Helpful ReplyHow do Sonar handle CPU utilization?

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katsuneshinsengumi
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2017/09/18 09:24:58 (permalink)

How do Sonar handle CPU utilization?

Hi,

I'm planning to upgrade my pc but I'm torn between AMD Ryzen 7 1700 and Intel Core i7 7700. As far as I can tell, the AMD is great for multicore processing, and intel's strong point is single threaded performance. So my question is, do Sonar favor multicore like video editing software or does it prefer less cores but higher performance? I would appreciate if you guys can throw documents and benchmarks because I can't find one specific to Sonar.

Thank you,
#1
fireberd
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/18 10:33:11 (permalink)
From other posts about Ryzen on this forum, it appears Ryzen is good for gaming but Intel is best for recording and has lower latency.  

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#2
katsuneshinsengumi
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/18 14:03:58 (permalink)
I've been reading benchmarks and watching videos, most conclusion is Intel Core for gaming because if single threaded performance since most games dont really utilize alot of cores and AMD Ryzen for professional applications because of multicore utilization, my problem with those reviews is except for games, they only have benchmark for file compression, 2d, 3d and video rendering. Not a single one for professional audio applications like Sonar or even Pro Tools.
#3
scook
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/18 14:30:21 (permalink)
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Starise
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/18 17:40:12 (permalink)
Sonar will handle Intel multi cores very well. Some of this is dependent on how threading is implemented.
 
In Platinum we have a visual representation of the cores and you can see which cores are pushed the hardest. One recently added feature is plug in load balancing. This is yet another way to work to more evenly distribute the entire load of a complex mix.  SPLAT is made to take advantage of multicore. 
 
In my mixes, the load is spread fairly evenly with the entire system seldom  breaking a sweat on any of my cores.
 
The way Intel .vs AMD systems use the cores works a little differently.  While the specs might look better for multi thread work in Ryzen, it all depends on how the cores are being used through software. In some ways this is like an apples .vs oranges comparison. 
 
The two are competitive in trying to do similar things, yet there are patents, so one needs to find another way to do the same things.These different approaches can yield different results.
 
I can only speak from experience with Intel. I've never seem any problems with Sonar Platinum having any difficulty whatsoever in using all of the cores in my 5820K. 
Am I making any sense to you here?
 
 
 
 

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#5
abacab
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/18 19:30:22 (permalink)
The link that scook posted is a good reference to some testing performed by a reputable professional DAW builder. Jim Roseberry.  He will not build Ryzen DAWs for clients.
 
 
 
 
 
 

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#6
Kev999
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/19 00:05:50 (permalink)
katsuneshinsengumi
...my question is, do Sonar favor multicore like video editing software or does it prefer less cores but higher performance?...

 
You can easily tell if Sonar is making use of multiple cores. Just load up one of your biggest projects and look at the CPU meters in the Performance Module on the Control Bar.

Also, you need to check out this recent thread:
i7-6850k vs. i7-7700k vs. Ryzen 1800x

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#7
katsuneshinsengumi
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/19 03:50:13 (permalink)
scook
maybe this will help http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3641815
 


That was helpful Scook thank you
#8
katsuneshinsengumi
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/19 03:52:38 (permalink)
Starise
Sonar will handle Intel multi cores very well. Some of this is dependent on how threading is implemented.
 
In Platinum we have a visual representation of the cores and you can see which cores are pushed the hardest. One recently added feature is plug in load balancing. This is yet another way to work to more evenly distribute the entire load of a complex mix.  SPLAT is made to take advantage of multicore. 
 
In my mixes, the load is spread fairly evenly with the entire system seldom  breaking a sweat on any of my cores.
 
The way Intel .vs AMD systems use the cores works a little differently.  While the specs might look better for multi thread work in Ryzen, it all depends on how the cores are being used through software. In some ways this is like an apples .vs oranges comparison. 
 
The two are competitive in trying to do similar things, yet there are patents, so one needs to find another way to do the same things.These different approaches can yield different results.
 
I can only speak from experience with Intel. I've never seem any problems with Sonar Platinum having any difficulty whatsoever in using all of the cores in my 5820K. 
Am I making any sense to you here?
 
 
 
 
Yeah I do get the point, I'm leaning on intel now because of this and the fact that there are stability and compatibility issues with Ryzen(considering it's the first generation anyway).
#9
katsuneshinsengumi
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/19 06:37:03 (permalink)
Kev999
katsuneshinsengumi
...my question is, do Sonar favor multicore like video editing software or does it prefer less cores but higher performance?...

 
You can easily tell if Sonar is making use of multiple cores. Just load up one of your biggest projects and look at the CPU meters in the Performance Module on the Control Bar.

Also, you need to check out this recent thread:
i7-6850k vs. i7-7700k vs. Ryzen 1800x


I can tell from my current setup that it's maxing out but I'm using an AMD A8-6600k so I'm pretty sure it is maxing out because it's inadequate for the job. Not necessarily because it tells me Sonar works great for multicore cpu or less core with higher single threaded performance.
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Kev999
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/19 07:58:04 (permalink)
katsuneshinsengumi
Kev999
katsuneshinsengumi
...my question is, do Sonar favor multicore like video editing software or does it prefer less cores but higher performance?...

You can easily tell if Sonar is making use of multiple cores. Just load up one of your biggest projects and look at the CPU meters in the Performance Module on the Control Bar...

I can tell from my current setup that it's maxing out but I'm using an AMD A8-6600k so I'm pretty sure it is maxing out because it's inadequate for the job. Not necessarily because it tells me Sonar works great for multicore cpu or less core with higher single threaded performance.

