Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question

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musicroom
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2013/09/04 10:02:04 (permalink)

Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question

The hard drive that failed is the OS drive containing Windows 8. The good news here is that I have a recent iso image of that drive using acronis.
 
Q: With Windows 8 loaded on the image, do I have to do anything in regards to formatting or partitioning the new drive prior to the restore process? 
 
 
Thanks,
post edited by musicroom - 2013/09/04 10:54:49

 
Dave
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    spacealf
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/04 14:27:26 (permalink)
    Yes, you always have to format and partition first a new harddrive, and you may even have to use the manufacturer's program that came with the harddisk, but then there probably is an included DVD with it perhaps. Some may not have that.
     
    I'll take that back, partitioning the new harddisk can be done after Windows is installed (well at least with Windows 7 you shrink the volume and add logical partitions).
     
    The harddisk or Windows 8 will probably tell you if formatting needs to be done. Use to be done a different way, and a program called fdisk (format disk) had to be used first, but nowadays, I am not sure and I have one to stick in my computer also, but it has been 6 years since I done the last one on my  XP computer, but anyway, you will know, it will tell you.
     
    post edited by spacealf - 2013/09/04 14:36:27

     
     
    #2
    slartabartfast
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/04 16:08:34 (permalink)
    You say an ISO. Really? If so then that image will not boot until you burn it to an optical disk (CD or DVD) or unless you have software that will read an ISO. The former can be done on another computer if you can transfer the ISO file to that computer, the latter implies you will need to install an operating system in order to run the software that will make your ISO readable.
    If you have instead a bootable backup image on an optical disk as is the recommended method, you can just boot from that disk and the restoration onto a new hard drive will include steps to format the new drive. Somewhere in between those options is if you have a bootable "rescue" disk burned from within Acronis, that will allow you to boot from the optical rescue disk and access backup image files you have stored on your good hard drive, external hard drive or flash drive. In that case booting from your rescue disk should enable you to do a restore of the image file, during which process you should have the opportunity to partition and format the new drive. Typically your new unpartitioned drive will need as much free space as the imaged disk had (be bigger).
    You can partition, format and install windows onto the new drive, install Acronis and then use an Acronis to locate and restore the image, but that would not usually be necessary if you have created the bootable disk. A disk/partition/system image typically contains the file system (formatting) as part of the image, and restoration will restore the formatting as well. In the process it will destroy any files or formatting that exist on the target partition, so formatting the target before the restoration is futile. That is quite different from restoring individual files from an image, which will require that they be copied onto an already formatted partition.
    post edited by slartabartfast - 2013/09/04 16:44:36
    #3
    musicroom
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/05 12:29:14 (permalink)
    Thanks for the replies!! What I have is an acronis bootable cd that loads a dos version of acronis. From there I can get to the backup files on another drive I made using this same acronis bootable cd. My failing hard drive allowed me to boot (limp) into windows last night and from there I created a boot-able Win 8 system recovery thumb drive. 
     
    I'm thinking out loud here so I'm going to install the new drive. Button up the pc and boot from the windows 8 bootable thumb drive. From there I'm hoping to be prompted for Win 8 formatting and partitioning. Then I would boot from the acronis cd and load the latest backup image file.
     
    Any comments or suggestions are welcome here. Thanks.

     
    Dave
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    #4
    slartabartfast
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/05 14:05:11 (permalink)
    I am not clear why you cannot just run the Acronis restore from your bootable Acronis CD without ever having to deal with any kind of Windows rescue or restore USB drive at all. If you have an image of your system disk/partition (the one with Windows installed on it) made with Acronis, that image has Windows already installed, all of the programs and files that were installed on the system partition, and all of the formatting that the system partition used. In other words restoring from that image puts your system back on the new disk exactly as it was on the old disk. The DOS version of Acronis should be fully capable of doing that restoration if it can access the image file you made of your previously working system.
     
    Or are you saying you did not make an image of your system, but only made backup files. A backup file is just a copy of the files on your hard drive in native or compressed format. An image is an actual copy of the logical structure of the hard drive including all of the files, the formatting etc. Aconis can do both. If it tells you that it has found an image of a disk or partition, then you have an image file and that is all you need. Just boot from the CD, find the image file of your previous system disk/partition and start the restoration directing it to restore to the new drive. You do not have to ever boot into Windows for this process--it all works under the operating system that loads into memory from the bootable CD. And you do not have to format the new drive as the restoration will restore the formatting as well.
     
     
    #5
    musicroom
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/05 14:26:59 (permalink)
    slartabartfast
     And you do not have to format the new drive as the restoration will restore the formatting as well.
     

     
     
    Thank you - this is what I was trying to find out. I do have a complete backup image file made with acronis. My replacement drive is larger than the failed drive. However, I'm assuming based on what you wrote, that formatting will be a non-event. 
     
     

     
    Dave
    Songs
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    Desktop: Platinum / RME Multiface II / Purrfect Audio DAW  I7-3770 / 16 GB RAM / Win 10 Pro / Remote Laptop i7 6500U / 12GB RAM /  RME Babyface



     
     
    #6
    spacealf
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/05 16:27:19 (permalink)
    Ah, I have Acronis on my hard disk. Without it, the harddisk will not even boot (even if Windows is on it - BSOD is what you get - I just got one for disabling it on my computer thinking I could do that when you can not - restored it with a System Restore so Windows did start and the OS was restored). If it is only one Acronis DVD say, that will not hold Windows, I made a backup to install Windows, and it took 3 DVD's to hold Windows.
     
    I am thinking that the only thing Acronis will do is make your hard disk ready to put a OS on the harddrive.
    Afterthat, Windows will have to be installed to make the harddisk boot up to Windows, since any OS can be put on a harddisk new drive.
     
