"That's why i don't believe in bragging rights in the first place. Bragging, whether you have the right or not, is wrong IMO. You don't have to brag to be proud. "

check this out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3xS6o1XX84

If you find you are working with or sharing a stage with guys worried about bragging rights... you are hanging out with a bad group of guys.

It doesn't have to be that way.

The guy featured in the video I linked to above is the most generous guy I have ever witnessed on a stage.

all the very best,
mike

Great thread here.  I've enjoyed reading it.

I listen to music differently depending on how I'm approaching it.  As a musician, I study the instrumental parts, break down the patterns, and analyze the groove.  As a songwriter, I listen for melodic hooks, emotional/soulful intensity or depth, and lyric tricks and construction.  As an engineer, I listen for the mix, quality of the recording, EQ, compression, production tricks, and professional "gloss".  As a fan, I listen for the fun, the great hook, the feel, the mood, and the passion.  As an opinionated, elitist jerk, I like what I like and I don't like what I don't like.  It's that last one that prompts my family to disregard my opinions about music.

I don't really care that much about musical perfection.  Rock vocals don't have to be perfect to be great.  There's a difference between a raw, emotionally rich, transcendent performance by a great artist and a clinically perfect, sterile performance by a mediocre artist.  I would rather hear someone play and sing their heart out, with their voice cracking, pedal squeaking, guitar humming, and bass permanently stuck in Am, than hear a crystal clear, perfect performance by someone who just going through the motions.  For me, the music is all about the passion, the power, the intensity (not volume), the drive, the emotion, the humanity of the song.

I've also noticed that my music (the stuff that's burning a hole in my brain trying to get out) is not necessarily the same style or the same sound as the music I enjoy hearing.  While I enjoy listening to the Progressive Rock greats, my own music only borrows from that genre.  I can enjoy metal, and only use it as an ingredient in a song. 

It's one thing to critically analyze my own material.  It's another to critically analyze someone else's music.  When I analyze my own work, I'm checking to see if it lives up to my expectation of what I demand from myself.  When I analyze someone else's work, I'm not really saying, "This is wrong", or "That was bad" as much as saying, "I would have done this differently".  I don't think it's arrogant to listen to someone great, and think about how you would have done it differently.  That's not an indictment of them as an artist, merely a realization that your own artistry would go in a different direction.  There's a huge difference between criticizing an artist's work and criticizing the artist.  (I've been guilty of the latter.  Many times.)

I'm almost as opinionated about cheese.  I like Cheddar and American cheese.  Mozzarella is good, Swiss is okay, and Monteray Jack is alright.  Velveeta may not be pure cheese, but I love the stuff.  Brie, Blue, and that ilk are an abomonation and should be banished (like disco) from society. 

Did I mention that I'm opinionated?

Cheese..

Brie is good with grapes!
Blue is good with charbroiled burgers!
Whole Parmesan is with wine! (And so is Brie)
Ground Parmesan is good with pasta!
Mozzarella is good with cheese sticks and artichoke dishes!
Cheddar is good with A LOT of things!
Cream cheese is nice with anchovies!
Monteray Jack = I have never tried
Goat cheese = I don't remember what it tasted like? Maybe i fainted.

BUT HAVE YOU TASTED...

Queso de Bola! (literally ball of cheese; Filipino specialty cheese)

mike_mccue


"I really have a problem listening to that same blues lick in every song for 50 years and would find it really sad for someone that may attack me for stating the obvious."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyuSDajZTNo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUaevnP1LLg

Danny, I find it sad to think that you think that after 62 years and over 15,000 performances that a guy like BB King has been selling out shows, and putting SMILES on peoples faces, with the same blues lick.

The blues is a idiom, a play ground to have fun on. You can play the blues about a hundred million ways.

I'll bet Gary Moore would have agreed with me.

all the best,
mike

Mike, I'm beginning to think I can't write my feelings in text too good anymore or something. LOL! My whole point about this (if we were talking in person, I think you'd understand me better) is imagine sitting around a group of guys. You start talking about great guitar players, and some of the older guys that grew up on 60's and 70's start to mention their favorite players. You're with me so far, right?
 
