Helpful ReplyIs it ok to set the levels where it sounds good?

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The Maillard Reaction
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2012/05/17 13:31:28 (permalink)

Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good?


Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good?

I can't remember when I started trying this, but it seems to work ok. What happens if it it sounds real good but the levels aren't in the right place?

Do I get points taken off or something like that?





best,
mike






#1
Dave Modisette
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 13:40:59 (permalink) ☄ Helpful
You can set the levels where it sounds good if you don't ask anyone else if it sounds good because they could be sitting smack in the middle of a null and then it won't sound good.  And if there are enough people sitting in the middle of a null the the consensus of opinion will favor them and you will be asked to leave the forum.  Or change your soundcard.

Dave Modisette ... rocks a Purrrfect Audio Studio Pro rig.

http://www.gatortraks.com 
My music.
... And of course, the Facebook page. 
#2
Beagle
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 14:23:44 (permalink)
 
fair enough mike.  you did start your own thread instead of arguing in someone else's thread.
 
I respect that respect your request and have removed the snark award. 
post edited by Beagle - 2012/05/17 14:52:15

http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
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#3
The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 14:32:33 (permalink)

It seems, to me, that awarding this thread with a "Snark" award will encourage others to assume that this is not a serious subject.

I am using the technique and it seems to work quite well.


all the best,
mike





#4
AT
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 14:40:43 (permalink) ☄ Helpful
Mike,

obviously this dependent upon your ears.  And who knows what your ears sound like?  They could be lying.

Always trust the meters, or what looks right.  That way you are right, not wrong.  Remember, red and yellow kill a fellow, so keep out of those.  Or what others say they are.

@

ps.  I like the new avatar.  Is that your happy family?  Now they are obviously setting their levels correct.

https://soundcloud.com/a-pleasure-dome
http://www.bnoir-film.com/  
 
there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head.
24 And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.
#5
The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 14:47:50 (permalink)
 On my gig last week I rode the levels on the vocalists as they sang... it reminded me how much good can be done when you focus on tracking at levels that simply sound good... ok... really good.

 I was able to make whispers sound like intimate and breathy "whispers" and I was able to make the big bold parts seem silky smooth as well.

 It was satisfying... and it made mixing relatively easy.


 best regards,
mike


#6
Beagle
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 14:52:58 (permalink)
mike_mccue


It seems, to me, that awarding this thread with a "Snark" award will encourage others to assume that this is not a serious subject.

I am using the technique and it seems to work quite well.


all the best,
mike

fair enough mike.  you did start your own thread instead of arguing in someone else's thread.
 
I respect that respect your request and have removed the snark award.

http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
i7, 16G DDR3, Win10x64, MOTU Ultralite Hybrid MK3
Yamaha MOXF6, Hammond XK3c, other stuff.
#7
AT
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 14:58:58 (permalink)
+1, Mike.

Did you have someone trying to help you set the levels correctly?  That is often fun.

Way back when I did clubs in NYC we had a promoter (ie. boss) at one who was a DJ, too.  Man of many talents.  He would always come over and fool w/ the graffic EQ until it sounded right.  It was months before he realized it wasn't inline, although I always turned it on for him.  Ah, I sometimes even miss those days.

It is a joy if tho if someone that knows what he is doing does it and knows the music, too.  It sounds good.  Really good.

@

https://soundcloud.com/a-pleasure-dome
http://www.bnoir-film.com/  
 
there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head.
24 And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.
#8
The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 15:03:58 (permalink)
Great stuff AT!

Hi Beagle, Thanks... although I don't feel it was necessary to remove it... everything is always open for honest commentary. :-)

all the best to both of you,
mike


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AT
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 15:06:01 (permalink)
Well, Mike, at least Reece didn't give you the snipe award and leave you in a field somewheres with a sack.

Here's hoping that this weekend sounds as good.

@

https://soundcloud.com/a-pleasure-dome
http://www.bnoir-film.com/  
 
there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head.
24 And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.
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Chappel
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 15:37:22 (permalink) ☄ Helpful
mike_mccue


Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 
As opposed to setting the levels where they sound bad? There are different theories on that. Only future history will know the answer.
#11
bapu
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 15:51:56 (permalink)
Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good?



