I really don't understand why software companies

expect us to chance upgrading when their products have known, and moderate to severe problems.  It's very disappointing.
 
First Celemony, and now Roland.
 
I'm sticking with 8.5.3.  I know the product, so no learning curve, and it works, so no head banging frustration.  It's a totally no-lose decision.
 
Guys (Roland), get your act together or you will eventually decline.  At this point, spending a few hundred bucks on another product is not that big a deal for most of us, and if learning X(x) has nearly the same curve as learning a completely different product, there will be those of us that switch.  There is little to no professional prestige in the SONAR name, so you can't bank on someone sticking with you for that reason.  If you say to the potential client anything but Protools, they won't have a clue as to what you are referring to.  The only thing SONAR has going for it is (was) performance, and it looks to me like you're screwing that up.  I read this forum most every day, hoping to find a reason to upgrade.  I have even purchased the upgrade, but I will not install it until I feel it's worth my time and effort.  Nothing I have read yells out "the product is way better than it used to be".  Nothing.
 
Be careful.
 
Cheers,
 
Poco

there is no real difference does the same thing in the way you expect...the only difference is the overhaul.

Bugs well they are none!!!

Dappa1


there is no real difference does the same thing in the way you expect...the only difference is the overhaul.

Bugs well they are none!!!

Bugs well they are none!!!

 
Hmmm.  That's not exactly what I'm reading here.  What's this thing about Arm Record taking longer and longer (just the most recent one I can recall).
 
If there is no real difference, why waste the time to learn it?  Change for change's sake.  I don't buy into that.  If I want change for change's sake, I'll try a different product.

+1 stevec I agree with you 100%

> What's this thing about Arm Record taking longer and longer (just the most recent one I can recall).
It's yet to be proven whether this is a Sonar software bug or a driver bug.

The arguments I see here with 8.5.3 vs X1 are exactly the same when Windows 95 came out. "How dare you change my wonderful Windows 3.1" said the office workers "I like double clicking on my big icons"... "Why do I need a start button when I can do everything in one click!"... Two years later everybody was on it, it was buggy as hell, but it was so much better than 3.1 once people "got it".

Rince ... repeat....

People hate change! If you don't want to change - then don't! But one day you will..... however much you swear it.... I was probably the last person on earth who bought a cellphone for instance. You will probably end up buying Sonar X2 or X3 when it becomes acceptable to you.

SIDENOTE - Just finished my Sonar X1 Power! book, read it cover to cover - hurrah!

CakeAlexS

SIDENOTE - Just finished my Sonar X1 Power! book, read it cover to cover - hurrah! 

Thanks, Alex! Glad to hear you enjoyed the book.

Scott

--
Scott R. Garrigus - http://garrigus.com
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar and Sony Sound Forge Power book series: http://garrigus.com/?PowerBooks
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar ProAudioTutor video tutorial series: http://garrigus.com/?ProAudioTutor
* Publisher of the DigiFreq free music technology newsletter: http://digifreq.com/?DigiFreq
* Publisher of the NewTechReview free consumer technology newsletter: http://newtechreview.com/?NewTechReview

Enjoyed the book, I would recommend it to anyone.
However the picture on the old Sonar Power 8 Cover was sooooo much better !!! (Joke :)

This is a very profound question you are asking Poco. It touches on such deep philosophical questions as the simultaneous striving after and accpetance of the unattainability of perfection in human action. It is informed by such mundane economic issues as the need to make payroll and fund the Xmass bonus.  And it reaffirms the timeless observation that there is a sucker born every minute.
 
Perhaps it is not so much that software companies expect us to embrace the perilous upgrade from the bugs we know to the bugs we have not yet discovered, as that they need to believe we will be willing to do so. Such a core belief fuels the whole enterprise, and powers the competitive drive to produce software with a feature list that surpasses the competitor's features before the feature becomes obsolete--even if it never really worked in the first iteration.
 
Without this natural human need to move on to the next frontier, we would still be cracking the bones of road kill with primitive stone tools to suck the rancid marrow.  But through our evolutionary mastery of the experience and exploitation of gullibility modern man is  able to consume a variety of semi-synthetic delicacies packaged in plastic trays suitable for warming in a microwave.
 
Bon appetit.

garrigus

osd
Now, Scott, he didn't say he ENJOYED it...  just kidding.
I just picked it up to look up something on groove clips, and realized how nice it is that things are broken down they way they are in the book. Even though initially I thought there was a little redundancy, it's a real time-saver when you need to refer to a small piece of information and don't have to read huge sections of prefacing material.
So yeah, I enjoyed it too. :P     

Ha! Very funny, David.  Glad to hear you enjoyed it... too! 

This new edition has very little repeated material, actually next to none. That was one of the goals with this latest edition because past editions did have more redundant info. I used to do that because I thought it would help readers out, but now I'm presenting it more as a book that should be read from beginning to end. After that, it can still be used as a reference, like you mentioned.

