Headphone Impedance

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zippsinc
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2011/03/06 15:44:17 (permalink)

Headphone Impedance

Hi There

I was about to purchase a pair of Beyerdynamic DT100s when I noticed they come with two different impedance ratings. One is 16 Ohms whereas the others are 400 Ohms.

Which should I get? I'd be wearing them for tracking vocals and guitar/bass and general monitoring duties etc. I'll be feeding them via my Samson S-Phone Headphone Amp or via my RME MultifaceII's headphone out.

Just for the sake of my own knowledge, which ones are best for which types of applications?



Regards

Stewart

Sonar X1d Producer/Pro Tools 9 - Win7 64bit - i7 930 2.8GHz - 6GB DDR3 RAM - RME MultifaceII - RND Portico 5012 & 5016 - Sytek MPX-4Aii - UAD2 Duo/Solo - MoFET76 - API 2500 - Dbx 160x (x2) - Dbx 166 (old revision) - FMR RNC (x2)
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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:Headphone Impedance 2011/03/06 16:13:27 (permalink)
    Either will work fine. The lower the impedance the more current they will draw from the source, and that means it will be a bit louder. I think the lower impedence is used on the small stuff like Ipods and other mp3 players..... If the impedence is higher, you might need a headphone amp to get the levels up. I use some headphones in a stereo amp, and I run them at about  .... 40% max....

    I also use these ear buds EP-630  notice the specs.... 16 ohms.. BTW: these are some sweet buds. EAsy to wear for long times, noise reduction, and the sound quality is amazing. I stocked up on this model when I found it on sale.

    I asked this same question a while back to a tech in a store..... since I was looking at some cans that also had options..... the 80 ohm versions is what they carried, the cans were also available in 350 ohm.....

    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

    MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW   
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    #2
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re:Headphone Impedance 2011/03/06 17:36:55 (permalink)
    In addition to what GuitarHacker said the higher impedance units are usually designed to have better low frequency dampening which results in a crisper and more controlled bass response.

    That makes them a very good match for a hi-fi headphone amp that has adequate power and a poor choice for a small device with a low powered amp that may even be running on batteries.

    The lower impedance headphones are usually designed to be a good match for battery powered gear.

    There are probably many exceptions to what I just said.


    best regards,
    mike



    #3
    drewfx1
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    Re:Headphone Impedance 2011/03/06 18:22:27 (permalink)
    High impedance is beneficial if you are running many headphones at once, such as when recording a large number of musicians each wearing headphones for monitoring.

     In order, then, to discover the limit of deepest tones, it is necessary not only to produce very violent agitations in the air but to give these the form of simple pendular vibrations. - Hermann von Helmholtz, predicting the role of the electric bassist in 1877.
    #4
    zippsinc
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    Re:Headphone Impedance 2011/03/06 19:08:31 (permalink)
    Thanks for that Herb, Mike and Drew.

    Your information is greatly appreciated. I was in two minds what to get.

    I know for a start that my RME MultifaceII is a little short on output volume even with a pair of 16 Ohm Panasonic Cheapos I have. My Sennheiser HD-280 Pros are 64 Ohms and not much better on my MultifaceII. Don't get me wrong, they both do their job but the unit could do with delivering more ooomph to them.

    Like Drew said, for larger projects with more folks playing and monitoring, the higher 400 Ohm ones may be a better camp to join now for the long run with subsequent purchases of these as time goes on (should need require). My Samson S-Phone Headphone Amp has 12 Outputs and ain't exactly a walkman but I guess a load of low impedance headphones may draw heaps of current.

    Looks like it's a pair of DT-100 400 Ohms then. 

    Also, I'm off to read an "Understanding Impedance" article on SOS. Understanding impedance has been one of my weaker points.


    Cheers guys

    Stewart

    Sonar X1d Producer/Pro Tools 9 - Win7 64bit - i7 930 2.8GHz - 6GB DDR3 RAM - RME MultifaceII - RND Portico 5012 & 5016 - Sytek MPX-4Aii - UAD2 Duo/Solo - MoFET76 - API 2500 - Dbx 160x (x2) - Dbx 166 (old revision) - FMR RNC (x2)
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    zippsinc
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    Re:Headphone Impedance 2011/03/06 20:22:11 (permalink)
    Hi Again

    Incidentally, what is likely to occur if a large number of musicians were to be plugged into a headphone amp using low impedance headphones. Apart from the increased current draw, what would the main ascertainable symptom be to the users, or dangers for the headphone amp?

    Herb - I'll be sure to check out these buds at some point. Cheers.


    Stewart

    Sonar X1d Producer/Pro Tools 9 - Win7 64bit - i7 930 2.8GHz - 6GB DDR3 RAM - RME MultifaceII - RND Portico 5012 & 5016 - Sytek MPX-4Aii - UAD2 Duo/Solo - MoFET76 - API 2500 - Dbx 160x (x2) - Dbx 166 (old revision) - FMR RNC (x2)
    #6
    Shadow of The Wind
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    Re:Headphone Impedance 2011/03/07 01:03:38 (permalink)
    For a high impedance load (headphone), you need a higher output voltage and less current. This is good, if you want to use long calbes. It is bad if your voltage is limited (battery powered devices). The volume may be too low.
    If you connect several headphones to one output (using passive Y-type splitters), all headphones should have the same impedance. Ideally, they should be the same. Otherwise, the low impedance ones will be loud and the other silent. If you plug too many low impedance headphones into one output, you may end up with an distorted signal. Up to 4 may work.
    If you have a dedicated headphones amplifier with multiple outputs (and seperate volume pots), you won't have to worry. Every output will have its own amplifier, and they will work with any impedance just fine.

