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schwa
My new computer is an HP Envy 850, and I believe it has the Intel USB 3.
I'm considering the USB 2 MOTU (88, 896) and the Presonus Studio 192. I'm definitely interested in hearing what's working well among the newer offerings.
Is there anything compelling about the AVB line?
You might want to take a look at the SOS review of the Studio 192. http://www.soundonsound.c...resonus-studio-192.htm
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Jim Roseberry
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/04 15:02:23
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schwa
I'm considering the USB 2 MOTU (88, 896) and the Presonus Studio 192. I'm definitely interested in hearing what's working well among the newer offerings.
Is there anything compelling about the AVB line?
If you're after lowest possible round-trip latency... Thus far, no USB3 audio interface yields lower round-trip latency than the best USB2 audio interfaces. RME Fireface and MOTU AVB series both offer great sound... low round-trip latency... and solid drivers. If you want round-trip latency lower than 4.3ms at a 48-sample ASIO buffer size (44.1k), your only options are PCIe or Thunderbolt (running PCIe via Thunderbolt drivers).
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schwa
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/06 21:06:25
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After some more research, it seems I may be able to continue with my old MOTU 424/2408 setup. I have a PCIe x16 slot available, and it seems like I could get a PCIe-424 card.
I didn't think that PCIe x1 card could be used in an x16 slot, but the "internet" tells me it's possible. Some others say if you install an x1 card next to an x16 card, it ruins x16 performance. The newer card would be less expensive than most interfaces I am considering. But at $295, they're not giving them away. If the new card would affect graphics performance, that's no bargain.
Do the PCI 424 products have comparable latency to the current USB2/firewire/AVB products? I could install a less expensive (PCIe) Ethernet or firewire card and go with something newer, but I'd prefer not to spend a grand on something new if what I have will work well.
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Jim Roseberry
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/07 09:04:42
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schwa
After some more research, it seems I may be able to continue with my old MOTU 424/2408 setup. I have a PCIe x16 slot available, and it seems like I could get a PCIe-424 card.
I didn't think that PCIe x1 card could be used in an x16 slot, but the "internet" tells me it's possible. Some others say if you install an x1 card next to an x16 card, it ruins x16 performance. The newer card would be less expensive than most interfaces I am considering. But at $295, they're not giving them away. If the new card would affect graphics performance, that's no bargain.
Do the PCI 424 products have comparable latency to the current USB2/firewire/AVB products? I could install a less expensive (PCIe) Ethernet or firewire card and go with something newer, but I'd prefer not to spend a grand on something new if what I have will work well.
The number "x" refers to how many PCIe lanes the slot uses. Audio interface controllers are all x1. Fast PCIe SSDs are x4 The only peripherals that are 16x are video cards. (Even with video cards, there's little to no performance compromise running via 8x) You can install a x1 or x4 PCIe card in an x16 or x8 full-length slot. As to whether a PCIe x1 card affects the performance of an adjacent card: It depends...  If the slots don't share PCIe lanes (nor IRQ), performance won't be affected. The MOTU PCIe 424 controller is one of the best performers when it comes to lowest possible round-trip latency.
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schwa
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/07 20:41:31
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Thanks Jim for such a considered response. Any tips on how I could find out if there are shared IRQ or PCI lanes?
From what I've gathered my new PC has a crap-ton of lanes, and that IRQ conflicts are less common in newer computers.
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Jim Roseberry
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/07 22:03:13
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Most modern Intel CPUs provide 40 PCIe lanes (4790k, 6700k, 5930k, etc).
The 5820k provides 28 PCIe lanes... but is otherwise essentially the same CPU as the 5930k.
Now... don't let that number make it seem like the 5820k is a "dog".
Unless you plan to run multiple x16 devices (at the moment only video cards are 16x), you'll most likely do just fine with 28 PCIe lanes.
Your motherboard manual should detail which slots share resources.
Of course, you can also see this (after the fact) by looking in Device Manager.
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schwa
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/08 23:16:26
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Jim, I was wondering how you knew I had a 5820k, but I guess most Envy 850's have them. I considered the 5930k, but it seemed the boost/$ wasn't a good deal right now. It seems that I might be able to go to a 5960k on the future once they become more affordable.
It will just be the sound card and the video card, there are no other open slots.
I decided to take a chance on the PCIe 424, it's less than a new interface, and I don't have to pull the 2408 and re-wire the connections (worth ~$100 in my book).
The card arrives tomorrow, how do I tell if there are shared resources in the device manager?
Thanks to all (especially Jim), I'll let you know how I get on with the PCIe 424.
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Jim Roseberry
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/11 19:12:29
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You can look in Device Manager and see if anything is sharing an IRQ with the PCIe 424.
The PCIe 424 is an excellent performer.
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schwa
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/11 21:05:32
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Rats. It looks like they ARE sharing an IRQ - 16. Better to leave alone, or try changing? Changing is currently blocked (by ACPI?), but it seems many low values are untaken.
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Jim Roseberry
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Re: Getting back into SONAR, best interface?
2016/03/14 09:54:23
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Some devices share just fine...
If all is well... there's no need to worry.
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