Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system?

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Garry Stubbs
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2008/10/25 07:18:08 (permalink)

Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system?

Well, I picked up my new quad core system for my project studio yesterday, running Vista 32bit on 4GB DDR-2 for my Sonar 8 PE. I'm running through the system before planning the loading, and I wanted to recheck my plan for optimising the Sonar performance across the three 500Gb SATA 7200RPM drives I had installed. The great news is that I just ran the Windows Experience perfomance benchmark, and out of a current top base score of 5.9, my processor(s) score 5.9, memory operations per second score 5.5 and my disk transfer rate 5.7. This is encouraging as this is as well balanced as I planned for when speccing up the system. My question is;- what is going to be the best balance for running across the disks.

My installation plan is currently as follows based on what I recall I have picked up from the forum here this year;

Drive C - Sonar, Project 5 and all other my VST apps which are Rapture, RealStrat, Saxlab, BFD2 and EZ Drummer
Drive F (named Samples) - all audio samples /libraries - loop libraries inc Dim Pro and the VST sample libraries as detailed above
Drive P (named Projects) - exclusively for the recording and storage of projects using per-project folders

Does this look right for best performance and organisation? is there anything any of you think I may have overlooked or should take into consideration?

Cheers

Garry Kiosk

EDIT: EZ Drummer not "EX Drummer"
post edited by The Kiosk Project - 2008/10/25 15:15:48


https://soundcloud.com/garry-kiosk
Sonar Platinum 64-bit: Q6600 8Gb Win7 64-bit: KRK Monitors: ART MPA PRO VLA ii preamp: 3 x 500Gb internal SATA disks: Superior Drummer2: GPO4: Realstrat: Saxlab: Rapture: Dimension Pro: Ozone 4: Edirol SPS-660: PCR-500 MIDI controller: Korg PadKontrol: Fender / Gibson / Yamaha / Ibanez guitars:Guitar Rig 5: Dual 22" Monitors: Mapex Drums, Sabian AAX cymbals: Alesis DM5 Pro Kit: SE Electronics and Shure Mics: Mathmos Lava Lamp (40W)
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    edentowers
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/25 07:37:57 (permalink)
    Garry,

    I think you won't go far wrong with that disk allocation. It adheres very well to the Keep It Simple strategy, and I think that counts for a lot.

    Get it all installed and start having some fun!

    S8PE, Dell XPS 720 (Q6600), XP Pro SP2, Edirol UA-101
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    Garry Stubbs
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/25 07:47:42 (permalink)
    Thanks Eden, I know the information is all "out there" but it's good to check it through again before putting together a new system, as it is a chance to learn from old mistakes and get it as right as possible first time. I have another question in my mind about the Vista driver for my FA-66 but I'll do some research first and create a new post later if I need to.

    It's a great feeling to be putting together my first dedicated DAW, having learnt (well still learning) the ropes using an existing system I already had and using for other applications. Any other suggestions for optimising disk performance (and therefore overall Sonar performance) would be very welcome. Another I picked up on was to turn off disk indexing for each drive, any thoughts on that anyone?

    Garry Kiosk
    post edited by The Kiosk Project - 2008/10/25 07:55:43


    https://soundcloud.com/garry-kiosk
    Sonar Platinum 64-bit: Q6600 8Gb Win7 64-bit: KRK Monitors: ART MPA PRO VLA ii preamp: 3 x 500Gb internal SATA disks: Superior Drummer2: GPO4: Realstrat: Saxlab: Rapture: Dimension Pro: Ozone 4: Edirol SPS-660: PCR-500 MIDI controller: Korg PadKontrol: Fender / Gibson / Yamaha / Ibanez guitars:Guitar Rig 5: Dual 22" Monitors: Mapex Drums, Sabian AAX cymbals: Alesis DM5 Pro Kit: SE Electronics and Shure Mics: Mathmos Lava Lamp (40W)
    #3
    edentowers
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/25 09:24:07 (permalink)
    A little article about Vista disk indexing HERE

    Might well be worth a try.

