AnsweredKurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable?

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SteveStrummerUK
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2015/01/14 17:30:37 (permalink)

Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable?

 
Last year marked the 20th anniversary of Kurt Cobain's death, but we had to wait until 2015 for the most tasteless memorial to the Nirvana frontman's life.
 
Kurt Cobain's suicide note has now been replicated in its entirety into a baseball shirt that can be purchased on eBay. A similar tank top depicting a replication of the note was also available until recently on Etsy, until a Reddit discussion drew attention to it, prompting the site to take it down. The image can still be seen via Styleite's post.
 
This means at least one person decided it would be cool to market Cobain's most personal sentiment into a shirt. Sixteen of the eBay baseball tees have been sold so far.
 
In the handwritten note, Cobain mourns his loss of enthusiasm for performing before Nirvana's massive crowds and details his admiration of wife Courtney Love and daughter Frances Bean.
 
 

 
 
(Billboard)

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Rain
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 17:36:14 (permalink)
Lame...

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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 17:49:34 (permalink)
Meh... I'm actually a HUGE Nirvana/Cobain fan (don't judge me!) and I've got no problem with it if the family doesn't (well his daughter and mother anyway... Courtney can go do something that violates the TOS to herself as far as I'm concerned). He was a bizzarro wordsmith and from what I recall of the letter it seemed to be written knowing it would be read to his fans/released to the public. Knowing his dark sense of humor he'd probably like it.
 
But yeah... if the Bean or his Mum have a problem with it then naw... have some class. If they don't then really it doesn't seem particularly out of place considering the man's mindset in life. Considering it is copyrighted material though (everything is as soon as you write it down) whoever is doing this best be paying royalties lest they feel the wrath of the Hole.
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 17:54:12 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Mesh 2015/01/15 09:58:35
Beepster
Meh... I'm actually a HUGE Nirvana/Cobain fan (don't judge me!) 



I am too. IMHO, Nirvana put the last relevant rock album on the market, though they also put the last nail in the coffin doing so. Rock ceased to be socially relevant after that.
 
But to turn something as personal as a suicide note into a source of profit - I don't know... Why not make a big broadway musical around it?

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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 18:04:41 (permalink)
Are you implying that "bad taste" and "acceptable" are mutually exclusive? 

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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 18:06:11 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Rain 2015/01/14 18:08:56
Rain
Beepster
Meh... I'm actually a HUGE Nirvana/Cobain fan (don't judge me!) 



I am too. IMHO, Nirvana put the last relevant rock album on the market, though they also put the last nail in the coffin doing so. Rock ceased to be socially relevant after that.
 
But to turn something as personal as a suicide note into a source of profit - I don't know... Why not make a big broadway musical around it?




Of course you're totally right but I guess I'm just numbed to the depths capitalism can sink to. This is almost like another irony in the man's weird ass life/career. The guy was OBSESSED with being a successful and noted musician and did everything he could to realize that dream but also completely hated and rejected that exact same goal, mindset and everything that came with it. Then after acheiving his goals from within the machine that is the music industry, which he resented from the get go, he hated it all (unsurprisingly) and himself so much that he offed himself.
 
And now someone is using the final and ultimate symbol of that rejection of his success to profit... which he himself would have done (remember In Utero was initially titled I Hate Myself and Want to Die) and again hated himself for.
 
He was a very strange and misguided fellow. Even as I type all that I feel like laughing at the absurdity of it all but in a sad way.
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 18:15:51 (permalink)
Beepster
 
Of course you're totally right but I guess I'm just numbed to the depths capitalism can sink to.




I can totally get that, and I think it somewhat had the opposite effect on me. Back in the days, I'm not sure I'd have reacted the same. But nowadays everything seems to be mostly form over substance, biographic details are more important than music, and I tend to shy away from that stuff and focus on the artist's music. In most cases anyway.
 
As for the rest, you hit the nail on the head as far as I'm concerned.
 
First thing that came to mind when I read this was the song "Rape Me"... 

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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 18:20:09 (permalink)
Is Kurt complaining?
 
Taste aside, who licensed Kurt's copyright to this most original work for this purpose? I expect he overlooked a clause in his recording contract that gave his publisher the rights to use any of his work in whatever way they considered valuable for promotion. If not then his heirs seem to be less concerned about his privacy than one would hope.
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 18:26:19 (permalink)
slartabartfast
Is Kurt complaining?
 



