Joystick Panning

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Muso55
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2011/07/16 05:27:11 (permalink)

Joystick Panning

  Hi Guys,

In what is a new area for me, I am looking at real time control of surround panning. Having read previous posts with respect to the use of joysticks can anybody expand on this for me?
I note that Cakewalk suggest the use of a feedback Joystick controller of a type used by the flight sim boys. As I am only looking at controlling one Axis (angle), Is there a cheaper alternative?
Looking at control aspects of Sonar's surround panner, I can assign a Midi CC which in my case is nothing more than a 5v pot. Very simple! But it would be nice to use a joystick for full 360 degree control. With the pot I can only go 0 to 360 i.e. one full turn of the pot and not through the 360. Have looked at retail Midi surround panners, expensive in the extreme. Any thoughts would be welcomed.

Bill
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    Zuma
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    Re:Joystick Panning 2011/07/16 11:16:03 (permalink)
    There are plenty of cheap dual analog(joy sticks) force feedback game pads that will do the job. Logitech is a good brand to look at. I have a Logitech Rumble Pad 2. Haven't used it for surround panning but I've no doubt it would work like a charm.
     
    Go to Tigerdirect or Newegg in the video game sections and you'll find a slew of game pads and joysticks for $25 and under.
    post edited by Zuma - 2011/07/16 11:24:03

    http://zumajunction.bandcamp.com/

    "the bus came by and I got on that's when it all began. There was cowboy Neal at the wheel of a bus to never ever land."_



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    Muso55
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    Re:Joystick Panning 2011/07/16 14:00:20 (permalink)
    Hi Zuma,

    Thanks for the info. Now if I may be so bold as to ask a favor, can you plug in the rumble pad 2 and let me know if Sonar surround panner can pick it up? Not sure how Sonar recognises the device, ( global options/devices?) not midi is it? Sonar surround panner has a midi learn function and again not sure if it is applicable.

    Would appreciate your assistance.

    Bill, Plymouth uk

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    Zuma
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    Re:Joystick Panning 2011/07/16 14:23:34 (permalink)
    Yup. Worked like a charm... I feel a surround project coming on now. You go to Options-Controller/Surfaces to set it up. Yeah, I definitely want to do a surround project now. :) 
     
    From the Sonar Help File:
      In the Controller/Surfaces dialog, click the Add button, and choose Joystick Panner in the Controller/Surface field of the Controller/Surface Settings dialog; click OK. Close the Controller/Surfaces dialog, and display the Controller/Surfaces toolbar (Views-Toolbars-Controller/Surfaces command). On the left side of the toolbar, choose Joystick Panner in the dropdown menu, and then click the Properties button that's on the right side of the toolbar. In the Joystick Panner dialog, select button 1 in the Buttons field, and then select Engage Pan Mode in the Button Actions field. Now select Button 2, and select Engage Pan Nav Mode in the Button Actions field. Select any other buttons your joystick has (one at a time), and connect them to any transport or menu commands you want in the Button Actions field; close the Joystick Panner dialog.
    Now when you hold down button 1 (the "trigger button"), the joystick controls the surround panner on the current track or send. When the pan/sphere is in the desired position, let button 1 up to hold the position. When you hold down button 2, move the joystick vertically to change the current track, and horizontally to change to a different send control. The window on the right side of the Controller/Surfaces toolbar displays the names of the current track and send. Use any other buttons you configured to control other SONAR Producer functions.
    You can save your button assignments as a preset by typing a name for the current group of settings in the Presets window in the Joystick Panner dialog, and then clicking the floppy disk icon that's next to the Presets window. Whenever you want to load a preset, just select it in the Presets window.

    post edited by Zuma - 2011/07/16 14:29:07

    http://zumajunction.bandcamp.com/

    "the bus came by and I got on that's when it all began. There was cowboy Neal at the wheel of a bus to never ever land."_



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    Muso55
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    Re:Joystick Panning 2011/07/16 16:30:27 (permalink)
    Hi Zuma,

    You're a star. Will order joystick then. Recording the joystick movement will be fun. Intend to use Kontakt with worldy sounds (not music) and 5.1 Cinema set up.