Ok, from there they say you gotta check out this guy that guy this guy and that guy. Now, imagine you're a teen with some intelligence, a bit before your time and you really have a good head on your shoulders and you're eager to look into anything at this point because you respect these guys. When they ask you what players you like, you say "I love Steve Vai, John Petrucci, Eddie Van Halen, George Lynch, Yngwie Malmsteen, Satch" etc and most of the older cats have never heard of some of those guys. Now to me, like them or hate them, they are fantastic players who have offered something great to the world of guitar and even more so if you started playing in the 80's, 90's or presently.
 
From there you get laughs from the older guys as well as "you need to kill all your effects and plug into an amp and crank it." Or, "you speed guys have no feel...check out these guys (insert list of old classics here) and learn how to play guitar the right way."
 
So you go home, you fire up Youtube and search for these guys and check out the performances. What you hear, is not to your liking. What you hear compared to the players YOU have been studying, isn't as clean or well executed at times, and at times, it sounds like it could be mistakes or even noise.
 
The next time you see these guys again, the conversation starts up once more and you tell them that you took their advice and decided to check out these players. You share your thoughts that you can understand why people like them, but their styles are not styles you feel you wish to emulate. You get told the guys you like aren't all that. So in your defense, which you have a right for a defense, you say that you felt so and so was very repetitive, was not very good live, and you didn't feel it was a style that you wanted to add to your arsenal. Are you wrong? Who is anyone to dictate to anyone else what is great and what is not?
 
As a teacher and a guitarist that has done my best to be open about everything as well as steal a bit of every style that has appealed to me over my 44 years of life, and also a guitarist that is a bit more into the physics and challenge factor of guitar, would I really be wrong to state that I like BB King but am tired of hearing the exact same 8 note pentecostal scale for 50 years? Is that any different than you or someone else saying "guitar players in the 80's were pretty cool, but all of them relied on their speed and looks more than their actual playing and songwriting"? For some reason, I would feel a comment like that would be a bit more harsh than what I have said about Beck or BB King...yet if you said that comment to me, I'd completely understand it and not find it sad at all. Why? Because if you said that to me, you would be as correct as I am when I state that I am tired of hearing the same scale for 50 years. Both of us are completely correct regardless of how many people love that and are still going to sold out shows, yes?
 
My point is, the older folks always have to take a stand to defend their guitar gods. Why do I never feel the need to defend mine and why can I accept the crits? Why do I or a student of mine have to be told to do the research or learn about something that we aren't into or be called cluless for? This is just not fair and I find it sad that YOU think this is acceptable.
 
Just about everyone that has chimed in here in defense of an old player is doing exactly what I'm explaining to you that happens in real life. See you guys that are older, you have to adapt to the kids. They teach you something. The make you change with the times. You're allowed to love your musical heros and that doesn't have to change. But you can't push them on others when the times have changed and so has the art of guitar..like it or hate it. It's like fighting today vs. fighting in 1970. With the new techniques out today, you would be foolish to use old fighting techniques against someone that is well skilled in the techniques of today. We all steal a bit of everything and make things what they are. It's good for myself as well as my students to go back in time and borrow, but we should not be made out like fools if we do not see things the same way as others. The vets and old school cats have a way of doing this and they don't even realize it.
 
This stems back to song genre acceptance. People are so biased and stuck in their ways to where they refuse to see the beauty or positive in something. If we gave Ubiquitous Bubba (great post by the way bro!) a hard time about his lack of love for disco and asked him to "learn about the style, you just may like it" he's going to tell us to go eff ourselves...and rightfully so because he just doesn't like that. Why would we feel the need to defend it? See my point at all man?

While I don't want to steer this thread into 'guitar wars', there are some interesting points above that chime with my own feelings. I spent a lot of years trying, over and over again, to hear what it was in Clapton's playing that caused him to held in such high esteem.

