Helpful ReplyLearn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested?

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Anderton
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2017/03/03 18:53:20 (permalink)

Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested?

I did a seminar at GearFest where I took files the audience brought and mastered them on the spot. Some of this ended up as a video showing what needed to be fixed, and how it was fixed...
 

 
...and people seemed to like it. 
 
I'd like to try something along these lines in the new eZine. Here's how it would work.
 
How it Works:
 
1. Send me a PM with a link to one unmastered, downloadable WAV or AIF file. Any files with "faux" mastering that have compression or limiting in the master bus, have clipping, or use a data compressed format (other than FLAC) will be rejected immediately.
2. If some files actually show up, I'll do some articles on how the files were mastered in SONAR, with before and after audio examples.
3. As a way to say thank-you, I'll send you the mastered version to use however you want.
 
The fine print:
 
  • I apologize in advance, but I cannot take the time to acknowledge receipt or answer questions like "Are you going to use my file?" I will notify you if your file is chosen prior to writing about it so you can have second thoughts if you want. ("Well I got back together with my girlfriend, so please don't use my file 'Elaine Is a Stupid Idiot,' thank you.")
  • No stems, stereo files only.
  • The material must be original, and you have to give the non-exclusive right to post it on YouTube.
 
Inrerested? PM me with a link.
 
 

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
#1
Enigmatic
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/03 19:39:58 (permalink)
love it
#2
reginaldStjohn
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/03 20:40:34 (permalink)
I love the idea. I will PM you shortly

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jude77
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/03 22:43:41 (permalink)
This another great idea by CA!
 

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chuckebaby
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/03 22:43:46 (permalink)
message sent

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BobF
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/03 22:50:20 (permalink)
I'm glad to see a hint of a new eZine ... small M mastering is a great topic too.
 
I'm also interested in any energy enhancement endorsements you're willing to make.
 
Everything you share is most appreciated, Craig. 

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#6
Anderton
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/03 23:50:08 (permalink)
BobF
I'm glad to see a hint of a new eZine ... small M mastering is a great topic too.



I'm glad this is getting some interest, I think mastering is a sort of "final frontier" for people. What I'm hoping is that by explaining why particular mastering decisions are made, people can apply the same kind of thinking to their masters. With mastering, learning how to look for problems is actually more challenging than solving the problems once you've identified them.
 
When I signed on I saw there are two PMs, so it looks like the ball is rolling! Thanks!!!
 
 

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
#7
joakes
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 00:03:18 (permalink)
Hmmm, can I use my get out of jail free card ????
 
Will PM tomorrow (French time ....), whatever your decision a great thanks for the opportunity to submit something amateurish to a pro !
 
Cheers,
Jerry

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John
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 01:41:16 (permalink)
I think its a wonderful idea. 

Best
John
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telecharge
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 02:24:33 (permalink)
Anderton
Any files with "faux" mastering that have compression or limiting in the master bus


Hey, Craig. Can you give us a little more guidance on this? I believe it is a fairly common practice to mix into a compressor on the master bus. I've seen professionals who do it and/or recommend it.
 
Another recommendation I frequently see for mixes is to leave -6 to -8 dB headroom if you are going to be mastering. Is that what you're looking for?
 
John
I think its a wonderful idea. 



+1
#10
mudgel
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 02:29:08 (permalink)
Great idea. Shame I don't have any material ready for mastering. I'll follow with interest whatever's made public.
 
Thanks again Craig

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Afrodrum
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 02:41:49 (permalink)
PM just sent. Another great idea from Craig.  I just wonder how much headroom you would prefer to deal with? I once made a mistake of sending a wav file to LANDR with Waves L3 limiter on stereo bus peaking at c. -0.3dB. It turned out not great.

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Anderton
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 03:12:01 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby telecharge 2017/03/04 03:42:27
telecharge
Anderton
Any files with "faux" mastering that have compression or limiting in the master bus


Hey, Craig. Can you give us a little more guidance on this? I believe it is a fairly common practice to mix into a compressor on the master bus. I've seen professionals who do it and/or recommend it.

 
Check out the new "Friday's Tip of the Week." There are situations where this makes sense, mostly if whatever you're doing doesn't have to be in context with other music. But just because it's a common practice doesn't necessarily mean it's the best practice. 
 
When I get something to master, I'm being paid the big $$ to make decisions on how much dynamics to add, and what kind. If there's already dynamics, then that takes away a lot of options. I've received tracks to master that were "sausaged" if you know what I mean. I can't do anything with those. Also, you want people to send you the best mix possible. The dynamics in the bus can cover up errors in judgement that would perhaps better be addressed with EQ prior to adding dynamics.  
 
I'm not saying people shouldn't do it, but it's not what I like to do, and I venture to say most mastering engineers want as clean and "honest" a mix as possible. Of course, individual tracks are a different matter...if you want to compress the hell out of your bass, go for it! I'm just concerned with the two-track master.
 
