Is The Grass Really any Greener ? Studio One 2.5

 
 I got an email for Studio One 2 Producer( not professional) and on the Presonus website the update to 2.5 seems to be free. I can get the whole thing for 84.00 at audio deluxe.com. Presonus is running a month long sale so you can get Studio one Pro there for 99.00.
 
 I tried Studio One Artist  awhile back and I wasn't impressed at all. At least not comparing it to something like Sonar Producer. I already have Melodyne but it isn't integrated as well as it is in Studio One ,although I don't think the producer version gives you Melodyne.The only real difference between artist and producer is the ability to import mp3 and the use of third party vst. Producer has Rewire though which I like but it is only 32 bit :(.  On the flipside, it has VST 3. 
 
  I don't really need a bunch more plug-ins. I already have several guitar amp simms so none of that really means much to me personally. I'm not interested in a partial copy of Guitar rig or Komplete...I have a Presonus interface and they claim that it's easier to incorporate zero latency monitoring with one of their interfaces. That's a plus.
 
 They seem to have done some cool things with track comping in making takes to another comp. track automatic and a speedy workflow to combine different parts of your takes. They have taken the feeze track function to a whole new level. It seems easier to turn a midi synth into an audio track which you can edit. If you load a multi out synth it seems much easier to load a multi and have everything assigned on the fly to its own output. But this is all their own description. I am curious as to how this works in real life.
 
 I really wish they offered producer in 64 bit. The 32 bit is a real turn off. Especially since I think Sonar 64bit needs a 64 bit rewire client.
 
 I have mastering tools so I'm not convinced that an upgrade to the pro version is really any advantage....and Sound Cloud...that's nice, but it isn't  much trouble to make a completed master and upload directly to the site and we already have this in Sonar X2.
 
 Head to head it seems that there are only a few small advantages. But considering others...  Pro Tools 11 is 699.00. Studio One 2 seems to be  more user friendly and feature intensive than the likes of Magix or Reaper. Not that those are bad programs at all but Studio One 2 seems to be a little further along in development. Apple are giving a heck of a deal on Logic at 199.00. For anyone who owns an Apple that's pretty much a no brainer for the likes of Logic. Cubase seems to have set themselves back a few notches with that ugly GUI they came up with.
 
 I'm not an unhappy Sonar user, just tempted to sample the grass on the other side of the fence.
 
Opinions? Any of you use it regularly? I don't plan on it displacing  Sonar X2, but I did think that it could be an asset in some cases. Pros, Cons?
 
 

I use it often, not as often as Sonar, but then I've been using Sonar since it was CWPA<G>, so I am biased.
 
I like the audio workflow a lot, but MIDI and VI stuff is still not quite there.
 
It's a very cool tool, and I am anxious to see just how far they take it!

I've been using S1 for a little while.  I like the GUI and the straightforward functionality -- it seems more intuitive and coherent than Sonar X2 overall.  It just seems to be a better thought-out product, one that started out relatively recently as a clean-sheet design rather than something that's evolved over many years.
 
I've used a few third-party VIs so far (e.g. SD2) and have had no issues.  Seems pretty solid, although I don't do a lot of MIDI-based work.
 
S1 is much better for audio tuning, whether you use Melodyne or something else like Waves Tune.  These don't play well with Sonar so much.  Also, S1's audio editing is easier in many ways.  Quantizing audio, detecting transients, etc. is much more straightforward, I find.
 
S1's suite of stock plugins puts Sonar's to shame.  Nice set of tools there.  You can even do a ProChannel type of thing with mini-GUIs in the console view.
 
Sonar has some nice features that S1 does not, such as the Smart Tool and the built-in ability to run 32-bit plugins.  I've customized S1's default keyboard shortcuts a bit to resemble those I've become accustomed to in Sonar, such as hitting "s" to split a track.  This partially makes up for the lack of a context-sensitive Smart Tool thingy.
 
The S1 Professional version can be demoed, which I highly recommend doing.  Some users have issues with performance, such as CPU spikes, but this seems to be very system-dependent.  So I'd say a full demo is essential before making the purchase.  Good luck!
 
Cheers,
Eddie
 

I love it, does everything I need. Less features but I haven't had a crash or hang in over 2 years. And a genuinely gapless engine, I rarely press stop
Hth

Studio One is 64 bit. Under pressure the program behaves much better than most. It is very very stable and it never falls over really. Something that is important to me when working to tight deadlines.
 
Midi is fine. I have quite a large midi setup externally and it all works a treat with the external hardware.
 
They are not late to the game. The original coders worked for Steinberg  back in the 80's so they have a wealth of experience.
 
It can do many things Sonar cannot. eg jumping midi tracks on the fly when looping/recording/playing etc.. Best takes/layers/comping available. Great automation. etc true gapless engine. It goes on.
 
