Hammer/Screwdriver/Pliers-Which Is Better?

Ridiculous subject to discuss, isn't it? After all, they're all tools geared to a specific task, and they shouldn't be compared directly, because we're talking apples & oranges. I'm just trying to point out the futility of 'versus' threads, and why they're always doomed to failure: Because there is no one single answer that will complete the question satisfactorily. There are only different projects to complete, and you can reach your desired goal in dozens of different ways.

Everyone has an opinion (and rightfully so) on how to go about this or that, and what way might be better. That makes for entertaining reading, but these threads don't produce any real, practical solutions, and ultimately fall flat under their own weight. It's your project; your creative vision; your deadline; your payoff (either in a financial sense, or in 'job satisfaction'). Do the research (which can include these "vs." threads), formulate an informed opinion, make your decisions, and then dive in. If you don't have the proper screws or finish nails to hang those pictures on the wall, don't wait for Home Depot to deliver. You have to find a way to make it work.

Is it better to have Norm Abram's entire New Yankee Workshop at your disposal? Sure it is. You never know when you might need that $10K Planer/Joiner/Router to fashion a table leg out of scrap barn siding and some leftover sawdust. Can you do it with a few hand tools instead? It'll take longer, but with some care and imagination, you can do the same, and perhaps learn a trick or two along the way. I like to take a median course, and collect enough of a complete toolkit to cover most of the bases.

No one tool will ever do it all. Some are more versatile than others, but you have to make up any perceived shortcoming with your creativity. But that's just my opinion. Realize that this is from someone who enjoys pounding a stove bolt through some mahogany with a Philips, just to see if it can be done.

Uh....

What are you trying to say, b rock?

Hehehe. That shack never did hold water very well; it's been prone to that ever since I ...er, it was built. Just out to lighten up the mood; trust me, I'm not out to offend anyone. Weird mood: I'm just a little more opinionated and 'out-there' than usual; I fear that the accumulated lack of sleep is taking its toll.

And, I have a confession to make: I lied. As I look around at all of the controllers, racks, guitars, mixers, etc. all drowning in a sea of Aurelex, I have no right to claim taking a 'median course' with the tools. I just looked in VST Plugin 5 [Junk Synths - Possibly Useful] folder, and I hate to tell you how many I found in there. So I had to get this off my chest. But the stove bolt story is the gospel truth.

And BC, if I haven't said it before, welcome to the ranks. I enjoy your lively replies, and I hope that you end up with the satisfaction that you made a wise investment in creativity with this software. I'll be honest with you: I had a hard time deciding between Reason and Project5 when it first came out. I gambled on P5, got it home, and immediately felt like I had just made a $300.00 mistake. I fought it for a while, and then the news came of the free 2.5 update for Reason. My heart sunk, but I stuck with it, and the rest is ...

I think b-rock does have a point. If you're looking for a quick way to make "phat trance leads" and genre dance music, then Reason is a great choice. If you want more choices and flexibility, then go for P5 with its ability to bring in other synths and now (horray!) audio support.

No package can do everything, so it's not a question of which is better, but what does each do well. I personally hated Reason when I used it (as you might guess from the music linked below), but I know lots of people who love Reason. The best answer is always to turn "which is better" into "for what purpose?"

hey, we haven't given any thought yet to the dog and pony show for P5 v2

Brilliant, Jan! In all of the hubbub about this new version talk, I've lost sight of the real goal; the true holy grail of this forum. I slipped up once; they won't catch me asleep at the wheel again.

As I've said before, the Sonar tour rep didn't have any schwag with him [last stop], so he handed out business cards for a choice of Sonar/Project5 t-shirts (like they actually exist). I entertained some dark thoughts of jumping one of the five winners in the parking lot after. I still think that I could've taken that chick (in a fair fight).

Attention: Cake Reps serving the Southeast on the 2P5 Tour. Look for me at the Guitar Center on Kendall Drive. I'll be the big guy with the crazed look in his eyes and the MIDI tattoo on his forehead.

Warning: I'm not asking; I'm taking a shirt!

I never meant to set off that firestorm of responses. I guess threads don't stop sometimes. Like I said, I'm a cakewalk boat right now and it's doing the job just right! Even though I probably dont even know how to use it right. I dont care.