 
Then maybe look at a smaller project that isn't maxing out. See whether the load is evenly distributed across all the cores.

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#11
katsuneshinsengumi
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/19 10:50:36 (permalink)
Kev999
katsuneshinsengumi
Kev999
katsuneshinsengumi
...my question is, do Sonar favor multicore like video editing software or does it prefer less cores but higher performance?...

You can easily tell if Sonar is making use of multiple cores. Just load up one of your biggest projects and look at the CPU meters in the Performance Module on the Control Bar...

I can tell from my current setup that it's maxing out but I'm using an AMD A8-6600k so I'm pretty sure it is maxing out because it's inadequate for the job. Not necessarily because it tells me Sonar works great for multicore cpu or less core with higher single threaded performance.

 
Then maybe look at a smaller project that isn't maxing out. See whether the load is evenly distributed across all the cores.


I tried a simple mix with few tracks and plugins.
Only the first core is doing the work, and the remaining 3 seems to be only supplimenting the first core. If I'm gonna base on this result I really might end up on Intel.
post edited by katsuneshinsengumi - 2017/09/19 11:13:34
#12
Kev999
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/19 13:03:54 (permalink)
katsuneshinsengumi
Kev999
katsuneshinsengumi
Kev999
katsuneshinsengumi
...my question is, do Sonar favor multicore like video editing software or does it prefer less cores but higher performance?...

You can easily tell if Sonar is making use of multiple cores. Just load up one of your biggest projects and look at the CPU meters in the Performance Module on the Control Bar...

I can tell from my current setup that it's maxing out but I'm using an AMD A8-6600k so I'm pretty sure it is maxing out because it's inadequate for the job. Not necessarily because it tells me Sonar works great for multicore cpu or less core with higher single threaded performance.

Then maybe look at a smaller project that isn't maxing out. See whether the load is evenly distributed across all the cores.

I tried a simple mix with few tracks and plugins.
Only the first core is doing the work, and the remaining 3 seems to be only supplimenting the first core. If I'm gonna base on this result I really might end up on Intel.

 
In that case, perhaps you would be better off with faster clock speed rather than extra cores. My projects tend to show an even spread across all cores. I'm currently upgrading to a 6850k-based (6-core) system.

Maybe someone else can explain why different users see different CPU behaviour.

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#13
katsuneshinsengumi
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/19 13:10:15 (permalink)
Yeah, I think the i7 7700 is the way to go. It would be awesome if someone from Cakewalk will jump in to shed some light in how the Sonar really balance the CPU load. That might be too much to ask considering this post is just about choosing between cpus but maybe someone in the future wants to know it too. Thank you everyone, it's time to go full on with H270 platform.
#14
GjB
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/23 09:41:54 (permalink)
I'm a bit behind when it comes to the latest platforms and CPUs.
Coincidentally, the AMD website Ryzen Threadripper Processors section says:
Compose Music. Orchestrate Fleets.
Conquer design and gaming with Ryzen™ Threadripper™.
 
I didn't read further (I'm on a budget), but the Compose Music sales jargon seemed interesting anyway.
 

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katsuneshinsengumi
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/23 10:26:18 (permalink)
GjB
I'm a bit behind when it comes to the latest platforms and CPUs.
Coincidentally, the AMD website Ryzen Threadripper Processors section says:
Compose Music. Orchestrate Fleets.
Conquer design and gaming with Ryzen™ Threadripper™.
 
I didn't read further (I'm on a budget), but the Compose Music sales jargon seemed interesting anyway.
 

 
I'm also on a budget and Threadripper is way above my threshold. Besides, I rarely go past 26 tracks,.
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tlw
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/23 14:16:04 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby abacab 2017/09/23 14:19:09
Given the choice of more slower cores or fewer faster, then I’d lean towards the fewer but faster, so long as the cpu has enough cores to start with. A fast i7 would be my choice, maybe i9 if the budget ran to it, but not if that meant a major slow-down in processing speed.

If the load being sent to one core/virtual core is more than its speed can handle adding more cores won’t solve that problem.

Large numbers of cores seems to mostly benefit video/film editing and rendering, where a lot of time can be saved by using cores in parallel each processing a chunk of the video and overall cpu speed matters less because the rendering is off-line and the extra cores more than compensates for the lower speed of each core.

DAW thread scheduling improvements and general software optimisation of DAWs and plugins may change that situation of course. In computing there’s always something a bit better coming along soon, so there’s never an ideal time to buy anything.

Like a lot of things in the world of DAWs, especially Windows DAWs, the only way to find out for sure what works best for your personal setup is to try it and see. Which is fine if you can afford to build/buy a bunch of differently configured computers for evaluation purposes. Failing that the best strategy is probably to look at what other people’s experience has been while paying attention to what competent professional DAW builders, like e.g. Jim Roseberry on this forum, say and do.

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#17
abacab
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/23 14:18:42 (permalink)
tlw

Like a lot of things in the world of DAWs, especially Windows DAWs, the only way to find out for sure what works best for your personal setup is to try it and see. Which is fine if you can afford to build/buy a bunch of differently configured computers for evaluation purposes. Failing that the best strategy is probably to look at what other people’s experience has been while paying attention to what competent professional DAW builders, like e.g. Jim Roseberry on this forum, say and do.




What he said!  +1

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#18
Kev999
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Re: How do Sonar handle CPU utilization? 2017/09/23 23:58:08 (permalink)
The answer to the question "which is better, faster speed or extra cores" will be different for different users. If your projects display an even spread of activity across the cores, then you would benefit from more cores. If the lion's share of the work seems to be done by a single core, then definitely more speed would be preferable. In my case I opted for 50% more cores and 15% less speed.

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