    Wilko
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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:Headphone Impedance 2011/03/07 08:18:38 (permalink)
    I know for a start that my RME MultifaceII is a little short on output volume even with a pair of 16 Ohm Panasonic Cheapos I have


    YEAH... so is my Saffire and from what I hear, so many other interface as well. You would think they would install a better headphone output amp in those things. That is why I route two (out of 8) of my outputs on the saffire to my stereo receiver/amp and use it as the headphone amp.

    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

    MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW   
    Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface


    BMI/NSAI

    "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
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    zippsinc
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    Re:Headphone Impedance 2011/03/07 09:20:59 (permalink)
    Guitarhacker


    I know for a start that my RME MultifaceII is a little short on output volume even with a pair of 16 Ohm Panasonic Cheapos I have


    YEAH... so is my Saffire and from what I hear, so many other interface as well. You would think they would install a better headphone output amp in those things. That is why I route two (out of 8) of my outputs on the saffire to my stereo receiver/amp and use it as the headphone amp.

    Yeh...totally. I wonder why interface manufacturers do this? Perhaps they feel that most folks might use external amp for this. Who knows.

    Sonar X1d Producer/Pro Tools 9 - Win7 64bit - i7 930 2.8GHz - 6GB DDR3 RAM - RME MultifaceII - RND Portico 5012 & 5016 - Sytek MPX-4Aii - UAD2 Duo/Solo - MoFET76 - API 2500 - Dbx 160x (x2) - Dbx 166 (old revision) - FMR RNC (x2)
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    zippsinc
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    Re:Headphone Impedance 2011/03/07 09:52:35 (permalink)
    Shadow of The Wind


    For a high impedance load (headphone), you need a higher output voltage and less current. This is good, if you want to use long calbes. It is bad if your voltage is limited (battery powered devices). The volume may be too low.
    If you connect several headphones to one output (using passive Y-type splitters), all headphones should have the same impedance. Ideally, they should be the same. Otherwise, the low impedance ones will be loud and the other silent. If you plug too many low impedance headphones into one output, you may end up with an distorted signal. Up to 4 may work.
    If you have a dedicated headphones amplifier with multiple outputs (and seperate volume pots), you won't have to worry. Every output will have its own amplifier, and they will work with any impedance just fine.

    Wilko


    Hi Wilko - thanks for the reply.

    My Samson S-Phone headphone amp does in fact have separate volume/pan/eq controls for each of its 4 channels. Each of the 4 channels can accommodate 3 separate headphones (each using their own outputs). Therefore, going by what you're saying would I be able to use like 2 people (possibly 3) on each channel - each wearing low impedance headphones without there being any noticable issues?

    The spec of my Samson S-Phone's outputs are:

    "Maximum output level - 140 mW at 32 ohms, 385mW at 66 ohms."
    "Impedance minimum - 8 Ohms."


    Are the output level impedance values which are given above, pertinent to headphone ratings. i.e. If I use 66 Ohm headphones then there will be 385mW of power output to them? I guess I'm just a little confused as to why the mW values rise with the impedance. I thought 'impedance rise' and 'power ouput' had an inverse relationship. I'm obviously still not grasping this...lol. Off to read more.


    Stewart

    Sonar X1d Producer/Pro Tools 9 - Win7 64bit - i7 930 2.8GHz - 6GB DDR3 RAM - RME MultifaceII - RND Portico 5012 & 5016 - Sytek MPX-4Aii - UAD2 Duo/Solo - MoFET76 - API 2500 - Dbx 160x (x2) - Dbx 166 (old revision) - FMR RNC (x2)
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    Shadow of The Wind
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    Re:Headphone Impedance 2011/03/07 10:22:12 (permalink)
    Stewart,

    If the minimum impdance is 8 Ohm, then you can plug in 2 headphones with 16 Ohms into one output or 4 headphones with 32 Ohms.

    For an amplifier with a low source impedance, i.e. the voltage does not depend on how much current you draw, you would expect a higher output power for a lower load impedance. Audio amplifiers for speakers have an extremely low source impedance.

    This is not true if there is a resistor in series with the output (for safety), i.e. a relatively high soure impedance. In this case, you will see the highest power output if the load impedance matches the source impedance (impedance matching). If your load impedance is low, you will get more current. But most of the available voltage will drop across the source impedance, not across the load. So, you are wasting voltage. If your load impedance is higher than the source impedance, you see a higher output voltage, yet the current going through the load will be low. It turns out that the product of voltage across the load and current through the load reaches its maximum if the load impedance equals the source impedance.
    The headphones outputs of audio amplifiers often have a series resistor (with quite a high resistance). Otherwise, you could put the full output power into the phones. Dedicated amplifiers for headphones may still have a series resistor. But I would expect a much smaller value which should be better. (Note that a low source impedance (compared to the load impedance) dampens ringing. Mike mentioned this effect above.)

    Wilko
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    zippsinc
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    Re:Headphone Impedance 2011/03/07 11:49:49 (permalink)
    Thanks for this Wilko

    You're information is most helpful. It's beginning to make sense now. I will have to continue reading up on it though.


    Thanks again

    Stewart



    Sonar X1d Producer/Pro Tools 9 - Win7 64bit - i7 930 2.8GHz - 6GB DDR3 RAM - RME MultifaceII - RND Portico 5012 & 5016 - Sytek MPX-4Aii - UAD2 Duo/Solo - MoFET76 - API 2500 - Dbx 160x (x2) - Dbx 166 (old revision) - FMR RNC (x2)
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