Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible?

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beneaththesoil
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2006/06/16 20:22:24 (permalink)

Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible?

I just got a response from Toontrack saying that MC3 is not compatible with Ezdrummer because it does not have VSTi support. The thing is, I can run FL6 in VSTi mode and it works fine. Does anyone know if MC3 will work with Ezdrummer? I know what VST is but havent a clue what VSTi is.

Ezdrummer looks fantastic from what I've seen and heard and, I will upgrade to Sonar if necessary. I was just hoping it would be later than sooner.

If your interested check it out here.

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22 Replies Related Threads

    Beagle
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/16 21:10:22 (permalink)
    VTSi - I forgot what it stands for exactly, but it's a Virtual Instrument and MC3 does support VTSi. Will EZDrummer work with it? I don't know that for certain. I do know that EZDrummer will work with Sonar Home Studio 4. I suspect that EZDrummer will work in MC3, but I don't know anyone who has specifically tried it. The guys who ordered EZD on the SHS forum LOVE it!

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    #2
    beneaththesoil
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/16 22:05:44 (permalink)
    Thanks Beagle!

    I figure that Toontrack didn't test Ezd with MC3 and thats why they are saying it's not supported. I think that I'm going to order it as my fathers day present for myself , and see if it works. If it doesn't, then i'll just have to keep it until, I can upgrade to Sonar. I need to upgrade to Sonar one of these days anyway.

    I would be more than iffy, if I couldn't run FL6 in VSTi mode but, it works fine. I understand their stance though. If, they said that it worked with any program that supports VST, I'm sure they would be swamped with support calls by folks who dont even know what a VST folder is.

    I really appreciate the quick response.

    Thanks again,
    Rich

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    Robomusic
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/17 18:15:22 (permalink)
    Want a little tip on drum programs, google one called jamstix, will will really love it.

    I'd Seize the day but i can't quite reach it!

    http://www.acidplanet.com/artist.asp?AID=33477&T=1260
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    beneaththesoil
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/17 18:56:05 (permalink)
    Thanks Robomusic but, no thanks. I tried the Jamstix demo and really didn't care for it at all. Not that it's a bad program at all, I think it's pretty cool actually.

    But, it really doesn't do metal all that well and I'm not really looking for something with another huge learning curve. I have MC3 and DFH2 right now so, I can program my own drums. Not very well mind you but, learning how a drummer might do things is improving me as a musician. And, with the piano roll I can edit 'till my heart's content.

    The reason that I am so interested in Ezdrummer is that it just looks so...... EZ. Find a MIDI loop that goes with the tune, and drag and drop. I am particularly interested in the DFH pack that will be coming out this fall.

    The other reason I am so interested in ezdrummer is that it comes packed with MIDI drum loops. Something I used to get for free from mysongbook.com and open with guitarpro software. Now, due to copyright BS, I cant download anything except user compositions from there. It was a good thing while it lasted though, i would find a drum beat in a song that worked with what I was doing, edit as needed, and Voila! instant drums that sounded nice.

    Thanks for your suggestion though, I appreciate it.

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    #5
    Robomusic
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/17 19:03:32 (permalink)
    I gottcha, that is a good way, but bear in mind that Jamstix can be used as an arranger as well, just drop in any midi loop and work from it, or use the arranger view, and you can plug DKFH in it as the sound. also you can mute the brain and it will follow any midi pattern. but having said that always go with what is comfortable for you. another real ggod program is PC drummer. it uses audio drum samples., or one real good way is to use drum loops and drum one shots (single hits) and custom make the tracks, these really sound good and do not have the midi curse (to robot like)

    I'd Seize the day but i can't quite reach it!

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    beneaththesoil
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/17 22:08:48 (permalink)
    Have you checked out Ezdrummer Robo? You can drop in any MIDI file in that as well.

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    Robomusic
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/18 02:35:52 (permalink)
    No i have not, but i do not built from midi loops, i find the arranger in jamstix to be so easy. and it gives me a finsihed result that sounds far more like a real drummer than just driving samples with a midi drum tracks, but having said that i might check it out i am always open to ideas. I imagine it is abit like PC drummer or leaf drums, or maybe a bit more complex session drummer.

    I'd Seize the day but i can't quite reach it!

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    #8
    beneaththesoil
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/18 18:10:55 (permalink)
    Robomusic,

    Check these out and you tell me if the demo's have the MIDI curse. Thats why I am so interested in the product. Now, who knows if I'll get results anywhere near as good as the demos. But, I am hopefull, although I've been burned before and will be again.

    What I do when dealing with MIDI for my drums is two things. One, I edit the crap out of them using MC3's velocity and quantize tools so I can eliminate the machine gun effect. Two, I use Drumkit From Hell 2 as a plugin and it has left and right hand hits on almost every drum so I generally edit the GM file to use both hands/feet if you will.

    Ezdrummer will do all of this for me I believe. It has a humanize and velocity adjustments and will supposedly work with any MIDI file.

    I just ordered it today and I am really hopefull that it works with MC3, if not, I have FL6 to use it with but, I really dont like that program much. And right now, I'm very happy with MC3 and I dont have the cash to upgrade to Sonar. When I get it up and running I'll share the results.

    BTW, I was in no way bashing JS. It just isnt for me. I think that it is an excellent program with alot of potential.