I don't have that preset in ARC or any of my plugins.


Do you have any charts or graphs (in color) for a dolt like me to follow?


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Dave Modisette
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 16:25:10 (permalink) ☄ Helpful
Chappel


mike_mccue


Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 
As opposed to setting the levels where they sound bad? There are different theories on that. Only future history will know the answer.


Sometimes, in order to practice new techniques, I will sit in a null and adjust something until it sounds bad knowing that when I scoot over and get out of the null it will sound pretty good.  I'm not saying that everyone has to do it my way but they probably don't know as much as I do.

Dave Modisette ... rocks a Purrrfect Audio Studio Pro rig.

http://www.gatortraks.com 
My music.
... And of course, the Facebook page. 
#13
bapu
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 16:32:37 (permalink)
Mod Bod

Sometimes, in order to practice new techniques, I will sit in a null and adjust something until it sounds bad knowing that when I scoot over and get out of the null it will sound pretty good.  I'm not saying that everyone has to do it my way but they probably don't know as much as I do. 

Can you make a vid of that.


Could be instructional.
#14
The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 16:33:27 (permalink)
Beagle? Where's that meter?


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bapu
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 16:35:24 (permalink)
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 16:42:36 (permalink)

good enuff


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Beagle
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 16:52:31 (permalink)
LOL!  sorry, I was too late!


something about having to work and they actually want me to do something productive...

what's up wit dat???

http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
i7, 16G DDR3, Win10x64, MOTU Ultralite Hybrid MK3
Yamaha MOXF6, Hammond XK3c, other stuff.
#18
AT
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 17:23:18 (permalink)
Admit it, you were on a beagle bagel break.
@

https://soundcloud.com/a-pleasure-dome
http://www.bnoir-film.com/  
 
there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head.
24 And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.
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bapu
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 18:12:57 (permalink)
mike_mccue


good enuff

Did eye snark myownsef?
#20
The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 18:18:06 (permalink)

It was like an Escher Sketch.





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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/17 18:21:10 (permalink)
mike_mccue


It was like an Escher Sketch.




Only not as brilliant.
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Jonbouy
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/18 12:07:58 (permalink)

On my gig last week I rode the levels on the vocalists as they sang... it reminded me how much good can be done when you focus on tracking at levels that simply sound good... ok... really good.


IMO riding the levels when tracking is a recipe for re-takes.

Maybe good for gunning on the run but in a studio setting?

What would you gain? (pun in ten did)  If the singer is moving relative to the mic position riding the gain isn't going to change anything that can't be changed after the take.

I'd hate to be responsible for messing up a great performance by not being pre-emptive enough when somebody suddenly decides to raise the roof.  I've seen too many engineers mess up somebody else's art for me to go there.
post edited by Jonbouy - 2012/05/18 12:09:54

"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles.
In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/18 12:12:49 (permalink)
mike_mccue


Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good?

I can't remember when I started trying this, but it seems to work ok. What happens if it it sounds real good but the levels aren't in the right place?

Do I get points taken off or something like that?





best,
mike


Is this a question or a clue?

Do you want an answer or are you imparting your veiled wisdom upon us for the benefit of everyone here?

You say it's a serious post, maybe you can appreciate why some would find that difficult to ascertain.
post edited by Jonbouy - 2012/05/18 12:19:12

"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles.
In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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jamesg1213
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/18 12:20:42 (permalink)
Jonbouy


mike_mccue


Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good?

I can't remember when I started trying this, but it seems to work ok. What happens if it it sounds real good but the levels aren't in the right place?

Do I get points taken off or something like that?





best,
mike


Is this a question or a clue?

Do you want an answer or are you imparting your wisdom for the benefit of everyone here.

You say it's a serious post, maybe you can appreciate why some would find that difficult to ascertain.


I can't even ascertain the meaning of the post, let alone it's seriousness or lack thereof.

I suspect someone is attempting to flick metaphorical inky blots at the popular boy.

 
Jyemz
 
 
 



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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/18 12:31:17 (permalink)
Jonbouy



On my gig last week I rode the levels on the vocalists as they sang... it reminded me how much good can be done when you focus on tracking at levels that simply sound good... ok... really good.


IMO riding the levels when tracking is a recipe for re-takes.

