Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
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Golden ears challenge
I was at a Gibson tech conference last week and had the pleasure of meeting with some of the brilliant technical groups who are now part of the Gibson brands family. As some of you may know Gibson recently acquired WOOX Innovations, previously a division of Philips. The conference was held at the WOOX offices and we got a chance to see some of the great work they do there and watch some presentations from them. I was really impressed with the excellence and attention to detail among all their staff. Here is a great ear training program designed by the WOOX engineers to enhance the listening skills of audio engineers. This is a smaller subset of the criteria that they use for human testing of their products. Warning the test probably won't be easy unless you are already a trained audio engineer. I'm not so I'm having to listen pretty hard to the samples myself :) Its a great way to improve your critical listening though! It saves your progress so its easy to go back and continue with the program. Have fun! PS: Use some good headphones for the test or some really good speakers. Your laptop won't cut it!
post edited by Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk] - 2015/04/20 15:14:10
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kzmaier
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/20 15:12:01
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Cool, will have to check this out.
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bapu
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/20 15:26:21
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I despise programs like this. They tell me I suck. I get enough of that in the Songs Forum. J/K The dongs forum is full of supportive people. These types programs on the other hand......
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brundlefly
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/20 15:35:24
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Good stuff. Will have to spend some more time tonight. But no section on timing...?
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ampfixer
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/20 15:36:52
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I can't get any audio output.
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dubdisciple
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/20 15:37:25
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I took a course on ear training online and it was beyond humbling.
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Karyn
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/20 16:26:10
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Got halfway through and got bored Good test though.
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CoteRotie
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/20 17:19:31
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I was just thinking about trying out some online ear training stuff, thanks for the link, Noel! John
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rebel007
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/20 19:39:02
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Just shows how bad my room is.  Headphones made it a lot simpler. I worked at Philips for 3 years in QC, brings back memories.
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interpolated
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/20 19:47:29
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I struggled with a couple of tests...possibly because if the "neutral" lowend on my akg headphones. I never understood what questions meant in some parts also. The colour and weight parts are comprehensive although not exactly explained well enough in my opinion.
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cuitlahac
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/20 20:15:40
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Thanks for the link Noel. I find this kind of training helpful (although sometimes frustrating) I recently sat a course entitled "Critical Listening for Studio Production" (or something like that) which was offered by the Queens University in Belfast, Ireland. It was a humbling experience for me (especially when working with pink noise) but I found it extremely beneficial. After I had completed the course and passed the final exam it gave me a great sense of confidence in my listening skills. I intend to take this class too. It probably will not be for "impatient types", but if it is anything like my previous course experience it will be well worth the time. IMO, continued learning and challenging ourselves to new levels of professionalism and expertise should be a lifetime objective. It's very generous of the WOOX and Gibson folks to share this kind of an opportunity with us. I look forward to the Golden Ears Challenge!
post edited by cuitlahac - 2015/06/05 19:40:23
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gswitz
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/20 21:20:23
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Made it to silver, but I have to go put my kid to bed. Maybe tomorrow some more. Really fun challenges.
StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen. I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
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1andyf88
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/20 22:50:03
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The second page of the intro has 'Golden' misspelled, so I'm a bit leery, or is it Leary in the Golen sense... Anyway, I am looking forward to doing this with my current set up, high end or not, because it's what I mix with. Thanks, all y'all!
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gswitz
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/21 07:10:15
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A plug for Syntorial which has definitely helped my listening skills.
It is interesting to find out which tests I sometimes get answers wrong on.
I loved the mp3 artifact test. That one was surprisingly obvious.
StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen. I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
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synkrotron
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/21 07:55:35
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Well... Got the Basic okay, with just one mistake. On the Silver now and I'm having a nightmare with the Frequency Bands on Noise section Edit: It's official then... my 55 year old ears are not up to the task. I just couldn't get past the Silver: Amount of Treble - 3db Boost
post edited by synkrotron - 2015/04/21 08:36:05
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gbowling
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/21 11:25:43
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So this is interesting. I'm pushing 60 and have been recording/mixing/producing for about 40 years. I zoomed through the basic/bronze and the first part of silver until I got to the mp3 part. For some reason I can't tell the difference in the mp3s.
It's just a guess, but at my age maybe I don't really hear well enough but have trained my ears to hear the things I do in mixing/producing. When it comes to subtle eq, stereo, FX on tracks, etc. etc. I can blast through those with ease. Everything up to the mp3 part took me minutes as I hear about 5 seconds and know which one to pick. It will come up if you only listen to 2 and tell you to listen to all 3 before selecting, but that's not generally necessary for me. However, in a mixing/production situation I'm NEVER trying to hear mp3 artifacts. I rarely listen to mp3s, sure I make them for people who want them but in a production environment I have no need to do anything with mp3s. All my work is done in things like cakewalk or final mastering of wavs for a CD or something. After I'm done if someone wants an mp3 I run it through lame and provide it. hahaha, It's all in good fun. Now it's got me interested in training my ear to hear this as it's all part of getting better. Assuming I CAN train these old ears to hear stuff they haven't been used to hearing! gabo
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synkrotron
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/21 11:48:34
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gbowling I zoomed through the basic/bronze and the first part of silver until I got to the mp3 part.