Ever heard a song of his which wasn't complain one way or another? :P The Cure almost sound frivolous by comparison.

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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 18:33:51 (permalink)
I think you are a couple years older than I am (I'm 37) so may have gotten and been able to process more of the grunge/Nirvana thing as it was happening than I was at the time of his death. I was into them but more in a dumb, almost tweenie kind of way whereas the slightly older kids (whom I hung out with) were young adults doing the young adult type things of the time (dope, group sex, slack off stuff). As I've aged I've shed a WHOLE pile of bands and albums I used to REALLY be into but my fondness of Nirvana and Kurt continues to grow. The songwriting and tones just cut so hard and are so catchy they're almost Beatles-esque except raunchier.
 
IDK really what my point is but maybe that's the point. Nirvana and Kurt as a human seem to be all about not knowing whether to laugh or cry or stare blankly at a wall or scream your head of or cut yourself or jerk off or whatever so you kind of just bubble and simmer in all those states and bob your head in agreement to the music even though it doesn't make sense lest you explode from the impotent angst of your existence.
 
Damn... now I gotta go listen to the demo version of Aneurysm ("Beat it! Beat it!").
 
heheh... friggen' Kurt... you beautiful weirdo.
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 18:35:23 (permalink)
I had a bad taste of sour grapes once.
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 18:56:34 (permalink)
It's  quite possible Kurt would not have given a $#!+ Who knows. I suppose he knew the whole world would read the note. It's  tacky as hell, but I suppose that is part of taking the bad and good of capitalism.
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 19:14:09 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby craigb 2015/01/15 02:55:59
What? No blood splatter?

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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 21:07:12 (permalink)
this oughta get your goozle..
 


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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 22:21:52 (permalink)
This ended up as topic of discussion here at the fort. The wife and I agree. It is in bad taste. I still don't think Kurt killed himself. But then again I've been known to run around the house with an aluminum foil helmet swearing that space aliens are trying to control my mind.

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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/14 23:41:07 (permalink)
El dice killed him!
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/15 00:12:31 (permalink) ☼ Best Answerby SteveStrummerUK 2015/01/15 20:00:27
Well it's tacky as hell of course, but it's a free market...
 
Personally I think that kids going around wearing CCCP t-shirts with the hammer and sickle is far worse, considering the 10's of millions of Russians who were slaughtered. They might as well cover themselves in swastikas. And then of course you have the Che Guevara t-shirts, because murderers are très chic aren't they. 
 
But this Cobain suicide note design...yes it's in poor taste but then again people are quite comfortable wearing crosses to symbolize the thing that Jesus was nailed to, is that really any worse? Maybe in a few hundred years time, this suicide note will be considered some kind of holy document. 

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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/15 15:01:32 (permalink)
sharke
Personally I think that kids going around wearing CCCP t-shirts with the hammer and sickle is far worse, considering the 10's of millions of Russians who were slaughtered. 



It was kind of odd when we were in Moscow to see that they were marketing the symbols of communism. Besides those traditional Russian dolls, the bulk of what you find in gift shops is related to the communist era. Paradox...
 

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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/15 15:27:57 (permalink)
sharke
Well it's tacky as hell of course, but it's a free market...
 
Personally I think that kids going around wearing CCCP t-shirts with the hammer and sickle is far worse, considering the 10's of millions of Russians who were slaughtered. They might as well cover themselves in swastikas. And then of course you have the Che Guevara t-shirts, because murderers are très chic aren't they. 
 
But this Cobain suicide note design...yes it's in poor taste but then again people are quite comfortable wearing crosses to symbolize the thing that Jesus was nailed to, is that really any worse? Maybe in a few hundred years time, this suicide note will be considered some kind of holy document. 