    Thanks again,

    Bill
    #5
    Zuma
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    Re:Joystick Panning 2011/07/16 16:59:44 (permalink)
    I'm glad you posted this because I've always wanted to do a surround mix but for some reason just never got around to it... now I've kinda got the fever. I was trying to find some good tutorials and came across this Beatles surround mix demonstration at Abbey Road. Doesn't really give you much but it was still cool to watch and hear... all that beautiful vintage gear and the sweet sound of the Beatles... good stuff!
    [link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWrV34Oqo58&feature=related]http://www.youtube.com/wa...58&feature=related    [/link]

    http://zumajunction.bandcamp.com/

    "the bus came by and I got on that's when it all began. There was cowboy Neal at the wheel of a bus to never ever land."_



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    Muso55
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    Re:Joystick Panning 2011/07/17 12:38:46 (permalink)
    Hi Zuma,
     
    Well ordered a suitable game pad this morning. Hope to be playing with surround myself soon.
     
    Watched the Beatles vid. Interesting. Does seem sort of a desecration thou! Think I would prefer to hear it on vinyl thru valve amps.
     
    However, even listening on u tube does seem to have more spacial awareness. Interesting
    Bill
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    Zuma
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    Re:Joystick Panning 2011/07/18 21:00:41 (permalink)
    Well, Muso, in my humble opinion, a mix or remaster done right in 5.1 24/96 or 24/48 is amazing.  Vinyl can't touch it. I read a good article on vinyl along time ago. The author stated something to the fact that vinyl had a frequency response beyond analogue tape... if I remember correctly he said the frequency response was something like 50 khz as it translated to the digital realm. I have no idea if he's right or full of it, but that was his theory anyway on why people loved the richness and resolution of vinyl.
     
    All I know is when I bought the remastered 5.1 SACD mix of Dark Side of the Moon and played it I was officially smoked! Sheer heaven to sit in the middle of all that beautiful high resolution bliss. I love the format... if it's mixed and mastered by someone who knows what the hell they're doing. I've heard more than a few that were terrible though.
     
    I should mention SACD is a little different than DVD audio being as it's actually 1 bit 2.8224 MHz DSD. I really have no idea how the SACD format translates to DVD Audio and Dolby Digital but I support and love the formats. 
    post edited by Zuma - 2011/07/18 21:28:12

    http://zumajunction.bandcamp.com/

    "the bus came by and I got on that's when it all began. There was cowboy Neal at the wheel of a bus to never ever land."_



    #8
    Muso55
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    Re:Joystick Panning 2011/07/21 15:11:31 (permalink)
    Hi Zuma,
     
    Hope you see this.
    Just got in from work with a package waiting. A gamepad! Found something suitable ( I hope) on E-Bay for $10. Only got Sonar 4 on this machine. Sonar 8 on music machine. Will try it on that.
     
    Anyway seemed rude not to acknowledge your last, just looking back on what you said with respect to the help file etc. Lazy me, but I am Kn*****!
     
    Now Zuma,  I never said that Valves and Vinyl were better did I? (!) 
    Now if I am reading your last correct, Vinyl has a Freq response greater than analog tape?
    That would surely be irrelevent then as the vinyl could only reproduce what was on the analog tape anyhow,no? Dont know. With respect to the richness ( resolution? - its an analog medium) I believe this is due to harmonic overtones (sort off) that analog seems to project/record  better than a digital medium. Why else would we use PSP Vintage Warmer?
     Similar as to why Guitarist's still like a Valve amp. But anyway I got a gamepad to play with!
    Later,
    Bill UK
     
    #9
    Muso55
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    Re:Joystick Panning 2011/07/21 15:37:00 (permalink)
    Zuma, you there?

    It works! The $10  ( including postage) gamepad works. A SaiteK P380 if anyone is interested. Hav'nt fully configured it yet. Have you given any though to recording automation of the joystick panner? .I.e. you may want to mix in real time (play with the joystick) then add the encoding to the track. An area I will have to look at.

    I am away to play now!!

    Bill
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