    To alcohol! The cause of...and solution to... all of life's problems!
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    Robomusic
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/18 22:38:15 (permalink)
    The rub on JS is that it is way to busy, but i have found that once you work with it a while that starts to be more controllable, having said that not every program is for everyone, we all have different workflows and different mind set. I would love to hear about your experience with EZD and what works well for you with it. I do not think it will be a big problem as MC3 does VSTis, however i have big problems with MC# and VSTIs, i think there is a bug in the wraper with MC#. I admit i do most of my tracking in MTS (multitrack studios) if is flawless with most VSTi and has the best workflow i have ever used, I would buy Sonar, but i do not use havf of the things it offers, I also beleive that the biggest problem with Sonar is that it does too much. simplicity is the best feature in MTS, if i want looping i have Acid Pro, If if want midi I have MC3 and Power tracks 10, If i want to mess with Video, i use Vegas 4.0, If i want to track a full song both midi and audio with samples and synths, tons of effects i use MTS.

    I'd Seize the day but i can't quite reach it!

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    Beagle
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/19 08:14:42 (permalink)
    I've downloaded the JS demo and you're right - it's way too busy! Very complicated and will take a lot of work to figure out how to use it properly. Gotta read the manual just to figure out what the stuff means! I'm NOT a drummer and don't really even understand the difference between high hat and open cymbals!

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    Robomusic
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/19 14:09:23 (permalink)
    Most people make the mistake of tryin JS in the free jam mode, that take work, try it in the manual mode and even mute the brain and let it follow the midi track. EZD is a lite version or DKFH and many JS users use it inside of JS to be the sample sound, but find that JS give far more flexability to create. EZD has tons or loops and great samples but the playback is still just following midi protocol, even if you humnize it still does this according to old sytle patterns, where JS actually thinks and learns. But I will say it is much more to learn, that is for sure, and it take alot of work, but nothing good comes easy right?
    post edited by Robomusic - 2006/06/19 14:20:00

    I'd Seize the day but i can't quite reach it!

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    Beagle
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/19 16:05:32 (permalink)
    I can't wait to get home tonight to play with it. I will try your suggestions.

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    joeh20_444
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/19 18:45:55 (permalink)
    I'm gonna vote a different way, nskit_7 full with HALion player. It costs quite a bit more than DKFH 2 (not superior, i don't think). The total price leans to about 250 for everything if I remember right, unless you already have a steinberg key. That gives you 18 gigs of drum sounds with updates. The kits are meant to be played on a keyboard, and they are done very well. I've got my POD's expression pedal rigged to control the hihat openness, I really like the feel of it. Just an idea.
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    Beagle
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/19 20:09:23 (permalink)
    thanks for the tip, joe, my budget is a little more limited, unfortunately. something about the kids eating or something... i don't know what she's talking about!

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
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    joeh20_444
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/20 00:08:05 (permalink)
    Beagle (and fellow Trekkie, apparantly...),

    I understand, to an extent. For a more affordable solution, you might consider something like the free nskit and something like sfz. Also, DR008 (99 bucks) comes with really good kits. I'm going to assume EZDrummer's good, but I've never used it, so can't officially recommend it. I would, however, recommend to start learning playing drums on a MIDI keyboard. It's a lot more human than any other synthesized way.
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    Beagle
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/20 06:43:06 (permalink)
    thanks, joe! I'll look into those.

    I've been trying to play drums on my keyboard with my songs so far - but it's a long slow process!

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    beneaththesoil
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/23 19:20:45 (permalink)
    Thanks for your help folks.

    Ezdrummer works flawlessly with MC3, contrary to what Toontrack stated.

    I just got it on Tuesday and I love it!

    Here is a sample of an imported GuitarPro drum MIDI file. No tweaks, no nothing. Just Ezdrummer triggered by a MIDI file created by someone I dont know.

    Thanks again fellas.

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    Beagle
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/24 08:42:11 (permalink)
    Not bad. there are few times throughout the clip that didn't sound quite 'human' - but overall it was really good.

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
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    Robomusic
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/24 17:25:40 (permalink)
    The Drums sounds are very nice good quality samples, but the track is very "stiff" very much midi like, the timing is perfect, and as we all know real drummers are not, the rolls are so tight they are obviously midi to my ear. Now that is ot all bad, in a good mix they will sound real enough for most situation, the fills are the same each time with midi, that is why i like JamStix the fills will be a tad different, and the overall feel will be much more real, now i will admit it takes some learning to tame the beast as i said before, but it can be done. JS is not just a midi sample player, it is interactive and has far more adjustable features than a program like EZD, which is a light version of DKFH. there are many that use the full version of DKFH in JS as the samples. So if you liek EZD then i say use it you will get very nice results, and it will sound very nice, but for me i want more of a live drummer feel.

    I'd Seize the day but i can't quite reach it!

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    beneaththesoil
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/24 21:23:44 (permalink)
    OK Robomusic, you win. Here is the same file running through Jamstix. JS brain muted and, I really have no idea what I'm doing with that program. And it still sounds worlds better. Forgive the blank's, I just have the demo. It sounds much more human to my ears and I'm sure it will to yours as well.

    Thanks Robo, for getting me to purchase another f'n software program. And my time also thanks you because, now I'll have to spend hours upon hours learning to use it. You bastard!!! :)

    Do you mind a few questions here and there as I learn how to incorporate it Robomusic?

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    joeh20_444
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/25 01:38:24 (permalink)
    Yea, you have to realize no matter what format you get your midi track (be it loops, JS, etc.), there is always tweaking that should be done. Varying velocities is a great way to do this. Ghost notes help. Do a search for "drum programming" I know the guy w/the SN blinddog started a post about that that was greatly educational. HTH.
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    Robomusic
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    RE: Is CWMC3 VSTi compatible? 2006/06/25 02:52:46 (permalink)
    Ask an questions you need to I will always answer if i can, if not then do not forget to read all the post at JS forum and ask Ralph the tough one he seems to really love to help.

    The thing with JS is that it just has so much that one can do to tweak the sounds. I personally have not even experimented with the tip of the iceburg there.

    I'd Seize the day but i can't quite reach it!

    http://www.acidplanet.com/artist.asp?AID=33477&T=1260
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