Maybe good for gunning on the run but in a studio setting?

What would you gain? (pun in ten did)  If the singer is moving relative to the mic position riding the gain isn't going to change anything that can't be changed after the take.

I'd hate to be responsible for messing up a great performance by not being pre-emptive enough when somebody suddenly decides to raise the roof.  I've seen too many engineers mess up somebody else's art for me to go there.


Thanks for sharing your opinion.

For my part, I was quite happy to get to ride the levels, which the artist heard in the monitor, and have her respond positively.

In this instance riding the levels was effecting the character of the compression stage that was in between the preamp and the MOTU A>D.

I was primarily interested in keeping the gain reduction on the peak of each passage relatively similar... so the GR on peaks in a quieter passage was perhaps 2-3dB and then in the loud passages the GR was also only about 2-3dB because I rode the preamp level as the singing got louder.

We worked together to get a sound, and a performance, that seemed, to me, to be much more compelling than the earlier passes where I ran it at some general safe level.



I enjoyed the practice of riding the level to make it sound good... it was fun and it seemed to make the singer smile a bunch.

The process seemed so much more useful than conforming to some particular rule, goal, or guideline for some abstract reason.

I just think I should check and make sure it's ok to do it that way before I tell anyone else how I got that sound. :-)

best regards,
mike





#26
Jonbouy
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/18 12:51:41 (permalink)
mike_mccue


Jonbouy



On my gig last week I rode the levels on the vocalists as they sang... it reminded me how much good can be done when you focus on tracking at levels that simply sound good... ok... really good.


IMO riding the levels when tracking is a recipe for re-takes.

Maybe good for gunning on the run but in a studio setting?

What would you gain? (pun in ten did)  If the singer is moving relative to the mic position riding the gain isn't going to change anything that can't be changed after the take.

I'd hate to be responsible for messing up a great performance by not being pre-emptive enough when somebody suddenly decides to raise the roof.  I've seen too many engineers mess up somebody else's art for me to go there.


Thanks for sharing your opinion.

For my part, I was quite happy to get to ride the levels, which the artist heard in the monitor, and have her respond positively.

In this instance riding the levels was effecting the character of the compression stage that was in between the preamp and the MOTU A>D.

I was primarily interested in keeping the gain reduction on the peak of each passage relatively similar... so the GR on peaks in a quieter passage was perhaps 2-3dB and then in the loud passages the GR was also only about 2-3dB because I rode the preamp level as the singing got louder.

We worked together to get a sound, and a performance, that seemed, to me, to be much more compelling than the earlier passes where I ran it at some general safe level.



I enjoyed the practice of riding the level to make it sound good... it was fun and it seemed to make the singer smile a bunch.

The process seemed so much more useful than conforming to some particular rule, goal, or guideline for some abstract reason.

I just think I should check and make sure it's ok to do it that way before I tell anyone else how I got that sound. :-)

best regards,
mike


Of course if you are using some outboard processing on the way in it is going to affect that.  I'm not against it either but I'd want to at least be sure the singer wasn't going to black my eye if I messed up.

Rather than an abstract reason I'd say that was a pretty concrete idea to have in mind when dealing with someone elses work unless you've established a good relationship AND there is a valid purpose (i.e. using it to drive the compression on the input chain.)  You only just mentioned that bit though.


I just think I should check and make sure it's ok to do it that way before I tell anyone else how I got that sound. :-)


= a Daryl word.
post edited by Jonbouy - 2012/05/18 12:53:46

"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles.
In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
#27
bapu
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/18 12:54:15 (permalink)
Jonbouy
= a Daryl word. 

Monkeys?
Arse?
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Re:Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good? 2012/05/18 12:55:04 (permalink)
Jonbouy


mike_mccue


Is it ok to set the levels where it sounds good?

I can't remember when I started trying this, but it seems to work ok. What happens if it it sounds real good but the levels aren't in the right place?

Do I get points taken off or something like that?





best,
mike


Is this a question or a clue?

Do you want an answer or are you imparting your veiled wisdom upon us for the benefit of everyone here?

You say it's a serious post, maybe you can appreciate why some would find that difficult to ascertain.


You didn't answer this bit though.

So I don't know whether you just need a Snark meter or blocking.

"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles.
In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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