At 50 years old, I still can't get it, his playing bores me to tears. I used to feel a bit 'lacking' feeling like that, but these days I guess I've come to understand that his style just doesn't 'do it' for me. Hendrix is the same for me, but I get his place in the scheme of things. It's admiration and acknowledgment more than a desire to listen to those guys. Now, I can listen to Guthrie Govan, Willy Porter or Steve Rothery any time, and get goosebumps up my arms every time.

I like Jon and Mark's posts about re-living albums you bought when you were young, and shaking your head in disbelief - and yet you can jump back into that 14 year old's head if you try, and see what it was all about..the mystery of prog, the unsettling weirdness of avant-garde, the macho stance of hard-rock and heavy metal and the sheer fun of pop. Nothing will ever grab hold of your brain as much it did when you were in your teens. I remember when records by Family, Procul Harum and Lindisfarne nestled alongside Mud, Chicory Tip and Slade in my little red singles box, it was all good...and I still think Wichita Lineman is the best song ever written.

jamesg1213

...and I still think Wichita Lineman is the best song ever written.

Although he didn't write Wichita Lineman ... Glenn Campbell is one of the great guitar players of our time too ...

I'd put Ricky Skaggs, Jerry Reed, Glenn Campbell, Roy Clark, up against any rocker any day.

In reference to Bub: Why on earth would you feel the need to put those guitar players up against a rocker? That's a ludicrous statement to make. If you haven't noticed, those styles are so drastically different there is no need to compare. One has absolutely nothing to do with the other. Those players you mentioned are by far some of the best in the business. But they are because they DON'T play rock. Why compare them? It makes no sense at all other than...right, another confrontation from you to disrupt this thread and because I'm a rocker. Why else would you even be in this thread? It's not like you have anything to offer of any value. Right, you saw my name, it's your chance to upset me.

What you said there is as ludicrous as me saying "I'll put Segovia up against you and guys like you any day". There's talent on one side, big mouths on the other...two different styles of "entertainment". One has absolutely nothing to do with the other.

Let me tell you something for what it's worth. I didn't post in your video thread out of respect and I'm trying to get along here without confrontation. How about you give me the same respect and stay out of mine? I made a mention of the video in this thread due to some of the stuff I read as well as what I had been reading on other forums about it.

Right away you felt the need to justify yourself in your first post in this thread. I never mentioned your name, I never said you said anything negative and the thought of you never crossed my mind. You just happened to have posted a video that was "in the news" and I made my own thread to talk about it in. No worries dude, you are dead to me. I'd never make a silent reference towards you or attempt to snub you. I'd come right out and say "you make me sick, I don't like you" and I'd still say "bring it or shut it" because, well, you make me sick and I don't like you. :) Please stay away from the threads I create as I really could care less what your take on anything in life is. I promise to do the same.

marcos69

jamesg1213

...and I still think Wichita Lineman is the best song ever written.

Although he didn't write Wichita Lineman ... Glenn Campbell is one of the great guitar players of our time too ...

I'd put Ricky Skaggs, Jerry Reed, Glenn Campbell, Roy Clark, up against any rocker any day.

I've been a fan of Glenn Cambpell's forever.  He can flat tear it up when he wants to.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JI6lzOQW5k0&feature=related

I remember seeing this Marcos, thanks for sharing it!! Gotta love Glenn! When I first started playing, that's actually what I was after. I just wanted to sit around camp fires playing acoustic and singing songs. Then the 80's bug bit me and it's taken me a few years to get out of it and go back to some good ole finger-pickin boys. :)

Interview with Steve Vai where he shows what a class act he is at the end when the reporter asks about comparisons to EVH. I remember when I joined the gear page a couple of years ago and saw so many VAI haters proclaiming he aint no SRV, EVH or Malmsteen thinking what the hell is up with all this hate.  Granted it's comparisons within the rock world but I'll take shot and say he would compliment and give credit to a player in any genre.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjARr7UlvMs

Mark. That is awesome. When I was a kid in the 70's my sister got me an organ for Christmas and I'd always watch Lawrence Welk to see that Jo Ann Castle play.

