Helpful ReplyInteresting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues

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fireberd
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2017/02/05 11:52:25 (permalink)

Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues

I have an MOTU 896mk3 Hybrid which has both USB 2.0 and Firewire connectivity.  I had two new MOTU 896mk3 Hybrid's.  The first one was sent back and later a second one was purchased (and I still have it).  The MOTU replaced a Roland Octa-Capture that had no problems with the USB 3.0 port so I reused the USB cable from the Octa-Capture with the MOTU.  I would get intermittent dropouts.  With the second one I finally realized I had USB 2.0 ports on the front panel and tried one of those and NO dropouts. 
 
When I built my new PC, back in early December, it only has USB 3.0 ports so I ordered a PCIe Firewire 400/800 card with a T.I. Chipset.  I'm using that and no problems (and same low latency).
 
There is a thread on the Gearslutz forum about "MOTU Windows 10 Stability" which turned out to be others complaining about the USB 3.0 dropouts with MOTU USB units.  Something to be aware of if you buy a MOTU unit with only USB 2.0 connectivity.  In somewhat defense of MOTU they only mention USB 2.0 on the page for the 896mk3 Hybrid, although USB 3.0 port is supposed to be backward compatible with USB 2.0.  I have many old USB 2.0 devices and they work without problems on USB 3.0. Even my old Frontier Tranzport that was built in the Vista days before USB 3.0 was even thought of works OK with USB 3.0 port and Win 10 (although I had to install the Tranzport Vista driver in a compatibility mode when I installed it in Win 10).
 
Here is the link to the gearslutz thread:
 https://www.gearslutz.com...dows-10-stability.html

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Cactus Music
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/02/05 20:00:04 (permalink)
I've got my sights set on this one.  It totally has exactly what I need and then extra via the digital. 
The fact that it is also a stand alone mixer with remote control is the icing on the cake. I was looking seriously at all the new digital mixers and this is the same price point and it's a Motu, I would imagine none of those other brand, Behringer or Soundcraft have as good a driver as a Motu.  Very rare to find any negative reviews of Motu interfaces.  
My computers all have both USB 2.0 and 3.0 so I'm OK for now. But I was planing on a new laptop to use with this live and I don't think USB 2.0 is an option anymore.  
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/UltraLite4


Johnny V  
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#2
dwardzala
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/02/05 21:29:46 (permalink)
I'm wrestling with this as well.  For me, its between this one and the Tascam 20x20.  My studio rig has USB 2.0 (its got a few years on it) but my laptop only has USB 3.0.  This would be a no brainer for me if it weren't for the reported driver issues.  I may still end up with it, though.

Dave
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#3
Cactus Music
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/02/06 12:08:18 (permalink)
Ya but now there are reports of issues with Tascam drivers too. It will be fixed no doubt as both company's seem on the ball about drivers. Tascam in tha past sucked but they certainly have improved since Gibson took over and they are apparently writing their own now. And I would think the Motu issue will be quickly resolved. It seems it only certain interfaces anyhow same as the Tascam issue. Probably all related to W10 updates screwing things up.
 
 
 
 
 

Johnny V  
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My Build i5 quad core 16 Gigs RAM  W10 
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Musician since 1964, Studio since 1984, Cakewalk since 2004.  
http://www.cactusmusic.ca/
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#4
fireberd
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/02/06 12:41:04 (permalink)
Its not just Win 10.  I had a dual boot with Win 7/Win 10 when I got the MOTU and I had the same problem on both.
 
From posts on the referenced Gearslutz thread it doesn't look too promising for new MOTU drivers and responses some have got from MOTU.  I opened a problem with MOTU when I had the first unit and MOTU responded timely and was friendly but I got the impression nothing was going to happen even when I reported that it worked OK on USB 2.0 but not with USB 3.0 ports.
 
As I mentioned on another thread, based on responses I got from MOTU, I won't be buying any more MOTU.

Franklin D-10 Pedal Steel Guitar (primary instrument). Dobro, Tele, Gretsch Chet Atkins, 4 and 5 string basses, etc. 
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Jim Roseberry
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/02/06 13:31:18 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Mystic38 2017/02/25 07:25:52
FWIW, Even if your motherboard only has USB3 ports in the backplane area, most have two USB-2 headers where you can connect a USB2 bracket (less than $10).  
 
