Helpful ReplyHelp needed in understanding 'Insert Midi track'

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diana2
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2012/06/14 16:29:01 (permalink)

Help needed in understanding 'Insert Midi track'

(Sonar X1 essentials)
I insert a midi track, it's playing thru a midi synth (i guess) because i can hear it, but I have a bus track in my project, I can't seem to select that to play thru only the midi synth, is that how midi works? i.e. you play thru a midi synth, but you can't output it thru a bus?
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FastBikerBoy
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Re:Help needed in understanding 'Insert Midi track' 2012/06/14 16:47:04 (permalink)
That is correct. You can route the synths audio output track to a buss but not a MIDI track. MIDI is not audio, just a set of instructions that a synth uses to create audio.

Have a look at my MIDI for beginners video and see if that helps with routing etc.
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diana2
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Re:Help needed in understanding 'Insert Midi track' 2012/06/17 08:53:29 (permalink)
Very kind of, I watched your video, it was really helpful.
However…when I go back to sonar I still don’t quite get it.
From your vid:
Midi track, takes in signals from my (physical) midi keyboard, but plays nothing.
I insert a Synth to play thru (say Cakewalk TTS), my first question, on the screen the Cakewalk TTS gets inserted as a Track, but its not a ‘Track’ is it? Its an output device isn’t it?
Is that (default name ‘Cakewalk TTS ‘) track then the ‘Audio’ track?
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FastBikerBoy
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Re:Help needed in understanding 'Insert Midi track' 2012/06/17 09:10:55 (permalink)
Yes. It's an audio track that has a softsynth as it's input. You could arm that track for recording and record whatever TTS is playing, be that you playing your keyboard or from a  MIDI tack assuming you have it routed to TTS-1


Think of it like this

Your keyboard set as input to----> MIDI track with output set to -----> TTS-1 ------> Audio track with input set to TTS-1 & output set to your--------> master buss which out puts to your sound cards out.

That's the routing the MIDI takes then converted to audio via TTS then routed to your soundcard.

HTH.
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diana2
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Re:Help needed in understanding 'Insert Midi track' 2012/06/17 11:05:45 (permalink)
Thanks for that, I really appreciate your help, and I am getting it, but…when I click on my Midi track, in the drop-down for Outputs I’m getting:
A list of three instances of Cakewalk TTS (numbered 2-4) + 3 drum things (I guess synths)
Only one of the Cakewalk TTS plays sound.
My questions, if one of them is playing sound, and if that must be thru an audio track, how do I now which audio track that Cakewalk TTS #X is playing thru? Can a softsynth only play thru one audio track within the same project?
Why is the list of synths in the Midi Output dropdown different from the list I get when go menu- Insert Soft-Synth?
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57Gregy
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Re:Help needed in understanding 'Insert Midi track' 2012/06/17 11:31:38 (permalink) ☄ Helpful
One instance of TTS-1 can accept input from up to 16 MIDI tracks. If you changed the output of your MIDI track to one of the other TTS-1s, that one will play the MIDI notes and the other one will be silent.
The drum things are probably Drum Maps? Those won't do anything unless you have the drum machines that are mapped in the drum map. Unless they're General MIDI mapped, then the TTS-1 drum channel can play them (channel 10). Sorry if that's more info than you need.
To know which soft synth track is playing the MIDI notes, the audio output meter should be moving.
One instance of a synth can only play through 1 audio track.
Opening Views>Synth Rack will allow you to delete unneeded synths, or add more if you want.
 

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FastBikerBoy
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Re:Help needed in understanding 'Insert Midi track' 2012/06/17 12:56:42 (permalink) ☄ Helpful
diana2


Thanks for that, I really appreciate your help, and I am getting it, but…when I click on my Midi track, in the drop-down for Outputs I’m getting:
A list of three instances of Cakewalk TTS (numbered 2-4) + 3 drum things (I guess synths)

That sounds like you have more than one instance of TTS inserted into your project. As 57Gregy has said, TTS will respond to all 16 MIDI channels (some synths don't) but you can also have as many instances of the synth as you want as well. Have a look in the Synth Rack and see how many you have loaded. To get to that show the Browser by pressing 'B' and access the synth rack by clicking on the 'Synth' tab.

The drum things are your drum maps, a whole load usually show by default, they are specifically for drum synths and only respond to channel 10.

Only one of the Cakewalk TTS plays sound.

You probably only have one synth as a MIDI track output. The other possibility if playing from a keyboard is that you don't have a channels input echo button lit. The in focus channel will be on by default but if a track isn't in focus and you want to hear playback from it you need to click on it's "Input Echo" button, it's next to the track's record icon. If you don't want to hear it, make sure it is off.

My questions, if one of them is playing sound, and if that must be thru an audio track, how do I now which audio track that Cakewalk TTS #X is playing thru?

As 57Gregy said you'll see the audio meters moving on the track that is playing back, or mute them one by one until the playback goes silent.

Can a softsynth only play thru one audio track within the same project?

No you can have as many audio tracks as you want taking the same input (from anywhere not just synths) although that would be unusual if it was from the same channel of the same synth, but you could if you wanted.

In fact if you insert a drum synth it's quite common to have each drum sound play back through a different audio track. That way you have full control over a sound. You'd probably want to EQ and compress the Kick drum differently to the snare for example.


Why is the list of synths in the Midi Output dropdown different from the list I get when go menu- Insert Soft-Synth?

A synth won't show in the MIDI output dropdown until it has been loaded or inserted into the project/synth rack.  The list in Menu-->Insert-->Softsynth is a list of all the synths installed on your system but not necessarily inserted into the project yet. hope that makes sense.


MIDI can seem quite complicated at first but when you get your head around it you'll find it quite easy, if you want a little more explanation...........

Have a look at the TTS, as already said it can take 16 channels input at once. So channel 1 could be a Piano, channel 2 a Bass guitar sound, channel 3 an organ sound, etc. etc. Channel 10 is traditionally used for drums. You can see those channels if you open the TTS interface and assign each sound there.

You  may also have noticed that the TTS can output has 4 different audio outs. You assign which MIDI channel outputs to which audio output by clicking on the "System" button to the right, and then clicking on the "Options" button. You'll then see how to assign each MIDI channel to one of the four outputs.Each one of the four outputs would then need it's own audio track to playback through. That can be handy for separating sounds for different audio EQ etc. Drums through one output, Bass through another etc.


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diana2
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Re:Help needed in understanding 'Insert Midi track' 2012/06/17 16:04:31 (permalink)
Right, I think I'm getting walmer, out of curiosity, if "...You  may also have noticed that the TTS can output has 4 different audio outs. You assign which MIDI channel outputs to which audio output by clicking on the "System" button to the right, and then clicking on the "Options" button. You'll then see how to assign each MIDI channel to one of the four outputs.."
what would the difference be between inserting four instances of TTS and using four audio outs from one TTS?
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FastBikerBoy
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Re:Help needed in understanding 'Insert Midi track' 2012/06/17 16:19:04 (permalink)
Not much really.

The polyphony limit (number of sounds played at the same time) is less likely to be exceeded with four instances of TTS.

It might be more convienent to use one instance - there'll only be one interface to worry about. Like most things within Sonar there's more than one way to skin a cat, some ways have advantages over others, sometimes it's just user preference, or perhaps easier one way.

Doesn't really matter though.
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Kalle Rantaaho
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Re:Help needed in understanding 'Insert Midi track' 2012/06/18 11:34:18 (permalink) ☄ Helpful
It's more comprehendable to approach via "Insert soft synth", not "MIDI track". That way you get all the tracks created automatically (I assume that function exists in Essential).

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