Looping groove clips

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jvanbeek
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2014/12/27 19:19:58 (permalink)

Looping groove clips

I am using Cakewalk SONAR X3 Producer and am having the following problems.  I record a simple djembe line.  I then resize the data to only use the area of the line that I want to keep.  I then make a looping groove clip with this data.  I then stretch the clip so that it covers 12 bars.  When I play it back, extra notes are added to the sound clip.  Has anyone ever experienced this?  I got this idea from the "CreatingAnAudioLoop" video from Eli Krantzberg.  Thank you for your time.


#1

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    Anderton
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    Re: Looping groove clips 2014/12/27 20:06:46 (permalink)
    "Extra notes added to the sound clip" isn't specific enough to give a certain answer, but if the number of beats isn't 1, 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, etc., you'll need to enter the number of beats in the Beats field when you open the loop construction window.
     
    If that doesn't solve the problem, please give more data (are the extra notes at the correct tempo? is the timbre any different? Does the clip show rounded corners to indicate it's a groove clip?) and we'll continue troubleshooting.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #2
    jvanbeek
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    Re: Looping groove clips 2014/12/27 21:31:33 (permalink)
    Thank you for responding.  The beats are set to 4.  When I play the track without looping enabled, the 4 beat track plays fine.  When I Looping in Groove Clips, the track gets a little bit wider, an extra note is added at the beginning and the tempo is slowed down.  The piece is at 96 bpm, but when I select Looping, the original tempo field gets a value of 153.6, sounds slower and is not able to be updated.  Thank you for your time.
     
    #3
    jvanbeek
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    Re: Looping groove clips 2014/12/27 21:37:34 (permalink)
    One more thing.  I have, many times, restarted Cakewalk.  However, when I am re-starting now, I get the following message; "Transients are in the process of being generated.  Depending upon project settings, playback may be different until the process is complete."
     
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    Anderton
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    Re: Looping groove clips 2014/12/28 01:29:01 (permalink)
    jvanbeek
    One more thing.  I have, many times, restarted Cakewalk.  However, when I am re-starting now, I get the following message; "Transients are in the process of being generated.  Depending upon project settings, playback may be different until the process is complete."



    I'm pretty sure that means that an edit filter was set to audio transients at some point or AudioSnap was selected, and it's still building tranients. Go into the Inspector for clips, select the AudioSnap tab, and disable it for any clips that have it enabled

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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    Anderton
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    Re: Looping groove clips 2014/12/28 01:33:14 (permalink)
    jvanbeek
    Thank you for responding.  The beats are set to 4.  When I play the track without looping enabled, the 4 beat track plays fine.  When I Looping in Groove Clips, the track gets a little bit wider, an extra note is added at the beginning and the tempo is slowed down.  The piece is at 96 bpm, but when I select Looping, the original tempo field gets a value of 153.6, sounds slower and is not able to be updated.  Thank you for your time.



    This might be related to the transients issue. If a clip has AudioSnap enabled, the editable field for beats etc. in the loop construction window can't be altered.
     
    Try this. Select the clip that's not working for you. Check in the Inspector if AudioSnap is enabled. If it is, uncheck it. Then in the Loop Construction window, make sure Loop On/Off is checked under Clip. At that point, you should be able to edit the Beats field.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #6
    jvanbeek
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    Re: Looping groove clips 2014/12/28 12:57:39 (permalink)
    Thank you so much for your quick responses.  I am going to try all that you suggest.  Again, I can't thank you enough.
     
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    Anderton
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    Re: Looping groove clips 2014/12/28 21:34:44 (permalink)
    jvanbeek
    Thank you so much for your quick responses.  I am going to try all that you suggest.  Again, I can't thank you enough.



    Thank me when it works!  Until then the problem hasn't been solved.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #8
    jvanbeek
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    Re: Looping groove clips 2014/12/30 16:30:06 (permalink)
    I've tried your suggestions listed above, but with no luck.  I know this issue is hard to resolve without seeing the tracks first hand.  I am going to work with this without loops.  I'll copy the audio and paste it into a track for the number of times the loop would have gone.  I appreciate you trying to help, but I don't want to take up any more of your time.  If you do think of anything else, however, please post it and I will try.  Thank you.
     
    #9
    brundlefly
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    Re: Looping groove clips 2014/12/30 17:19:24 (permalink)
    Can you share the raw audio clip somewhere (i.e. an export of the section you're working with before converting to a groove clip)?. If we can reproduce the problem, it will be easier to find a solution. Creating a smoothly looping groove clip can take a little finessing sometimes, depending on the content. My guess is the problem has something to do with the timing or length of the raw audio not perfectly matching the tempo and time signature of the project and/or beats-in-clip being mis-detected as suggested by Craig.
     
     
     
     

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    #10
    jvanbeek
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    Re: Looping groove clips 2014/12/30 19:09:58 (permalink)
    You are exactly correct.  As I look more closely, I find that the tempo is not exactly precise.  I then imagine that when I convert to a groove clip, the fact that the timing is a little off throws the whole conversion.
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    RobertB
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    Re: Looping groove clips 2014/12/30 19:46:02 (permalink)
    When you are recording clips that you intend to use as loops, use the metronome.
    This ensures that you are in sync with the project clock.
    Also Groove Clip almost always miscalculates the beats in the clip.
    If you have a clip 12 measures at 4/4 it would be 48 beats.
    Verify that beats in clip shows 48. Most likely it does not. it's probably something weird, like 37. Change it to the correct number, and you're good to go.

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    #12
    Anderton
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    Re: Looping groove clips 2014/12/30 19:46:42 (permalink)
    jvanbeek
    You are exactly correct.  As I look more closely, I find that the tempo is not exactly precise.  I then imagine that when I convert to a groove clip, the fact that the timing is a little off throws the whole conversion.


     
    I doubt that's the problem. The whole point of a groove clip is that you can take something at one tempo and it will work fine in other tempos.
     
    Can you post a screen shot of the loop construction window when you double-click on the clip? You can upload images at imgur.com and post a link here that will place the picture in the post.
     
    I'm sure it's something simple. Please note that slowing down a Groove Clip will give MUCH worse results. I'm not sure what the original tempo was of the loop or of the project, but if you slow down a groove clip by more than 10% or so, you really have to know how to edit the clip to have it sound decent. On the other hand you can usually speed up by 100% or more. If I'm going to be creating a groove clip, I usually record at 80-100 BPM.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #13
    jvanbeek
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    Re: Looping groove clips 2015/01/10 14:29:00 (permalink)
    I'm sorry for the huge delay in my response, but my job prevents me from working with my music.  I believe that the problem was due to the fact that my computer had a virus.  I was able to get rid of the virus and everything seems better.  Thank you all for your time and suggestions.
     
    #14
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