Most issues with USB-2 audio interfaces result from connecting them to third-party (non-Intel) USB-3 controllers.
Very similar to connecting a Firewire audio interface to a non-TI Chipset Firewire controller.

Best Regards,

Jim Roseberry
jim@studiocat.com
www.studiocat.com
#6
bitflipper
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/02/06 14:18:07 (permalink)
Jim, a general question re USB 2/3...my laptop has both. Except for my external disk drive, I just use whichever port is physically convenient. I don't use a USB audio interface, so we're talking slow devices such as mice and MIDI controllers. If speed is not an issue, is there any reason to make a point of matching USB3 devices to USB3 ports and USB2 to USB2? Power limitations, perhaps?


All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. 

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dwardzala
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/02/06 14:32:09 (permalink)
Jim Roseberry
FWIW, Even if your motherboard only has USB3 ports in the backplane area, most have two USB-2 headers where you can connect a USB2 bracket (less than $10).  
 
Most issues with USB-2 audio interfaces result from connecting them to third-party (non-Intel) USB-3 controllers.
Very similar to connecting a Firewire audio interface to a non-TI Chipset Firewire controller.


Good info to know.  My desktop rig has both USB2 and USB 3 (but I think I have to choose between SATA 3 and USB 3 - its an old MB) so I don't think I have an issue there.
 
Jim, my laptop is the concern as it only has USB 3 ports.  Do Sager/Clevo machines use Intel USB 3 controllers (and if this is some of your special sauce that you would prefer not to share - I understand)?
post edited by dwardzala - 2017/02/06 17:53:46

Dave
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soens
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/02/06 17:04:04 (permalink)
This has to be my problem as my new laptop only has USB 3, which, contrary to popular advertisement, is NOT 100% backward compatible.
 

The beauty of USB 3.0 is its backward compatibility with USB 2.0; you need a new cable and new host adapter (or, one of the Asus or Gigabyte motherboards that supports USB 3.0) to achieve USB 3.0, but you can still use the device on a USB 2.0 port and achieve typical USB 2.0 performance.
www.pcworld.com/article/186566/USB_3_Finally_Arrives.html

 
My MOTU unit is only a few years old but will not work with USB 3.
 
My Behringer works sometimes/sometimes not with USB 3. It also does weird things like slowely light up the transport buttons one by one until they're all lit when using Kontakt player standalone.
post edited by soens - 2017/02/06 17:38:59
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dwardzala
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/02/06 17:53:10 (permalink)
Soens, are you on Win 10?  If not, it definitely won't work.  USB 3 on Win 7 is problematic for almost every interface.

Dave
Main Studio- Core i5 @2.67GHz, 16Gb Ram, (2) 500Gb HDs, (1) 360 Gb HD
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#10
fireberd
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/02/07 06:50:55 (permalink)
My old system had both Intel and ASMedia USB 3.0 ports.  Had dropouts on both. 
My new motherboard has Intel USB 3.0 and ASMedia USB 3.1 controllers.  The motherboard has one internal USB 2.0 motherboard connector but it is being used by the Corsair H100i CPU cooler interface.  I have both USB 3.0 and USB 2.0 connections on the BeQuiet Silent Base 600 case front panel but I can't use the USB 2.0 because the Corsair is using the motherboard connection.  I could have installed a second PCIe USB 2.0 port card but I opted to install the Firewire card and use that for my MOTU.  I have one 5 port PCIe USB 2.0 port card but that is being used by my 5 USB connected CD/DVD burners stack that I use for audio CD production (I can burn 5 audio CD's at one time using Nero BurningROM).
 
I have a Toshiba touch screen laptop with Intel USB 3.0 ports (only USB 3.0) and the MOTU does not "play well" with it either.

Franklin D-10 Pedal Steel Guitar (primary instrument). Dobro, Tele, Gretsch Chet Atkins, 4 and 5 string basses, etc. 
ASUS Maximus VIII Hero M/B, i7 6700K CPU, 16GB Ram, SSD and conventional hard drives, Win 10 Pro and Win 10 Pro Insider Pre-Release
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#11
dwardzala
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/02/07 18:01:47 (permalink)
I can't quote myself, but I have answered my own question - my Sager/Clevo shell has an Intel USB controller.