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back to the underlying topic
on the Sonar 4 tour the rep had no Sonar T-shirts left in sizes suitable to people who sit around in front of computers day (and now night)
sure if I was 20 years younger I could have fit into a medium -- so that's another message to the powers that be, to be prepared -- your target T-shirt audience may not be young and/or fit

BC -- i hate clutter as well
as a matter of fact, just these last few days a co-worker resurrected an e-mail where I had detailed a nasty problem we now have the go ahead to fix -- of course, I'd deleted it months ago.
i clean my hard drive of projects every 6 months. I don't use track patches, cause I don't want to clutter things up (unfortunately I cannot find a nice reverse string patch I had after several nights of searching)
and I tend to use a few low cpu synths over and over because I know the extensive preset banks and organized or not I can (usually) find what I want
it is a struggle to maintain some clean organization and not get overwhelmed by the number of free synths and free banks available. i can see why Reason would have some real appeal to someone who doesn't like clutter.
But I have also heard of Reason users who come upon a project they did a few months ago and try to figure out their pseudo-cable/modulation routings and get completely lost. And even in the Reason demo, I had to scroll to see all the modules involved in the project.

One of the great appeals of P5 to me is how one can look at a project and pretty much instantly see what's going on. Almost everything is on the surface (though that may change a bit with v2). And if one cares to be thorough in labelling patterns, one can make it even more obvious.

P5 people talk about workflow a lot, but it's also the Cakewalk presentation of a project and patterns that are a part of that. With P5 v2, the device chain for any given track will be even more obvious. It looks like the same thing may be true with track automation -- though i don't know exactly how multiple automation envelopes can be displayed at once for the really big picture -- but I guess you see my point. It's not a cluttered work surface.

People don't talk about it much, but I think that is one of the real appeals of Tracktion and Ableton Live -- the clean presentation of the work area. Sonar takes a few days for me to see everything and how it fits together, but it makes sense after a while. P5 it's pretty much instantaneous.
And I will say as a software developer this sort of design is one of the very hardest things to do. But when it happens it's easy to recognize -- microTonic has one -- the new Filterscape is incredible for showing clearly how very complex modules interact. It's easy to overlook this aspect of P5 cause it seems so obvious.

Ridiculous subject to discuss, isn't it?

Indeed. Everyone knows hammers are best.




-René

if it has strings and magnetic pickups pliers will instigate a joyful noise. if it is electronic a screwdriver will never fail to raise a charge (just make sure minimum bodily contact with any metal). and then the hammer, if it is not needed anymore and there is a glorious sound left to be uttered a hammer will bring it forth. try one on a piano soundboard. (ball peen works well) if you can get your hands on one a tabla tuning hammer has joined the screwdriver and hammer into a single instrument. very functional for electric guitar. if they could just add the pliers wow what a tool it would be.

I wonder if auto-mechanics get into heated, lengthy debates of merits of Snap-on vs. Craftsman?

It would probably be a dull musical creation world if our tools were as interchangeable as a 1/8-inch drive socket wrench.

snap on is almost universally recognized as superior

but why has nobody mentioned duct tape?

sure hammers are fun for a while, but when you need that guitar to look good as new again, nothing can do what duct tape can do.

i once worked at a photo lab where every darkroom was made of duct tape and masonite -- probably about as hurricane ready as b-rock's swamp shack

I was staying out of this till you mentioned duct tape. I fixed a pocket on my jeans with duct tape (I carry a lot of stuff) as an emergency measure to get me through a camping trip 2 years ago. To my surprise it is still working, so to bring it back around.....sometimes an unconventional use of a tool (hammer, screwdriver, PSYN) can produce exceptional results....

al

ORIGINAL: amac

.... sometimes an unconventional use of a tool (hammer, screwdriver, PSYN) can produce exceptional results....

Here's an old standby -- use a small phillips screwdriver and hammer to make a neat and effective screw start in sheetrock or plywood.

Why is it that my musical tools seem in much better shape than the other ones...?

It was an object lesson, a diatribe, and a discourse on the forum...slap yerselves if you didn't get it.

Here's an old standby -- use a small phillips screwdriver and hammer to make a neat and effective screw start in sheetrock or plywood.

I'd also heard somewhere that people use a Philips with a hammer to construct some sort of a smoking device out of an empty 2-liter bottle of liquor. They fill it with water, allow an air bubble to move to the desired point of impact, and then Bong!: a perfectly cylindrical hole is produced. They shove it full of tubing, and keep the water in there, for some ungodly reason. These damn kids of today ...

Edit: Bong? I guess that I meant to say "Bang!"; I don't know where that one came from. Thanks for pointing this out, Mike. That term would only be appropriate if a bell were used, rather than a a discarded liquor bottle. The things that you learn these days on the Discovery Channel is amazing ...