Hi all,
 
I’m programming some semi-orchestral tracks using Sonar Platinum and wanted to ask whether you guys consider Spatial Imaging necessary for a smaller ensemble?
 
I’ve not used spatial imaging before but am looking to get my mix sounding more realistic. 
 
My instrument line-up:
Piano/Keyboard
Guitar
Double bass
Drums
Orchestral percussion
Solo violin
2 reeds (covering a combination of either flute, piccolo, clarinet, alto or tenor sax)
2 trumpets
1 trombone
 
Also do you consider using stereo imagers such as Waves S1 or Cakewalk’s the Blue Tubes any easier/any advantage over Kontakt’s stereo modeller?
 
Many thanks.

I don't have any information, but I am very interested in this subject, too.

I will usually use channel tools on a bus with the orchestral instruments on it with the widening preset. Then I place the pop/rock instruments in a more up close in your face type of placement. I like the sound of the orchestra sounding a bit more like it is in a hall than the up close, in your face drums and guitars. A good reverb to glue it all together helps as well to find a balance between the guitars/drums/vocals and the orchestra stuff. It all depends on the sound you are going for. Pop/rock stuff tends to be more in your face even with the orchestral instruments while but I prefer more of a classical/hall sound for my stuff. My 2 cents.

CDK
Hi all,
 
I’m programming some semi-orchestral tracks using Sonar Platinum and wanted to ask whether you guys consider Spatial Imaging necessary for a smaller ensemble?
 
I’ve not used spatial imaging before but am looking to get my mix sounding more realistic. 
 
My instrument line-up:
Piano/Keyboard
Guitar
Double bass
Drums
Orchestral percussion
Solo violin
2 reeds (covering a combination of either flute, piccolo, clarinet, alto or tenor sax)
2 trumpets
1 trombone
 
Also do you consider using stereo imagers such as Waves S1 or Cakewalk’s the Blue Tubes any easier/any advantage over Kontakt’s stereo modeller?
 
Many thanks.

I've produced many orchestral pieces using Sonar.  I often use a little bit of spatial imaging as it adds to transparency of texture and increasing the perception of the stereo field.  The drawback is if you use too much it can remove too much energy from the center, which can sound awkward.   As usual, finding the right amount of effect is crucial.  I use Ozone 5' stereo imager...
 
Here's an example for a small ensemble (12 instruments):
http://www.jerrygerber.com/mp3/Music%20for%20Twelve%20Instruments.mp3
 
Best,
Jerry
 
 

Ever attended an actual symphony? Did they hand out spatial enhancers at the door?
 
There's the apocryphal story of the audiophile who'd never actually been to a live concert, so his friend took him to one. As they left, the friend asked "how'd you like the concert?", to which the audiophile replied "needed more treble".
 

bitflipper
Ever attended an actual symphony? Did they hand out spatial enhancers at the door?
 
There's the apocryphal story of the audiophile who'd never actually been to a live concert, so his friend took him to one. As they left, the friend asked "how'd you like the concert?", to which the audiophile replied "needed more treble".
 

Thanks. So what's your point?

bitflipper
Ever attended an actual symphony? Did they hand out spatial enhancers at the door?
 

I usually neck mine before I go in, in case the bouncers check me for them.

CDK
Hi all,
 
I’m programming some semi-orchestral tracks using Sonar Platinum and wanted to ask whether you guys consider Spatial Imaging necessary for a smaller ensemble?
 
I’ve not used spatial imaging before but am looking to get my mix sounding more realistic. 
 
My instrument line-up:
Piano/Keyboard
Guitar
Double bass
Drums
Orchestral percussion
Solo violin
2 reeds (covering a combination of either flute, piccolo, clarinet, alto or tenor sax)
2 trumpets
1 trombone
 
Also do you consider using stereo imagers such as Waves S1 or Cakewalk’s the Blue Tubes any easier/any advantage over Kontakt’s stereo modeller?
 
Many thanks.

 I really wouldn't recommend reeds on flute or piccolo. I once put my soprano mouthpiece on a trumpet, which was an interesting sombre sound, but not playable.
 
You have a lot of solo voices in there instead of groups of players. I can see how a spacial tool could widen a section to add realism (I've not done any orchestral music, but seems that reverb is much more of the sound), but for solo voices I think widening makes more of an effect as draws away from realism.
 
I'm pining for a bass clarinet at the moment, after hearing it voiced with a soprano. Saxes I think pull away from an orchestral sound, so a bass clarinet could make a good sub for a tenor sax, if you wanted more weight. I think a piccolo suits sitting over a full orchestra, but in an  ensemble sound you have going on, the higher register of a  Concert (soprano) flute, might be a better choice. I have an alto flute, which apparently is scoffed at a bit by some classical musicians , in preference to the bass flute.

bitflipper
Ever attended an actual symphony? Did they hand out spatial enhancers at the door?
 
There's the apocryphal story of the audiophile who'd never actually been to a live concert, so his friend took him to one. As they left, the friend asked "how'd you like the concert?", to which the audiophile replied "needed more treble".
 

Not sure what this has to do with OP's questions.  Listening to music in a hall is a very different acoustic experience than listening over two loudspeakers or headphones.  
 
Jerry

CDK

bitflipper
Ever attended an actual symphony? Did they hand out spatial enhancers at the door?
 
There's the apocryphal story of the audiophile who'd never actually been to a live concert, so his friend took him to one. As they left, the friend asked "how'd you like the concert?", to which the audiophile replied "needed more treble".
 

Thanks. So what's your point?

In a perhaps overly-obtuse way, I was merely attempting to gently challenge your basic assumption, that spatial enhancement is warranted for orchestral music.
 
As jsg notes above, the concert hall experience, like any live performance, is quite different from listening to recorded music. But isn't the goal of recording to try our best to replicate that experience? Sure, not in all genres, some of which have no connection to reality at all. But acoustical music is firmly grounded in the real world. 
 
The placement of instruments and the acoustics of the hall make the classical orchestra inherently stereophonic. If you're lucky enough to be seated in the sweet spot of a concert hall, the sound will completely envelop you in a most pleasing way. Replicate this in your recordings and there's no need for electronic trickery to deceive the ear.
 
I hope my point is clearer now.