    Phil

    S8PE, Dell XPS 720 (Q6600), XP Pro SP2, Edirol UA-101
    #4
    Garry Stubbs
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/25 09:38:22 (permalink)
    Useful link, many thanks Phil

    Regards

    Garry


    https://soundcloud.com/garry-kiosk
    Sonar Platinum 64-bit: Q6600 8Gb Win7 64-bit: KRK Monitors: ART MPA PRO VLA ii preamp: 3 x 500Gb internal SATA disks: Superior Drummer2: GPO4: Realstrat: Saxlab: Rapture: Dimension Pro: Ozone 4: Edirol SPS-660: PCR-500 MIDI controller: Korg PadKontrol: Fender / Gibson / Yamaha / Ibanez guitars:Guitar Rig 5: Dual 22" Monitors: Mapex Drums, Sabian AAX cymbals: Alesis DM5 Pro Kit: SE Electronics and Shure Mics: Mathmos Lava Lamp (40W)
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    keith
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/25 11:10:17 (permalink)
    Garry, don't forget to format your content drives using large cluster sizes for optimized streaming of large content files... I like 64K clusters. This means every individual file is at least 64K on disk, but for audio/video data you're not wasting any space compared to the efficiency you get for streaming...
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    Garry Stubbs
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/25 13:37:22 (permalink)
    Keith, thats great input thanks very much, something I hadn't considered. I got my local PC shop guy to install and format the drives for me. As its now the weekend I cant get hold of him. Do you know if there is any way of determining the cluster size specified in a disk format after the event?

    Guess I could always reformat but everything is working perfectly ready for my DAW build tomorrow and I dont want to tempt providence etc

    Cheers

    Garry Kiosk


    https://soundcloud.com/garry-kiosk
    Sonar Platinum 64-bit: Q6600 8Gb Win7 64-bit: KRK Monitors: ART MPA PRO VLA ii preamp: 3 x 500Gb internal SATA disks: Superior Drummer2: GPO4: Realstrat: Saxlab: Rapture: Dimension Pro: Ozone 4: Edirol SPS-660: PCR-500 MIDI controller: Korg PadKontrol: Fender / Gibson / Yamaha / Ibanez guitars:Guitar Rig 5: Dual 22" Monitors: Mapex Drums, Sabian AAX cymbals: Alesis DM5 Pro Kit: SE Electronics and Shure Mics: Mathmos Lava Lamp (40W)
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    keith
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/25 14:18:55 (permalink)
    Gerry, one simple method is to save a text file containing a single character, then right-click the file and look at the "size on disk" property.
    #8
    Garry Stubbs
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/25 14:31:25 (permalink)
    Keith, very interesting, thanks, just tried this with a couple of small docs as you suggested, and indeed, each doc is precisely 10k each. Does this suggest, as I can imply from your previous reply, that the disks have been formatted to a cluster size of 10k? If so, is it a known fact that increasing this to 64k will improve my disk streaming performance? As I said earlier in the thread, now is the time to get it right. If I have to reformat, I haven't had to do this for many a year (fortunately !) what is the best way to do this from Vista to get control over the cluster size. Any info welcome and I am really glad I started this thread earlier, I hope it is giving useful information to others also.

    Cheers

    Garry Kiosk (Beer in hand - hell it's Saturday night here.........)


    https://soundcloud.com/garry-kiosk
    Sonar Platinum 64-bit: Q6600 8Gb Win7 64-bit: KRK Monitors: ART MPA PRO VLA ii preamp: 3 x 500Gb internal SATA disks: Superior Drummer2: GPO4: Realstrat: Saxlab: Rapture: Dimension Pro: Ozone 4: Edirol SPS-660: PCR-500 MIDI controller: Korg PadKontrol: Fender / Gibson / Yamaha / Ibanez guitars:Guitar Rig 5: Dual 22" Monitors: Mapex Drums, Sabian AAX cymbals: Alesis DM5 Pro Kit: SE Electronics and Shure Mics: Mathmos Lava Lamp (40W)
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    91lespaulstandard
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/25 15:09:24 (permalink)
    Hi Keith,
    By content drives are you refering to the drive where music will be written, or the drives where Sonar and the plugins are installed?