Danny Danzi

marcos69

Danny Danzi

marcos69

jamesg1213

...and I still think Wichita Lineman is the best song ever written.

Although he didn't write Wichita Lineman ... Glenn Campbell is one of the great guitar players of our time too ...

I'd put Ricky Skaggs, Jerry Reed, Glenn Campbell, Roy Clark, up against any rocker any day.

I've been a fan of Glenn Cambpell's forever.  He can flat tear it up when he wants to.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JI6lzOQW5k0&feature=related

I remember seeing this Marcos, thanks for sharing it!! Gotta love Glenn! When I first started playing, that's actually what I was after. I just wanted to sit around camp fires playing acoustic and singing songs. Then the 80's bug bit me and it's taken me a few years to get out of it and go back to some good ole finger-pickin boys. :)

Believe it or not, the guy that made me want to become highly technically proficient on guitar wasn't a guitarist at all.  Eugene Fodor (who died recently) was a classical violinist with a flare for performance.  He used to play on the Johnny Carson show every once and a while.  But I was blown away by his skill.  I'd say he was the Steve Vai of classical violin. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pw0W1xB7myk&feature=related

Oh man, talk about total sickness! That dude is more like Paganini! LOL!! So Marcos, how far did you get with learning stuff like that? It's amazing how much harder it is to learn violin licks. I'm doing a cover version of Devil went down to Georgia on guitar...it was pretty challenging because the stuff that he plays is different than what I'm used to. Ever try that tune? It's pretty cool and a nice challenge. Some of it I nail, other parts, I add a bit of myself into.
 
rhyno: great vid there. I just missed meeting Vai in person one time after a show. I had a friend that lost his house keys so we had to try out best to take care of that. We did find them, but missed the opportunity to meet Vai. Everyone I talked to had nothing but great things to say about him. He seems as genuine in person as he is on the stage.

Well Danny, if you mean how far on violin?, I don't play any.  I meant his prowess inspired me to try to be a technician on guitar since that is what I was playing as a kid.  How far did I get on that?, you'd have to listen to my soundclick and tell me.  Not as good as him that's for sure.

Danny Danzi


Hahaha, no man, I meant how far did you get copping vlion lines like Fodor's and using them on guitar? Going to your soundclick right now...I seem to remember listening to something of yours before....

I didn't mean I wanted to copy him.  I was just inspired to be more of a technician than a pop artist per se.

Thanks for the props.  Funny the 2 songs you mention are amongst my oldest

Wow, your playing is incredible on that video.  Awesome man!  I never heard of controlling the effects like that.  How do you do it?

This thread evolved into something cool. Killer chops there Danny.  Miranda kills too Mark. A couple of great guitar players just saying hi in the common language. One of my favorites on youtube for inspiration is a guy named Mike Poss. Worth checking out.

Danny Danzi


Thanks bro. :) Well, you have to have all your effects set up midi-wise and then run them into Sonar. From there, you can select what ever parameter you need by creating a midi track and then writing in the events. Your midi gear needs to be set up to correspond with the midi note numbers in Sonar as well. It's a little tricky to do at first, but with a little experimentation, it was pretty easy.

The key is the midi note numbers and the control over your effects processor. All my stuff just seems to work thankfully. I'll do a short video for you to show you how it works for me if you want?

You know, midi is way above my head.  I appreciate the offer though.  I really don't use much in the way of effects.  Just the guitar through a Marshall with a Boss ME-20 pedal only for compression.  I'll add delay in Sonar and the occasional chorus.

I was watching some of you Guitar war vids on youtube and I am really impressed.  I was doing some work with the music in the background and had to stop and watch to see what the hell you just did with your hands.

Rhyno, thanks for the comment on Miranda.  It's one of my favorites.  I'll check out Mike Poss.

Ok, here ya go...for anyone that may want to see this. :) Enjoy! I promise the file is not infected. :)

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4909348/4Marcos.zip