Thanks!
Scott

--
Scott R. Garrigus - http://garrigus.com
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar and Sony Sound Forge Power book series: http://garrigus.com/?PowerBooks
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar ProAudioTutor video tutorial series: http://garrigus.com/?ProAudioTutor
* Publisher of the DigiFreq free music technology newsletter: http://digifreq.com/?DigiFreq
* Publisher of the NewTechReview free consumer technology newsletter: http://newtechreview.com/?NewTechReview

Thanks for the reply. I'm not why I wrote redundant before, as I meant the level of detail and screenshots is high enough in the book that I don't have to do much else other than find the relevant section as reference later. Guess I'm not good with the cover-to-cover approach. If you put dancing Hawaiian girls in the margins every few pages, I'd do better. :)

What software have Cakewalk released with "moderate to severe" problems or is that based on what you're reading on here?

Personally having read some of the BS on here, I'll never take the slightest notice of any online forum opinions again, not that I did much in the first place. That includes those claiming there are no bugs as well before all those claiming it is unusable jump on me. I wouldn't even listen to me as you don't know me from any other entity that types text that you can read. It's just an opinion after all.

My personal experience with X1 from day one has been great. Yes there are bugs but IMHO and personal experience nowhere near as bad as many on here would have you believe, or much worse than some other Sonar releases. IIRC V7 was a disaster for me.

Many of the issues have to do with the UI change and that's a very personal thing. For many the new UI is the devil incarnate, for others of which I am one, it's a welcome change to what I always considered the worst thing about previous Sonar versions. If you "absolutely love" V8.5 then you probably aren't going to like X1 much. If you think 8.5 is a great tool but not perfect you may well find X1 great.

The only way you'll ever find out is to install the demo or full version if you've already got it and try it out. I've never taken any notice of other people's opinions unless I know and trust that person personally, (a computer screen not counting as personally) and how many users on here can you say that about? But then again I've never been a sheep.

One thing is for sure if/when you do get to try it you'll either hate it and move on/back to something else or kick yourself for not having done it ages ago. (EDIT: Or spend the rest of your life on here complaining about it. )

My tuppence worth..........

JazzSinger

I don't like the way the pro channel is permanent, not a selectable VST. It swallows CPU power and forced me to buy a new laptop. I hope X2 rethinks that.

 

That shouldn't happen, CW (Noel himself IIRC) said elsewhere on here that the PC switched off uses 0% CPU cycles. Might be worth investigating further.

 
The docking is a strange concept. When I now open console view, it peeks up underneath track view. I have to scroll it up to see it properly. I guess I'll get used to it.

That doesn't sound right. When you press Alt+2 you should get a console in the multidock, then press Shift+D to maximise it. It can then be hidden or called back by pressing 'D'.

FastBikerBoy

JazzSinger

I don't like the way the pro channel is permanent, not a selectable VST. It swallows CPU power and forced me to buy a new laptop. I hope X2 rethinks that.

That shouldn't happen, CW (Noel himself IIRC) said elsewhere on here that the PC switched off uses 0% CPU cycles. Might be worth investigating further.

 
The docking is a strange concept. When I now open console view, it peeks up underneath track view. I have to scroll it up to see it properly. I guess I'll get used to it.

That doesn't sound right. When you press Alt+2 you should get a console in the multidock, then press Shift+D to maximise it. It can then be hidden or called back by pressing 'D'.

There is no way of switching off the Pro Channel once you have selected a preset. There is no "reset preset" as there is in the channel strips. I also find it difficult to come back to the original screen when I have selected the ProChannel tab.
 
But generally, X1c definitely does not run quite as smoothly on my Atom notebook compared to 8.5.3
 
Thanks for the hotkeys! I'll try that. 
 
 

mike_mccue


The question remains;

Why do software companies

"expect us to chance upgrading when their products have known, and moderate to severe problems." ?


Why does a company even release the stuff when they know it needs a patch and they prepare a patch that is released just days after the original release just so the app doesn't kill your computer?

Why?

Why?

Why?


It seems like a simple question.

The answer can't be very complicated.

best regards,
mike

And the answer is............. to wind up people that get bothered by such things..... er attempt to maintain revenue streams...... er....... 'cos they can?

OK I give in, what is the answer.

There is no way of switching off the Pro Channel once you have selected a preset. There is no "reset preset" as there is in the channel strips. I also find it difficult to come back to the original screen when I have selected the ProChannel tab.

Use the individual modules power buttons to turn off modules. In their off state they use zero resources - according to previous CW posts on the subject.

By original screen do you mean the TV? Pressing "I" hides the inspector and thus the PC, If you mean the inspector view prior to clicking the PC tab, just click the PC tab again. Then you are back where you started.

Having worked for software companies in the past I know that does not work unless you are Microsoft or Apple (which  have fanboys queuing up by the dozen). If you give BETAs to select few they won't test for everything. If you give out BETAs to everybody they still won't test for everything. Some will find bugs but many won't report them. Most won't even bother wasting their time testing on BETAs... and who can blame them.

The people who demand BETAs generally hope everybody else will do the testing for them.
If you want everything to be 100% bug free expect the software to be as expensive as an aeroplane, otherwise sorry, but you or me end up having to be the testers.

Generally it's not an issue, when you have a new codebase however everybody notices and normally it takes a year or two to settle down.

BTW food is a LOT simpler to prepare.