RonCaird
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Issue with recorded audio vs. project tempo change.
I have a project where I am providing a lead guitar part for another person's non-Sonar project. There are three audio tracks in my project. The first track is a rough mix of the song, which I received as a wave file and imported to track one of the project. There was no click track involved but I was able to match the tempo at 113 bpm. Tracks 2 and 3 are a mic'd and a direct audio recording of the guitar part recorded simultaneously so they are synced both together and with the imported mix. I mixed the two guitar tracks to a single track, added a few seconds of audio at the beginning of the mix, matched to the mix track as a start time reference, exported the track as a wave file and sent it off to the other person to give to their mix engineer. A couple days later I hear that this guitar track does not sync. In looking at my project I find that if I change the tempo of the project, the imported mix track plays back the same as before, it just has the waveforms falling at different points on the grid. This is what I expected to happen. The audio is unaltered by the tempo change. However, the guitar tracks I recorded are affected by any tempo change. They play back either faster or slower, depending on the tempo, and the pitch is changed correspondingly. This I did not expect. Is there a setting, technique or a preference that will allow the guitar tracks to also be unaffected by the tempo change in the same way the imported wave file is unaffected?
RonCBB, Gateway DX, Core i7 2600, Windows 10 64 bit, 6 GB RAM, 1 TB C Drive, 2 TB D Drive, 1 TB Network Drive, Akai EIE Pro 4 channel Audio Interface. Music: RonCaird.com Blog: GuitarAccompanist.com
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Zargg
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Re: Issue with recorded audio vs. project tempo change.
2016/03/24 05:34:10
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☄ Helpfulby RonCaird 2016/03/24 16:58:18
Hi. I am just guessing. But maybe if you export the recorded guitar(s), and then import them together with the file you got from your friend into a new project. This way they should react the same. Others may know better.
All the best.
Ken Nilsen ZarggBBZWin 10 Pro X64, Cakewalk by Bandlab, SPlat X64, AMD AM3+ fx-8320, 16Gb RAM, RME Ucx (+ ARC), Tascam FW 1884, M-Audio Keystation 61es, *AKAI MPK Pro 25, *Softube Console1, Alesis DM6 USB, Maschine MkII Laptop setup: Win 10 X64, i5 2.4ghz, 8gb RAM, 320gb 7200 RPM HD, Focusrite Solo, + *
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chuckebaby
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Re: Issue with recorded audio vs. project tempo change.
2016/03/24 07:18:05
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☄ Helpfulby RonCaird 2016/03/24 16:58:11
what did you choose in export settings ?
it also may be possible you turned this track in to a groove clip by accident. thus the tempo sensitive track.
right click on the track and choose "bounce to clips". always do this with your tracks when you have small clips on the same track you want to combine to one whole track.
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slartabartfast
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Re: Issue with recorded audio vs. project tempo change.
2016/03/24 16:32:58
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☄ Helpfulby RonCaird 2016/03/24 16:58:06
Sonar's tempo setting should not affect recorded audio, unless as chuckebaby notes there is a groove clip somewhere. A tempo change will affect the playing time/speed of those and any MIDI tracks. But groove clips should not change pitch depending on tempo. And the only thing that typically affects tempo and pitch of recorded audio is a mismatch in the sampling rate. Tempo changes in Sonar should have no effect on the sample rate, and the sample rate of imported audio should be resampled to match the project rate in Sonar. If the mix engineer is trying to match the original track from your friend and your exported tracks from Sonar, then different sample rates may be the issue. Zargg71 points at a possible workaround for that, i.e. export the friend's previously imported track along with your Sonar tracks from Sonar to be sure they are the same sample rate, and have the mix engineer work with the Sonar exported tracks exclusively. Alternatively set a new Sonar project sample rate to that of the friend's work, export your audio tracks and import them into the new project to get the rates to match. Just to be clear how and where are you setting the "tempo" that changes the speed and pitch of audio?
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RonCaird
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Re: Issue with recorded audio vs. project tempo change.
2016/03/24 16:43:55
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Thanks, these are great places for me to look. I did check to make sure nothing was a groove clip and that does not appear to be the case. The sample rate issue may indeed by in play. Also, the bounce to clips comment is interesting. This is indeed a comped solo made up of a number of clips. I usually 'bounce to track' in this situation but I will do a bounce to clips and see what happens. I will report back, but I do appreciate the help.
RonCBB, Gateway DX, Core i7 2600, Windows 10 64 bit, 6 GB RAM, 1 TB C Drive, 2 TB D Drive, 1 TB Network Drive, Akai EIE Pro 4 channel Audio Interface. Music: RonCaird.com Blog: GuitarAccompanist.com
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brundlefly
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Re: Issue with recorded audio vs. project tempo change.
2016/03/24 17:13:54
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☄ Helpfulby bitman 2016/04/10 18:42:06
As others have said, the tempo and pitch of recorded audio should not have changed due to changing the tempo of the project, but be aware that changing tempo can make clips go out of sync:
In SONAR, clips maintain their M:B:T start times by default when tempo is changed, so if clips don't all start at the same time, they will move out of sync. To prevent this, you can change the Timebase of audio clips to Absolute on the Clip tab in the Inspector, but, ideally, you'll get the tempo set correctly before bringing clips into the project.
If you do have to change tempo after the fact, a better way to keep things in sync would be to use Set Measure/Beat At Now to change the tempo. The quick way to do this with a known, fixed target tempo is:
- Set the Now time at the Measure = Current Tempo +1 (i.e. 121 if the default project tempo is 120)
- Shift+M to open Set Measure/Beat dialog
- Enter Target Tempo + 1 (114 in your case) for the Measure, and OK.
This will change the tempo of the timeline around existing Audio (and MIDI, if any) without altering the playback timing or sync of existing clips.
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bitman
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Re: Issue with recorded audio vs. project tempo change.
2016/04/10 17:30:37
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You BrundleFly are a Sonar encyclopedia. Must be the in the water down there.  I wanted to melodyne tempo-mapo using the strummed acoustic track. I did that and everything went wacko. Thank you for the solution! Selecting all clips and setting the timebase to absolute. That fixed it.
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