Another recommendation I frequently see for mixes is to leave -6 to -8 dB headroom if you are going to be mastering. Is that what you're looking for?
 
That was more important in the days of analog recording, but is still relevant for other reasons. I give a little more leeway there. As long as there's a dB or two, I'm happy; I can reduce the overall level if needed. But -6 to -8dB is fine too. The main thing I want to avoid are tracks that get close to 0.
 

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
#13
Anderton
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 03:14:00 (permalink)
John
I think its a wonderful idea. 



I'm glad it's getting traction. The interest indicates this could justify a monthly column in the upcoming publication. 

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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Afrodrum
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 03:15:24 (permalink)
... but the PM does not show up in my PM sent list. I remember once my every post was deleted if it included any link. Is this happening now?

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#15
Anderton
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 03:23:04 (permalink)
Afrodrum
... but the PM does not show up in my PM sent list. I remember once my every post was deleted if it included any link. Is this happening now?



I have three PMs, and yours is one of them. Definitely wouldn't mind some more. The more I have, the more I can choose ones that show off different aspects of mastering.

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
#16
Afrodrum
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 03:58:32 (permalink)
Oh good. I am sure you will receive much more than you can find time to handle :-)

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#17
kitekrazy1
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 06:35:48 (permalink)
Was it done with Sonar plugins?

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rodreb
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 07:06:48 (permalink)
Great idea!



ROD

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#19
chuckebaby
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 13:26:21 (permalink)
telecharge
Anderton
Any files with "faux" mastering that have compression or limiting in the master bus


Hey, Craig. Can you give us a little more guidance on this? I believe it is a fairly common practice to mix into a compressor on the master bus. I've seen professionals who do it and/or recommend it.
 
Another recommendation I frequently see for mixes is to leave -6 to -8 dB headroom if you are going to be mastering. Is that what you're looking for?



I it all depends on what king of music you are mixing, but I wouldn't say its common.
I personally never (ever) use compression on the Master bus. I use Compression in the Instrument buses. but only slightly just to tame the transients.
 
More often than not my Master bus is empty. I try to keep it as clean as possible and instead choose the route of FX in the Instrument buses. You want to wait on compressing the "Whole mix" in the mastering stage, not necessarily the mixing stage.
 
By using compression on a Master bus you are intern compression your whole mix. this is not good for dynamics.
*However, if I am running a " One off " for a client, so he/she can have something to listen to before its mastered, I will throw a concrete limiter on the master bus, but this is only temporary / a rough mix so the client can make sure he or she is pleased with the recordings.
This is promptly removed though after the rough mix is complete.
 
I cant speak for other producers but using compression on the master bus itself is considered a No No in the world of Chuck e baby .
But there are some styles I don't mix (Techno, Rave, exc) Maybe this is something they do. im just not aware of it.
So this is just my personal opinion .
 

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#20
Leadfoot
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 15:46:16 (permalink)
Just curious.....Is there a limit on song length? The one I'd like to submit is a little over 5 minutes long.
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telecharge
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 16:58:15 (permalink)
chuckebaby
I it all depends on what king of music you are mixing, but I wouldn't say its common.



Well, I did say fairly common. I could post a bunch of links on the subject like this one from just the other day, but why bother?
 
We get it, Chuck. You're a professional.
#22
greg_moreira
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 17:24:02 (permalink)
I think its a good idea.  It never hurts to see more examples and approaches.
 
Plus, I think people are inclined to make different decisions when they arent working on their own music, which can be a good thing.  For guys that are new and trying to learn to do this stuff....  they often dont have any material yet other than what they have created themselves.
 
Its good to have a fresh set of ears working on things when that set of ears hasnt "lived with" the song for an extended period of time.   
 
Kinda gives nice perspective to all parties
 
 
#23
Anderton
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/04 22:10:17 (permalink)
Leadfoot
Just curious.....Is there a limit on song length? The one I'd like to submit is a little over 5 minutes long.



Sure, go for it.

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
#24
Anderton
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/05 22:10:52 (permalink)
Hey everyone - thanks for your participation, I now have enough to get started. If I start running out, I'll bring this thread back. However you can still submit tracks any time...the more, the better.
 
THANKS AGAIN! This is going to be fun.

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
#25
JohanSebatianGremlin
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/05 22:39:07 (permalink)
Looking forward to following this. I think your observation that for many, mastering is the last great frontier really hits it square on the head. Can't wait to see how this will play out. 

 
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#26
JohanSebatianGremlin
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Re: Learn about Mastering in SONAR - Interested? 2017/03/05 22:49:22 (permalink)
One question, will youtube be the media of choice for posting the audio examples? I ask because from what I can tell, youtube tends to apply their own audio compression that often makes it nearly impossible to A/B examples of processing accurately. 
 

 
If gear was the determining factor, we would all have a shelf full of Grammies and a pocket full of change.  -microapp
 
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#27
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