• SONAR
  • Ground Loops and Radio Frequentcy Interference. (p.2)
2016/09/17 08:53:23
bitflipper
Cell phones are another potential source of RFI. Their signature is an intermittent buzzing. 
2016/09/17 08:54:58
slartabartfast
Just to be clear, the interference that you hear as you move your guitar around is not not typically RF (radio frequency). While it is possible to pick up electromagnetic radiation at that high a frequency (and even to hear actual radio broadcasts from your audio system without a receiver in rare cases), more commonly the hum is not an RF signal but is actually in the audio range at the frequency of the pitch you hear as the hum. Within the range of the magnetic field created by current flow through a conductor, a current will be induced in a nearby conductor at primarily the same frequency. True RF interference is going to be inaudible unless something in the system amplifies low sidebands. Devices that have AC energized coils such as electric motors or transformers or high voltages like fluorescent lighting are the most likely sources, but even electrical wiring in the walls can sometimes be at fault. 
2016/09/17 09:14:47
Mosvalve
On my system I was hearing my hard drives chugging, mouse movements etc. None of which was being recorded on my tracks. After troubleshooting for ground loops I found the connection of my firewire cable to my interface was the issue. Not the cable itself as I tried different cables. What I did  was use a three to two prong adapters. The type that has that little metal loop that you screw to the wall plate. I put one of those on my interface and my monitors and all noise stopped. Apparently these components were fighting for ground. (Do not srew the adapter to the wall plate.) What I learned is just having your audio cables connected to your gear creates ground or ground loops or something like that.
 
It was this video that helped me correct my problem.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4YM1iwC6vhg
 
2016/09/17 09:36:18
hbarton
Hi,
This info may be rehashing some old known stuff, but hum problems (and RF problems) happen when the chassis of equipment are wired to different locations. That incorrect grounding allows small  currents to flow in the chassis ground wiring of equipment due to slight voltage differences. The correct way to ground your studio is to pick a good ground location, and run all the equipment chassis grounds back to that point with SEPARATE wires for each piece of equipment with a good grade ground wire.

Bottom line, do not connect one chassis to another and then to another and so on and then run them them back to other multiple ground points (this is daisy chaining). Doing that will allow different potentials in the ground line which will induce hum (and RF).

Hope that helps!


2016/09/17 09:39:30
JohanSebatianGremlin
sharke
 I do get quite horrendous buzzing from my Telecaster sometimes. I know they're pretty noisy at the best of times but it makes recording anything with anything more than the lightest of crunch sounds problematic. What I've found though is that there is a "sweet spot" at which I can position my guitar which virtually eliminates the hum. Unfortunately for me it happens to be facing away from my DAW with the front of the Telecaster tilted toward the floor 

I put Lace Sensors in my Tele and shielded the cavities. Solved the noise problems completely and makes the guitar a joy to record with.


2016/09/17 11:42:45
tlw
PeterMc
tlw
Wi-fi can also be a source of noise - usually showing up as a whining at around 2.4KHz and 5KHz, which are the usual bands routers and computers transmit on.



Wi-fi is 2.4GHz and 5GHz. It won't even bother your dog. Not sure about the other frequencies associated with computers - USB and Ethernet should also be way beyond audible frequencies. There may be other stray RF from the components in the case that could cause problems.
 
Transformers that drive LED and other lights can be an issue. These convert mains voltage to 12V DC or similar, and generally sit near the light. I know these can cause noise in my guitar unless I'm using the humbucker pickup.
 
Cheers, Peter.


OK, I made a typo. Which doesn't alter wi-fi resulting in very narrow-band noise around 2.4 and 5KHz, and I can produce the plots to show it if you insist. Said noise going away if the 802.11ac router is switched off.

As for humbuckers, the OP says they have noise in Gibson humbuckers but not Fender humbuckers ("noiseless" pickups).
2016/09/17 11:58:21
tlw
z1812
Hi tlw,

Thanks for the reply. You must have misread my post about the guitar interference. The Fenders are fine. The Gibsons are the problem. I do turn the computer off for practice, but I need it on to record.

John


No, I read you fine. I'm just surprised that one humbucker guitar, a Fender, is silent while another, a Gibson, is not. They use exactly the same technology, humbucking pickups, which is one thing that kind of made me wonder if P90s are involved or maybe coil-tapping.

It might be that the Fender is better shielded in the cavities than the Gibson(s). Another is that if you use more gain with the Gibson than the Fender then any noise in the system that's coming in through the guitar is going to be amplified more. Or, more accurately, the compression of the entire signal will raise the noise floor along with the signal.
2016/09/17 12:34:56
Cactus Music
I built my home and wired it all myself under the supervision of my buddy who is an electrician. 
The trick is to be meticulous about the neutral at the panel and having lots of ground potential. It gets dry here in the summer and grounding can fade to nothing. I have 6 ground rods. We've been hit by lightning a few times and other than smelling melted plastic and ozone very little damage was done. My pump controller was blown off the wall and all the phone lines melted. 
That was before we had a computer and since then I always unplug everything important during potential storms. 
 
My friend knew I would be putting a studio in my attic so he recommended keeping any 110 V motor loads on one phase of the panel. Then we ran a special circuit to the attic on the other phase.  Keeping fridges and freezers on the other phase. Nothing you can do about 240 Volt motors as they share both phases. This is only my pump and it's a long way from the house so it's not an issue. 
 
The whole studio runs off this one circuit and directly to a Furman line conditioner. Turning off the furman shuts down the studio and I unplug it during storms. 
 
I find guitar noise is directly related to the instrument it self. I have a lot of guitars. So if it's a noisy guitar orBass I upgrade the wiring and Pups. 
2016/09/17 16:27:50
hbarton
Hi,
Yes, that is a good idea to move any motors off the 120V phase that is running to your studio wiring (if you can). If you have a good electrician, they can help you accomplish the balancing.
 
Many people are not aware that you have two separate 120 volt phases coming into a typical US home and electricians balance the loads across them for new construction (which is the correct thing to do). However, this usually assures that you have some noisy refrig or air conditioner on the phase as your mic preamp on (another reason to use balanced mic wires). 
 
A recording friend I know didn't realize he had 3 phase coming into his house but after working with an electrician, he was able to set up one phase for his studio, one for his workshop, and one for the rest of the house. He was also able to isolate any 240 motors from the studio line by using the other two phases - sweet!

Now just think if Tesla actually talked Westinghouse into transmitting AC wirelessly - himmmm.
 
Have fun but be safe,
 
h
2016/09/17 20:16:49
fret_man
Does the noise from the guitar go away if you turn its volume control all the way?
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