Those kids are worse IF we make the assumption the kids are thinking of it in those terms.  i hate to go into the whole perspective and relativism angle, but sometimes it does come down to that. People who wear those kind of shirts tend to fall into two categories (that i have witnessed personally..i am sure there are more): those who have no clue about the history of the Soviet Union (and yes, those people exist) and those who have a different take on the history of the Soviet Union.  i remember asking the wannabe communist kids why they would support such an oppressive regime?  The typical answer fell along the lines of the answer i get when I ask a similar question about any group with a lot of supporters and blood on their hands; dismissal, denial and redirection. try it out now.  Go ask a muslim about the recent attacks and i doubt you get a lot of direct, unconditional support for such acts. I don't know any Christians who are not kkk themselves that see the KKK as a representative of Chrsitianity even though many cells claim just that. Every communist wannabe i spoke to condemned soviet atrocities in the same way most Americans condemn atrocities of our past and so on.They do not define communism by the acts of Stalin anymore than Americans define the USA by slavery or Muslims define islam by 911 or Christians define Christianity by the Inquisition.  They point to what they feel are ideals (often utopian in nature) and see atrocities as the collateral damage of those not adhering to those principals. I'm not defending brutal regimes or abuses done in the name of race, politics, religion, etc.  Just pointing out that most adherents to various ideologies do not see themselves through the same lens as their detractors.  in theory communism is a Utopian notion.  A society where everyone is equal and well cared for.  We know (with the exception of primitive cultures) the actual reality is much different.  That doesn't stop people from dreaming and focusing on the dream.  I guess my point is that those kids are probably more guilty of being ignorant or delusional and under the impression they are showing support for a form of idealism rather than sending the message they want some Stalin style brutality.
 
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/15 15:38:43 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Rain 2015/01/15 15:46:31
Rain
sharke
Personally I think that kids going around wearing CCCP t-shirts with the hammer and sickle is far worse, considering the 10's of millions of Russians who were slaughtered. 



It was kind of odd when we were in Moscow to see that they were marketing the symbols of communism. Besides those traditional Russian dolls, the bulk of what you find in gift shops is related to the communist era. Paradox...
 


Not sure how accurate my sources are, but I have a decent number of Russian and Ukrainian neighbors and their explanation for such things is that the people in power in Russia miss being one of the two top powers in the world and those symbols represent the last time they were truly a world power.  Not to mention many of the people still in power are remnants of the old soviet power structure.  it is somewhat reminiscent of how Hitler used the bruised collective ego of Germans post treaty of Versailles to make them think fondly of the glory days of Prussia and other Germanic military lore of the past. Nostalgia tends to have rose colored lenses, filtering out the ugliness and just seeing the selected (and often fictionalized)glory of a perceived peak in power. The Soviet Union was the country vying with the US for dominance at the Olympics.  The USSR was the main country in the nuclear and space race with the US. International negotiations were pretty much an ongoing compromise between US and USSR interests.  nevermind they lost that battle on all fronts for the most part.  Just being in contention is a far cry from Russia's current standing as an "other" behind the US, China and others. Perhaps for them,  being #2 in a pointless pissing contest beats not being considered one of the main penises at all.
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/15 15:43:03 (permalink)
In my own experience, most people over there just don't talk about it. It's a bit taboo. In 3 months, I've heard one girl refer to the communist era - in a derogatory way. If I remember correctly, we were advised beforehand not to bring up the subject.
 
I personally tend to believe that young people who fall for socialism and communism are mostly ignorant - and the majority of the time, they come from families where money has never really been a concern. They reach that age and want to re-invent the world...
 
College = pot = socialism/communism. It's one of the few constants in this universe.
 
But I just broke the TOS. :/

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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/15 16:23:25 (permalink)
Rain
In my own experience, most people over there just don't talk about it. It's a bit taboo. In 3 months, I've heard one girl refer to the communist era - in a derogatory way. If I remember correctly, we were advised beforehand not to bring up the subject.
 
I personally tend to believe that young people who fall for socialism and communism are mostly ignorant - and the majority of the time, they come from families where money has never really been a concern. They reach that age and want to re-invent the world...
 
College = pot = socialism/communism. It's one of the few constants in this universe.
 
But I just broke the TOS. :/


i don't know if that is a blatant violation of TOS.  maybe gray area.  We were not discussing communism and socialism so much as discussing how youth wear symbols of such.  in any case, i agree that rarely are such displays much deeper than "that's a cool shirt and my friends are wearing it"
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/15 16:58:13 (permalink)
Rain
In my own experience, most people over there just don't talk about it. It's a bit taboo. In 3 months, I've heard one girl refer to the communist era - in a derogatory way. If I remember correctly, we were advised beforehand not to bring up the subject.
 
I personally tend to believe that young people who fall for socialism and communism are mostly ignorant - and the majority of the time, they come from families where money has never really been a concern. They reach that age and want to re-invent the world...
 
College = pot = socialism/communism. It's one of the few constants in this universe.
 