I'm jealous... Seriously But, seriously, I thought when we got older our high frequency abilities went generally down the pan. I've done a bit of research on this, just, on the interwebs, and older peeps do seem to suffer hearing loss, especially high frequency tones. I found a sound file that went from 22 kHz to 8kHz, and at intervals a voice said what frequency was playing. I was somewhat surprised that I didn't hear anything until somewhere between 14 ~ 12 kHz. I suppose I could go get my ears syringed, but I have a feeling I'd be wasting my time...
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ChristopherM
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/21 12:22:24
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Karyn Got halfway through and got bored  Good test though.
Bored? Perhaps you need this instead.
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BassDaddy
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/21 12:27:29
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ampfixer I can't get any audio output.
Either something is wrong or you did poorly on the test. JK
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Grumbleweed_
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/21 12:43:11
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Word of advice (well, a few words): Don't start the program and then decide to sign up - sign up first unless you want to start right from the beginning again after completing a bunch of stuff! Grum.
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gbowling
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/21 12:45:49
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synkrotron - yes I agree about losing your high freq when you get older. I'm also a drummer so I've burned a lot of ear drum cells doing that! My wife says I have CHS disease! But when a song comes on, I'm always saying, that voice needs to be 2db higher, or that reverb is too long for my liking, or this or that. I think it may be that I've learned, at least in music, to hear changes in other things that happen when you change EQ in the high freq range. For me, being a drummer, I listen to the hihats and can hear a change in them. Also, if I recall the test didn't have anything really high, seems like the highest was in the range you mentioned, 12k-14k. I'm just stumped about the mp3s. I went from selecting the right answer in a few seconds to failing over and over on the mp3s! Obviously some change that I've not trained my brain to recognize. hahaha.. It's hell getting old! gabo
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jps
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/21 19:27:38
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It is official , I now have golden ears :-)) I really enjoyed doing this ear training program. Thanks for sharing !
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gswitz
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/21 19:56:36
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I finished too, but with a certain amount of cheating on identifying the frequency bumps and cuts. Man that one was a dog!!
StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen. I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
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Sir Les
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/22 00:44:41
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Oh yah just what I am looking for...ear training and testing...I was looking into that myself with test tones...thanks man!
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gbowling
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/22 19:51:07
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Old and "golden ears" here! At my age, close to 60, I might have to turn it up louder, but I can still hear it!! Except for the mp3 artifacts, which kicked my butt for a while. At any rate, I really enjoyed doing this and learned that I need more work on recognizing mp3 artifacts. Although I'm not sure that's all that important.. if it's an mp3, it has artifacts! haha. It would be a really good exercise for someone starting out, gets your ears tuned into things you need to understand. gabo
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Grem
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/22 21:14:24
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gbowling
But when a song comes on, I'm always saying, that voice needs to be 2db higher, or that reverb is too long for my liking, or this or that. gabo
This is what I do also. I analyze every song I hear now. And I knew I would do this when I started learning to mix. Now I can't stand to listen to music radio because they have some of the worst compression algorithms out there. The soft low music of a song is louder than the loud parts!! Is nobody but me hearing this? I listen to songs and tell people around me "Hear that sax? Man it sounds good!" They look at me and say "What sax?" And the first "Remastered" ZZ Top stuff had entirely too much digital reverb. Can't wait to take the test.
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theheliosequence
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/23 07:27:43
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I don't think getting through this constitutes having golden ears imho... but the MP3 test and guessing which frequency test were interesting.
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bitflipper
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/23 11:57:42
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That was fun. Thanks, Noel. Some of the more subtle tests are going to be difficult with headphones, though, as once the filters are effecting 6 dB or less change they may be applying less effect than your headphones' inherent nonlinearity. Ideally, you'll want to do this on high-quality speakers.
 All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/23 14:06:40
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You are probably right. I'm travelling and only have a laptop and ultimate ears in-ears. I got up to the silver level but can't get past the more subtle timber tests in gold. Either my HF hearing isn't good enough or the in-ears are unable to pick up the differences. Im stuck in an endless loop since each test you fail it downgrades you back to a prior level lol. Those WOOX dudes are a tough crowd :-P
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John T
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Re: Golden ears challenge
2015/04/23 14:14:03
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I think it's a headphones issue. I did this test about a year ago, and I did amazingly well at it, which I don't think is because I'm amazing or anything. I know my hearing is far from perfect, so I think it's not pitched all that hard. In a decent monitoring environment, I think most reasonably competent engineers should do well.
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