Importing a Multichannel .Wav File

I am a composer of computer generated music and I use Csound, a programming language meant for music composition. One important aspect of my compositions is multi-channel diffusion. Using Csound I generate multi-channel .wav files, which I import into Sonar X2 Producer to edit. I have been doing it for many years and it works great! However, of late I am generating .wav files with more and more channels. As a student at Virginia Tech, I have access to a 144 channel system, for which I am writing algorithms that will create 144 channel .wav files. I can get Sonar X2 to import all 24 channels of a 24 channel wav file but it cannot import a 48 channel .wav file. Using Pro Tools, I can import a 144 channel wav file, however, I prefer to use Sonar, I have been using it since the first audio version (4) came, and so would like to be able to do that in it. Is it possible to expand the number of channels it can import from a wav file? 144 would suit my current needs.
 
Thanks so much,
 
Michael Rhoades

Hi Mike, thanks for the reply.
Within the file system these multi-channel .wav files look like just any other .wav file. It is within the file itself that the header is different and so stipulates the number of channels. It is no different than a stereo (2 channel) .wav file.
For example, one of my test files is named "test_24.wav", which imports as a 24 channel sound file. As I stated, "test_144.wav" imports 144 channels into Pro Tools, but not in Sonar...I am a Sonar user and it is transparent to my process so I hope to be able to continue using it.
 
Hope that answers your question.
 
Do you know if there is a way to contact Noel or someone who might be able to implement this change for me?
 
Michael

Thanks Rocky. I tried to PM Noel but I have only been a member of this forum for one day and you have be a member for three... So I will wait...
 
Michael

That would be fantastic Noel. I would be willing to update to the latest version, I am using X2 Producer, if I could import these files.
As a note, I am generating the 48 channel and above wav files in exactly the same way I am generating the 24 and 8 channel files that do import.
 
My 144 channel test file is 254 MB. How is the best way for me to send it to you?
 
Thanks tons,
 
Michael

Just put a link to some test files on google drive or yousendit or something and send me the link.

Thanks tons Noel.
 
Michael

Hi Mike,
 
This is a little known and even less understood approach to musical composition. I basically program the computer to do the composing, which I then edit. I feel it is the next step in musical composition. Because I can do so much more when assisted by the computer, the music has an exponentially large range of possibility. So the music sounds foreign to people right now.  I use AI to extend the possibility of music. (AI in this case stands for Augmented Intelligence, not Artificial Intelligence.)
 
I render these files "natively" from Csound in multi-channel formats. I write algorithms that, among many other things, create spatial relationships amongst the sounds. For home playback I often mix these compositions down to 4.1. But they are intended for the concert hall where they are played back, usually, using Pro Tools. I also play the multi-channel files for art installations and for that I use Sonar or Ableton Live. 
 
One of my areas of focus is 3D spatialization, where I not only have speakers left and right (1d - stereo), front and back (2d - quad) but also top and bottom (3d). So all three spatial dimensions are used. I programmed a system of Cartesian Coordinates in Csound that stipulate where, within the 3d Cube, a sound exists and if it is to be perceived as moving, how it moves... 
 
So, as you can see, I cannot render a 144 channel file in separate channels any more than one could do so with a stereo file. It is not really practical.
 
You can find out more about my work at http://www.perceptionfactory.com
 
Thanks for your interest and I hope that answers your question,
 
Michael

That all sounds spot on Noel. I did not realize that Sonar uses an aspect of Directshow to import sound files. That explains why ProTools can do it... they probably use their own protocols.
 
I am checking into Csound supporting WAVEFORMEXTENSIBLE but from what I see in the manuals and and other documentation it does not look like it does. Sounds like it would be a workaround.... but if it worked that is all that matters.
 
Thanks a lot.
 
Michael
 
 

This was very indicative of why I have stuck with CAKE since the late 80s.  You guys always go the extra mile.  This feature does nothing for me but the fact that you (Noel) jumped on this as an opportunity is really impressive.
 
Thanks a TON for all you do from one end user,
Jim

Wow. That's great. I wonder though with so few affected by this issue, actually just the one person we know of, why this issue has got such immediate attention. Just asking for understanding!

This is a great learning opportunity when you get involved in the discussion Noël. Thanks..

Also, Noel, I do truly appreciate the attention you are giving this issue when I am apparently the only one affected by it... right now... I think as time passes large numbers of speakers will be incorporated into many more facilities including homes... Right now there are some progressive movie theaters that are using 3D spatialization and games are beginning to incorporate it as well... So this is the future!!
 
Thanks for understanding!!