But I just broke the TOS. :/




In all honesty you will find that there's an overwhelming number of people who are either "communists" or rabid anti-communists who all have one thing in common - none of them have actually ever read Marx (or Adam Smith for that matter).

 In order, then, to discover the limit of deepest tones, it is necessary not only to produce very violent agitations in the air but to give these the form of simple pendular vibrations. - Hermann von Helmholtz, predicting the role of the electric bassist in 1877.
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/15 17:18:29 (permalink)
Yeah, lots of power mad dinosaurs on both sides trying to ignite a new cold war. It's very disappointing after seeing it collapse when I was very young, enjoying its absence as a teen and young man and now seeing it creep back into the general psyche of the world (our current PM here in Canuckerland is all OVER this kind of crap).
 
Sad really. We never learn do we?
 
/definitely breaking the TOS
//sorry
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/15 17:23:23 (permalink)
drewfx1
Rain
In my own experience, most people over there just don't talk about it. It's a bit taboo. In 3 months, I've heard one girl refer to the communist era - in a derogatory way. If I remember correctly, we were advised beforehand not to bring up the subject.
 
I personally tend to believe that young people who fall for socialism and communism are mostly ignorant - and the majority of the time, they come from families where money has never really been a concern. They reach that age and want to re-invent the world...
 
College = pot = socialism/communism. It's one of the few constants in this universe.
 
But I just broke the TOS. :/




In all honesty you will find that there's an overwhelming number of people who are either "communists" or rabid anti-communists who all have one thing in common - none of them have actually ever read Marx (or Adam Smith for that matter).


Adam Smith the Scot or the congressman?? lol
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/15 17:47:42 (permalink)
dubdisciple
 
Adam Smith the Scot or the congressman?? lol





 
The Scot. 

 In order, then, to discover the limit of deepest tones, it is necessary not only to produce very violent agitations in the air but to give these the form of simple pendular vibrations. - Hermann von Helmholtz, predicting the role of the electric bassist in 1877.
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/15 18:06:37 (permalink)
Figured that but since the latter is congressman in my district I would ask.
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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/16 01:22:43 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby SteveStrummerUK 2015/01/16 07:43:48
I think you are right dubdisciple about kids wearing symbols they don't really know the full meaning and/or implication of. They're completely ignorant of history. I should think the schools have a lot to do with it. The horrors of the Nazis and the Holocaust are drummed into everyone, but nowhere near as many people know about the Stalin's regime of slaughter despite the fact that many times more people were killed. Uneducated kids wearing this stuff is one thing. But many years ago back in the UK I remember flicking through the TV channels and happening across Children's BBC on BBC1. There was a kid's TV presenter doing the little bit on camera in between each show, all fun stuff. And he was wearing a bright read CCCP sweatshirt. On kid's TV! I've met grown adults who have been told what went on in the USSR but deny it as "western propaganda" (despite the Khrushchev report). These are the same idiots who were invited to visit Potemkin villages back in communist era and came back to the US full of glowing reports about how marvelous it all was. 
 
When people get all starry eyed about something, it's very hard to talk them out of it even when you put the facts in front of their nose. I used to get riled up by Che Guevara t-shirts to the point of confronting people in the street. I once asked a black guy on a subway platform how on earth he could wear a Che t-shirt after the racist remarks Guevara made about black people in "The Motorcycle Diaries." He denied such remarks were made. I assured him they were, and he said how strange it was that he had read the whole book from cover to cover and can't remember any such thing. Another time I confronted an old Che-sporting hippie in the street and let him in on some pretty juicy facts about the man. He said "wow, I genuinely didn't know." 

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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/16 07:09:44 (permalink)
I know this thread is about good or bad taste t-shirt logo design, and I agree with the sentiments being expressed, but please try to hold off the politics...

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Re: Kurt Cobain suicide note T-shirt - bad taste, or acceptable? 2015/01/16 07:49:42 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby bapu 2015/01/16 11:49:40
sharke
 
 
But this Cobain suicide note design...yes it's in poor taste but then again people are quite comfortable wearing crosses to symbolize the thing that Jesus was nailed to, is that really any worse? Maybe in a few hundred years time, this suicide note will be considered some kind of holy document. 




Well said.
 
It's just a good job himself wasn't drowned. They'd all be walking round with a goldfish bowl hanging round their necks.

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