    Thanks,
    Randy
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    slartabartfast
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/25 17:28:27 (permalink)
    Also the output of chkdsk should show this as: "xxxx bytes in each allocation unit"

    http://support.microsoft.com/kb/314878

    http://support.microsoft.com/kb/315265

    ORIGINAL: keith

    Gerry, one simple method is to save a text file containing a single character, then right-click the file and look at the "size on disk" property.

    post edited by slartabartfast - 2008/10/25 17:35:03
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    keith
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/26 01:41:42 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: 91lespaulstandard
    By content drives are you refering to the drive where music will be written, or the drives where Sonar and the plugins are installed?


    The drive where audio content is read from/written to -- loop content, SONAR audio files, etc.
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    WDI
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/26 01:54:27 (permalink)
    This is just what I do, and my opinion, I've never heard anyone supporting this but...

    For my Sonar read/write drive, where I'll be recording new projects to, I like to use a smaller good fast drive like Western Digital Rapter. I think mine is like 37 GB or something. I know smaller drives are getting hard to come by so maybe creating a smaller partition will accomplish the same thing. The reasoning behind this is because I can very easily maintain the smaller drive. Defraging a large drive can be very time consuming and if your drive is fragmented it could effect the read/write performance and ultimately your Sonar performance. Basically this is a clean area for all my current projects. When I'm not working on them or when I'm done I just move the project to two back up drives, one internal and one external. For me this has been very fast and easy to maintain. I always have a drive optimized for recording.

    Sonar 7 PE
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    Old stuff: ARJO
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    keith
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/26 02:12:39 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: The Kiosk Project
    each doc is precisely 10k each. Does this suggest, as I can imply from your previous reply, that the disks have been formatted to a cluster size of 10k?


    10K? That would be an odd cluster size! Cluster sizes should be a number that is a power of 2 -- 4096 (4K), 8192 (8K), 16384 (16K)... up to 128K I believe. If you create a TXT file (e.g., using notepad) containing a single character, then pull up the properties of the file, the "size" should be "1 byte", and the "size on disk" will be whatever the disk's cluster size is.

    If so, is it a known fact that increasing this to 64k will improve my disk streaming performance?


    The theory is that a.) audio/video data ususally comes in large chunks -- you know, 100MB WAV files, etc., and b.) pulling more data off the disk per unit of work results in fewer overall disk accesses. The analogy is moving buckets of water from one sink to another -- smaller bucket means more trips to move the same quantity = more work for you.

    I'm sure over the years faster + bigger disks with larger caches probably has lessened somewhat the advantages of larger cluster sizes for streaming, but it's something I've always done, so you can't convince me it doesn't make a difference!

    You can google "cluster size performance" and decide for yourself... you'd really have to run some low-level benchmarks to see what, if any, real advantage you get. It really depends on your usage patterns (of course!). If you're streaming 60 audio tracks off of a 500GB SATAII drive, it's probably not going to make a huge difference that the audio files are stored in 8K clusters instead of 64K.

    While we're at it, there are a couple of other optimizations that I do for NTFS (besides disabling indexing, metioned above)... namely, disabling 8.3 filenames and disabling "last access time". I think this article explains them:

    http://www.windowsdevcenter.com/pub/a/windows/2005/02/08/NTFS_Hacks.html

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    Garry Stubbs
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    RE: Hard Disk Scheme for max performance of new system? 2008/10/26 07:50:07 (permalink)
    Keith, great info, many thanks, I'll take a look at all this today

    Regards

    Garry Kiosk


    https://soundcloud.com/garry-kiosk
    Sonar Platinum 64-bit: Q6600 8Gb Win7 64-bit: KRK Monitors: ART MPA PRO VLA ii preamp: 3 x 500Gb internal SATA disks: Superior Drummer2: GPO4: Realstrat: Saxlab: Rapture: Dimension Pro: Ozone 4: Edirol SPS-660: PCR-500 MIDI controller: Korg PadKontrol: Fender / Gibson / Yamaha / Ibanez guitars:Guitar Rig 5: Dual 22" Monitors: Mapex Drums, Sabian AAX cymbals: Alesis DM5 Pro Kit: SE Electronics and Shure Mics: Mathmos Lava Lamp (40W)
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