Dave
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#12
HARDDRlVER
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/03/16 09:01:04 (permalink)
Hello peoples.
I'm kinda new on the Cakewalk websiter.
I took advantage of the platinum lifetime update deal they had at Christmas.
At the same time, Waves was having a screaming deal on their $4,000 Horizon bundle at $900. They also had the $1,200 Abbey Road Collection on sale for $499. I grabbed both.
It's all running on my Sony Vaio laptop. i7ore 8 thread. 7200 rpm, 8gb ram. Win 7 64 bit
USB 2.0, 3.0, FW.

I have a MOTU midi express XT USB (the new model). It was a bear to get it to play nice with my system. I had its USB 2.0 port hooked to the laptop's 3.0. Motu support said not only do I need to hook it to the 2.0 port on my laptop, but it also needs to go through a powered USB 2.0 hub. It CANNOT be hooked up to anything 3.0. And it WILL NOT be happy just going through the laptop's 2.0 port without first going through a powered hub. Well, it seemed to work.
So now my focus is on either the motu 828mk3 hybrid or 896mk3 hybrid. I would prefer a Presonus 192 studio, but now I'm starting to hear bad things. Both motu models has two adat hookups which can be configured as stereo optical connections, which is exactly what I need. While the Presonus has two adat hookups, only one can be configured as stereo optical.
So it's a toss up.
Motu with two optical but only USB 2.0 and FW
or
Presonus with only one stereo optical BUT USB 3.0

Decisions decisions.
#13
Jim Roseberry
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/03/16 10:42:38 (permalink)
bitflipper
Jim, a general question re USB 2/3...my laptop has both. Except for my external disk drive, I just use whichever port is physically convenient. I don't use a USB audio interface, so we're talking slow devices such as mice and MIDI controllers. If speed is not an issue, is there any reason to make a point of matching USB3 devices to USB3 ports and USB2 to USB2? Power limitations, perhaps?

Just saw this... sorry for the slow response. 
 
Unless you're pushing the bandwidth with the connected peripheral, no... I see no pressing reason to worry about USB-2 vs. USB-3.  iLok and eLicense keys, keyboards/mice, and other low bandwidth (simple) devices aren't finicky about the USB controller.  If you need to conserve USB ports, you can put several low bandwidth peripherals on a USB hub.  If it's just dongles, you can put those on a passive USB hub.
 
Prior to Z77 chipsets, literally *ALL* USB-3 controllers were 3rd-party add-on (as USB-3 was not yet integrated into the Intel chipset).  Similar to using a non-TI chipset Firewire controller, this opens the door for compatibility issues.
A lot of the issues reported with USB-3 and audio/MIDI interfaces are related to this.
Virtually all desktop motherboards have a USB-2 header... so you can add a pair of USB-2 ports for under $10.
With a laptop, you're obviously stuck with what's provided.  If it's recent make (Intel motherboard), you've got Intel USB-3... which generally works well.

Best Regards,

Jim Roseberry
jim@studiocat.com
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maltastudio
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/05/09 20:13:25 (permalink)
I just got the motu 624 and im having a nightmare to make it work with a particular laptop with win 10,4 days i`v been trying in vain.
The funny thing is that it works perfect on a very old pc i have with win 10.
There must be a problem with the new usb 3.0 chipset.
Peace

Maltastudio
 
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fireberd
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Re: Interesting Thread on Gearslutz about MOTU USB 3.0 Issues 2017/05/09 22:17:00 (permalink)
I just worked a problem on the sevenforums.com help forum. User has a new Z270 PC and his MOTU Ultralite MK3 is having "realtime peaks in Cubase" and intermittent crackle issues with his new PC that only has USB 3.0 ports (at least on the rear I/O panel).  

Franklin D-10 Pedal Steel Guitar (primary instrument). Dobro, Tele, Gretsch Chet Atkins, 4 and 5 string basses, etc. 
ASUS Maximus VIII Hero M/B, i7 6700K CPU, 16GB Ram, SSD and conventional hard drives, Win 10 Pro and Win 10 Pro Insider Pre-Release
Sonar Platinum 64 bit. MOTU 896MK3 Hybrid, Tranzport, X-Touch, JBL LSR308 Monitors,  
Ozone, (backup unit Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 2nd Gen)

ISRC Registered

Member of Nashville based R.O.P.E. Assn.
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