Kvraudio willfully supports piracy of cakewalk products

Ah!! My typos, shucks. I won't be editing them.. There are reasons I posted here and not downstairs, but spare me from explaining, this forum works with difficulty on iPhone safari

Kvraudio willfully supports piracy of cakewalk products

I can see your point, but I think you have over-stated the culpability of KVR in this. Most Cakewalk customers have probably not read the license for their product, and asking someone who hosts an open forum to be responsible for reading, let alone enforcing the license terms of every piece of used software someone is trying to flog is simply not reasonable. For all we know the transactions might be taking place in the EU, where  most jurisdictions do not even recognize the legal standing of the "licensed not sold" theory. In much of the world if it looks like a sale it is a sale, and the first sale doctrine permits you to sell your software regardless of the license terms.


If Cakewalk had to take strict responsibility let alone legal liability for every post on their forums, these forums would be out of business, and the company might be as well.

 i would contact cakewalk with info.
 

I agree with the person who stated that it's very possible that this could be a legal sale within the EU. Probably would have been better to contact KVR then possibly slander a site without having all the facts. I'm certainly glad that there was no one around like this to slander me when a client managed to sneak in copyrighted material under my nose. I would have been accused falsely despite the fact that I was just as much the victim. Putting someone on blast without having all the facts is not only uncool, it can get you sued.

dubdisciple

it can get you sued. 

I'm not worried about being sued.

1.  Who is kvr owned by?  Muse

2.  Where are they incorporated?  In a state in the USA.  Maybe not Cali, possibly Delaware, but certainly in the U.S.

3. I knew all about the E.U. Software Directive, specifically why I said, "or laws," which was a typo, by that I meant, "our laws."

If you feel so strongly about it, go get a law degree..

I'm going to respectfully bow out of this convo. I mean you no harm, but was hoping to get you to see the unintended consequences such a post could cause. I think i will just ignore this thread and let Cakewalk deal with it.

I'm sure various members of cakewalk staff go on kvr themselves. the site and forum are normally 2 separate entities , much like here. *YOU* agree to play nice on any forum you go on to.

it's tricky , in the sense of the only products I own that I can't sell on are cakewalk's out of the many.. but then the way to deal with that is a dongle (real or software based).. so they are damned if they do or don't.  ( Don't even get me started on the fee IK charge to transfer their stuff! )
 
if you pay enough attention here, you see what happens to folk who have bought from sources that aren't selling things  "unregistered" etc. even that isn't un-solvable, by cakewalk and I'm sure they have ways to deal with it.. as obviously the person buying it had good intentions.

the other angle is, they buy the current version.. and it gets them to upgrade etc.. so look at it that way.  cakewalk would rather maybe lose a few $ thru honest customers, than get nothing from folk on certain auction sites  / fake sites set in a far away country ..selling the software for near free.

there are about hhmm 5-6 sites that everyone knows that are house hold names.. guaranteed you'll see cakewalk products listed on em at some point and maybe a certain % of them have been registered.. you think 80% of folk read EULA agreements that they are ticking ? unless you are verbose in legal"ese" then it's baffling. 

I buy retro computer games..even thought they are a couple of £ or $ .. the amount of fakes on certain sites is a joke.. and only if you were in the know , you'd know they weren't what  they purported to be

BTW, a community member PM'd me, and said he was concerned that I might be, "banned," from Cakewalk Forums, for making this thread.

  I do not see why I would be banned, I am disgusted by this behavior of piracy on part of the KVR community, and I certainly do not support these actions that infringe upon the copyright and intellectual property of US based businesses. 

However, if for some odd reason, I have crossed some boundary of the Forum TOS, I would appreciate a warning, and a suggestion to stop these posts.  Warning must come from a Cakewalk Team Member, and I will comply.

Thanks

Being able to sell a product after you have used it is a, "basic civil liberty," what?

By that style of logic, if you have an infectious disease, it is your right to sell Kleenex after you have used them to wipe your nose.

Well that's definitely not a liberty of any sorts.

Software is a thing. It's something that gets created.  

It's pretty much the wild west over there.

The title of this thread in essence is slanderous as mentioned before they have a TOS to deal with this and they don't encourage nor profit from these illegal transactions. Furthermore I have witnessed them deal with these type of threads in a swift and diligent manner WHEN THEY ARE NOTIFIED.

Why not tell KVR whats going on and let them handle this matter prior to taking it off site to this forum.

end rant.

Linear Phase


Being able to sell a product after you have used it is a, "basic civil liberty," what?

By that style of logic, if you have an infectious disease, it is your right to sell Kleenex after you have used them to wipe your nose.

Well that's definitely not a liberty of any sorts.

Your logic is badly flawed.  Cakewalk's restrictions are exactly the same as the sales contract for a new car stating that it cannot ever be sold to a new owner.  Outgrow your car or just want something nicer and your only option is to send it to the junkyard.


Cakewalk is the only company that I purchase software from that has this policy.  Their products are valuable enough to me that I will tolerate this nonsense; apparently enough people agree for them to run a business.
It is my understanding that in the EU, such provisions in software licenses are null and void.  Both of the posters you linked to claimed EU residency, so your concern is misplaced.

It is a mistake to conflate reselling software with piracy.  It is quite clear from the referenced threads that the individuals were selling licenses to software that they no longer used.  It is nothing like the fiends that sell $50 copies of Sonar on eBay.  


And, finally, while the health department (or more likely, the absence of buyers) might have something to say about you reselling your used Kleenex, it is certainly isn't any business of the Kimberly-Clark company.

Question.

Has anyone, including the OP, contacted Meffy about this apparent violation? He is one of the mods there...and, if I am not mistaken, there have been numerous threads shut down in marketplace for just this very thing...