It is not feature laden. That is the whole point. It has a solid framework that just works right now and they expect you to have many third party plugs that will work with it usually perfectly eg synths and extra plugins.
 
It is NOT fussy about computer specs and interfaces, it will work with everything pretty well.
 
It is the only DAW that has been re written from the ground up and they took two years off to do it, something many DAW companies could not do these days.
 
It is one of the most reliable and stable DAW's in the world right now.

I have the Studio One Pro version as well... I don't use it much because I really only want to know one DAW.
 
I agree with the guys that have pointed out how fantastic it is.
 
 

I own both SONAR X2 and Studio One 2.5 Producer. They are both great programs.
 
I use Studio One exclusively for the Project View, for mastering and publishing. It is fantastic. I'd say "nothing else comes close" but I haven't used that many other apps... but that said, I can't believe anything else comes close.
 
I have not "moved on" from SONAR - all my projects are created and tracked in SONAR X2, and I'm using it despite my misgivings about the whole "X" series.

I've been with Cake since Sonar Studio 6 & have updated all the way to Sonar X1d-X2a.
 
I also have Studio One Professional 2.5.
 
Because I do mostly MIDI, I was not as productive in Studio One as I had hoped - definitely not as well as Sonar in that regard.
 
 
Studio One would not record nor playback certain aspects of 'advanced MIDI use', where as Sonar had no trouble either way.
 
So that was a deal breaker for me. I doubt I'll pay for the next update, unless they do the completely unanticipated, and break out some serious MIDI enhancements.
 
I was also disappointed to learn that Presonus are admittedly not all that concerned with adding/updating MIDI features, and seem to gloss over it at large. There's even a line in their manual - "Look Mom - NO MIDI".
 
Now that would be the last thing I would boast about!
 
There is apparently 2.6 coming out in a few weeks, [based on the last Presonus live broadcast with Rodney Orphus], but it seems that us MIDI users are consistently past over in light of other feature and additions.
 
For those that do mostly audio, I think they would really like it. Stability is excellent.
 
I will definitely be checking out the Mastering options & features in Studio one though, as they do look top notch.
 
In the meantime, I've recently bought Cubase 7.0.5, and I'm really enjoying it so far.
 
So because of that, that now makes Studio One 2.5 my #3 DAW - out of 3.
 
But many like Studio One, and it would be easy to see why, once you get familiar with it.

jim usic,
 
Thanks for your review! The midi would be my main interest. Guess I will just put it on my watch list.
 
It does look like there will be an announcement tomorrow afternoon by Presonus, maybe it will be the 2.6 ver. I did visit their forum and see a few old Sonar users over there but not many are speaking too highly about the midi implementation within Studio One. It does seem like the audio only folks really like it.
 
Thanks again,
Rick

carl
I bought Studio One originally to get the full version of Melodyne for $149.00.
I was very impressed with Studio Ones gapless audio & other features but now Cubase is getting used here more.
Great to hear 2.6 is coming. Cubase 7.0.6 & free update will be released Sept. 19 too.

Yes - I scooped up full Melodyne for $149.00 as well.
 
I really like the advanced MIDI options in Cubase.
 
Cubase 7.0.6 soon? 
 
Another update already?
 
Wow!
 
I'm lovin' it even more - especially with the free version of HALion 4 - & free update to 5 just recently. 
 
Rock on!

It depends on what midi features you need to get the job done well. I am a live player and it records all live in parts well. You can quantise anything, alter velocties, note positions, start points, durations etc. You can step time notes in. There a many midi operations that can be performed. You have all the normal midi event options in terms of editing. You can draw in automation over any number of midi parameters. You can scale things up/down and transpose anything. You can slip tracks either to play early or late. You can now edit multiple midi parts at once on the same page.
 
I find it controls all my external synths beautifully. Midi timing is tight and plays back perfectly to the click and is not influenced by how hard the audio side of the program is working. You can set up a loop and jump midi tracks all on the fly gaplessly and either record, rehearse and play over existing midi data. (Sonar wont allow this for some reason) Not sure how much more midi you need.

 
There is no event list for getting in and pulling out rogue information. There is no means of using third party midi plugins which is a shame. But for me it still kicks ass midi wise and has never held me back ever.

Rick - I can answer that.
 
The higher versions of Studio One will scan and use your 3rd party VSTs.
 
You may have to add the path, but that's it.
 
I'm not entirely sure if it is in the Producer version, but I have that ability in the Professional version for sure.
 
But unlike Sonar & Cubase, there is no built-in bridge in Studio One for your 32 bit plugs - in any version .
 