     

     
     
    #7
    musicroom
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/05 16:43:49 (permalink)
    Hmmm, I have windows in the saved image with the other programs. I'm just planning on installing the drive and loading the image at this point. I didn't know Acronis embeds into a system like you described.
    #8
    spacealf
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/05 17:03:22 (permalink)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_image

    An ISO can be "mounted" with suitable driver software, i.e. treated by the operating system as if it were a physical optical disc. Most Unix-based operating systems, including GNU/Linux and Mac OS X, have built-in capability to mount an ISO. Windows 8 also has such capability.[2] For other operating systems software drivers can be installed to achieve the same objective.

    [2]    http://www.extremetech.co...ounting-of-iso-and-vhd

    August 30, 2011 article
     
    Comments on the last link may help, but I do not know that much about *.iso files, just know they exist, but if I ever wanted to use them, that was another bit I am not sure about.
     
    I do admit I am not sure about anything with this subject, except hard disk drives are so big, they have a program I think to make them usable in the first place, and I think that is what Acronis is, at least to me at this point. Virtual Disk Bus of Acronis tells an OS how to use the Harddisk I think or I am guessing.  It's a 1Tb harddisk and 2Tb or larger are different also.  It is listed under Device Manager on my Windows 7, but still there is no program I can access.
     
    Nothing there I can access as to program though. No CD did I get with my computer, just make a copy of Windows 7 or consult the manufacturer of the computer and put in serial number or something like that perhaps and re-download Windows 7 from them as was put on the machine in the first place, I guess. But I disabled Acronis and then the BSOD when Windows tried to start, never can really get up the menu starting Windows 7 either, but it came up automatically and said it try to fix my computer - well it did not, and the only thing I could do was try a restore point - and that worked, otherwise I was sweating at what I had done thinking that it would not cause a problem in the first place, but it sure did.
     
    But I made DVD's (3) of Windows 7 like I said.
     
    Othewise I would have to look it all up I guess.
     
    post edited by spacealf - 2013/09/08 00:54:45

     
     
    #9
    spacealf
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/05 17:29:11 (permalink)
    These large harddisk drives are something else to me. Similiar is what this person thought he done also, but the Acronis program does not remove data on the disk I think.
     
     I wish the Instructions provided by Seagate would have told me that the Acronis Virtual Disk Bus Driver must not be removed from my PC.
    http://forums.seagate.com...Bus-Driver/td-p/190008


     
    Ya, that would help, but I guess I disabled it, just as bad, should have thought better about doing anything that is before the computer in Device Manager.
     
     

     
     
    #10
    slartabartfast
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/05 18:42:34 (permalink)
    musicroom
    Hmmm, I have windows in the saved image with the other programs. I'm just planning on installing the drive and loading the image at this point. I didn't know Acronis embeds into a system like you described.


    Acronis does not embed into a system.
     
    It sounds as if Spacecalf may be experiencing a problem with limits on addressing a very large hard disk, and using a software translation/kludge to make that work. 
    http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2011/11/29/enabling-large-disks-and-large-sectors-in-windows-8.aspx
     
    If your replacement drive is < 2 TB this is a non-issue.
     
     
     
     
     
    post edited by slartabartfast - 2013/09/05 18:51:25
    #11
    musicroom
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/06 11:31:55 (permalink)
    Update - Loaded the backup image from a usb drive containing Win8 and programs using the acronis boot cd last night onto the new drive. Works like a charm. No formatting required as I learned would be the case from reading this thread. A big thank you to all who stepped in here to offer advice.
    post edited by musicroom - 2013/09/06 16:22:31
    #12
    spacealf
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/06 13:55:49 (permalink)
    Well, the manufacturer put it on, so I have no idea why then. Just know that I guess it is needed even for the 1Tb drive in there. Not even sure if it is a Seagate but I do have DiscWizard on a CD (DVD).
    ??
    That is what it is probably for. Before you could only format a disk up to a certain size and then the blocks on the disk could be 16kB or even 32kB for one block. Making those 4kB like NTFS could not be done. That is what it probably does, which to me, seems to make those harddisk drives be smaller than the space that is recorded. Before space was wasted, now it is not on the hard disk drive being that 4K is the standard block for NTFS.
    ??
     
    Or else they sell different computers some with larger than 1Tb disk in them and they put that program on all computers anyway, since it is OEM type software on the computer.
     
    Well, anyway, that is needed, and Acronis is suppose to allow a free download of a program that tells you if the harddisk drive is healthy so if it is going to fail you would know ahead of time.
     
    I am not sure about that, but I can not download the program anyway from Acronis website anyway.
    http://www.acronis.com/homecomputing/products/drive-monitor/
     
    but then Acronis sells the other programs anyway.
     
    Good you got your Windows 8 going again on your computer. The way they keep changing things all the time, it is hard for me to keep up with it all, and I really do not.
     
     
    post edited by spacealf - 2013/09/06 14:07:17

     
     
    #13
    Jim Roseberry
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/09 08:16:46 (permalink)
    Yep, boot from the Acronis Rescue Disc... load the backup image file onto the new HD... and reboot.
    No partition/format is necessary.
    Everyone here should have an up-to-date backup image file (using True Image or similar).  
    At some point in the future, it will save you literally hours of work.  
    (If you have lots of apps/plugins, it can save you days of work.)

    Best Regards,

    Jim Roseberry
    jim@studiocat.com
    www.studiocat.com
    #14
    musicroom
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    Re: Hard Drive Failed - Win 8 Question 2013/09/09 21:22:51 (permalink)
    Thanks Jim! It works as you described. I did not want to face reloading anything. It's almost as troublesome as moving.  :) 

     
    Dave
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