Your only option there is an outside bridge like 'jbridge' - about $20.00
 
Looks like the top 2 versions will support 3rd party plugs. Check out the versions in this link.
 
http://studioone.presonus.com/what-are-the-versions/
 
 

 
 Thanks Dave,Stickman,Mike,Jeff,Bill, Eddie,cclarry and lawp.
 
 Appreciate your insights.Thanks for your comments.  For the price of a mediocre plug-in I can get Studio One 2 Producer,although not as sweet a deal as when the Professional version was out for the same price. From what I'm reading some of you say, it makes a good complimentary program to Sonar. 
 
  Since Sonar started out as a midi program , I guess that explains its strengths in midi although it doesn't appear that  Studio One 2 is a slouch regarding midi either. I don't think the price of admission to "get in the game" is high especially if there are improvements coming along soon.
 
 Jeff are you sure the Professional version of the program is 64 bit? I was pretty sure only the Producer version was 64 capable. I run a 64 bit computer and this is important to me.It looked to me as if only the highest version offered 64 bit capability. This seems a bit like they're shooting themselves in the behind on this. I  own Sony Acid Pro 7 which is way overdue for a rebuild. I had thought that it being 32 bit wouldn't interfere with rewire but it does. 32 and 64 bit rewire don't play well together,so trying to rewire a 32 bit program into something like Sonar X2 64 is a no go. I would like to rewire my DAW software together and directly input and sync tracks from one to the other without needing to add yet another program to make that work. This avoids importing files manually and saves a ton of time.
 
 I had thought I would use midi a lot so I am set up for it, but in the end I seem to be recording a lot of audio. The only midi I work with is basic. I seldom, if ever, build a song with midi as the general construct. I might use it here and there more like a ****e than a main course, so I don't really need extensive midi at this point. 
 
 Even though I have T-Racks and Ozone for mastering I like what I'm reading about the metering capabilities for mastering in SO2.  Ideally a person could take two good DAWS, rewire them together and use the best of each if your computer can handle it.Even for track transfer it would be great.
 
 It seems like SO2 has come up with some novel ideas regarding soft synths. I'm not seeing the weakness there yet, at least for midi on an intermediate level.If there are some decent plug-ins in SO2 it can't hurt to scan them and load them into Sonar. I don't think I would buy it just for the plug-ins though.

Guess I was lazy in my previous post...
 

Jeff Evans
Midi is fine. I have quite a large midi setup externally and it all works a treat with the external hardware.

 
OK, I wasn't lazy on this point... I still have two racks of MIDI synthesizers, and one rack of MIDI enabled processors, and I still use them. And that's on top of the usual virtual instruments, which are still MIDI targets, or at least behave as such in most DAWs.
 
My major concerns about MIDI in Studio One are:
1) hardware set up - Sonar is a little more complex, but a lot more flexible. I'm still finding ways to streamline external MIDI device management in Studio One, and I am confident that the next release will address it, but for now I find Sonar easier. Not every one will.
2) CC Data - neither sequencer handles CC data as well as Bars&Pipes<G>, and I really wish they did. For me (again just me) to move from one platform to the next this is an area that I have to see as a major improvement.
 
My other concern is that Studio One is no better at conforming to a specific tempo map than Sonar.
 

Jeff EvansThey are not late to the game. The original coders worked for Steinberg  back in the 80's so they have a wealth of experience.

 
Apologies, but the company has said as much, they are the most recent product to hit the market, in fact they use that as a way of differentiating themselves. I think being late to the game has worked to their advantage... the programmers did work at Steinberg, and as a result they know a few things to avoid<G>!
 

Jeff EvansIt can do many things Sonar cannot. eg jumping midi tracks on the fly when looping/recording/playing etc.. Best takes/layers/comping available. Great automation. etc true gapless engine. It goes on.

 
I've never been one to worry about the gapless thing - just not in my workflow, but it is rock solid, even if you aren't pushing it. I would agree that the comping and take management is awesome, and better than Sonar X2 for now. Automation needs some work, I think (see above), but it works.
 

Jeff EvansIt is not feature laden. That is the whole point. It has a solid framework that just works right now and they expect you to have many third party plugs that will work with it usually perfectly eg synths and extra plugins.

 
I like the fact that it is trimmed down, although I think integrating Melodyne was a wise choice. In fact I really don't see the point to the content and tools that are included, but I've been gathering my collection of trusted plugs for a while. For someone just starting out they make a lot of sense.
 

Jeff EvansIt is one of the most reliable and stable DAW's in the world right now.

 
Agreed. And if Sonar disappeared tomorrow I would move over to Studio One without blinking.
 
But the OP asked if the grass was really greener, and I don't think it is. A different shade of green, but not greener.

Sonofagun... I just received an email from Presonus detailing changes to V2.6. They may have already addressed at least a couple of my issues!