• Hardware
  • Guitar sims and hardware processors (p.3)
2016/05/25 14:58:59
Jim Roseberry
Nothing beats the real thing (under ideal circumstances)
 
With the Kemper, Axe-FX, or Helix, it's not 100%... but it's so close that (to me) it just doesn't matter.
The Helix form-factor is perfect for live use, it's easy to program, sounds good, and weighs a whole lot less than a tube-head and 2x12 cab.  In my circumstance (live), I was talking out guitar amp/cab, keyboard, and vocal stuff.
It was getting to be a real drag.  Soundman was nearly beating me out of the building...  
 
 
2016/05/25 15:52:29
batsbrew
nobody knows what 'rock and roll' means anymore.
 

2016/05/25 18:04:10
streckfus
I don't think anyone would make the argument that amp sims are preferable to the real thing. But there's a reason amp sims exist - because most of us can't afford nor have the space for a huge collection of classic amps.  So if I have a choice of spending a few hundred bucks on some amp simulators or tens of thousands of dollars on real amps and their matching cabs (and a new house to keep all the stuff), sorry, I'm going with the amp sims.
2016/05/25 19:21:42
MakerDP
streckfus
I don't think anyone would make the argument that amp sims are preferable to the real thing. But there's a reason amp sims exist - because most of us can't afford nor have the space for a huge collection of classic amps.  So if I have a choice of spending a few hundred bucks on some amp simulators or tens of thousands of dollars on real amps and their matching cabs (and a new house to keep all the stuff), sorry, I'm going with the amp sims.




I hear you, but I guess it depends on your goals.
 
If you are looking to define "your signature sound" then you should spend the $$$ on ONE top-quality amp and pedals if you think you need them (or do what I do and save thousands by building it yourself) that will define your signature sound.  Learn how to mic it properly (or use impulse responses and a reactive load box) and be able to quickly reproduce that setup live and in the studio.
 
If your needs are akin to a session guitarist and you need to sound like anybody at any given moment in your own home studio, then yeah, buy some quality sims.
 
Not to toot my own horn but to show what you can do if you are DIY savvy... This is my current amp collection:
Matchless DC30
Fender-ish (custom modified build - think Princeton/Deluxe Reverb on steroids)
Marshall 18-watt (1974)
Marshall JTM45 (preamp section only)
Custom self-design harp amp based on old 1954-ish Fender Tweed Super
 
If I were to buy all those original amps outright, I would spend well over $15,000.
I built them all for less than $2,000 and only the DC30 was from a kit, the rest from scratch (less $.)  A DC30 alone will cost you around $4,000 but I built my clone from a kit for less than $700 including cabinet and speaker. Still not chump-change but geez if you know your way around a soldering iron and have the willingness to learn a bit as you go, you should really go for it!
 
Hope this doesn't come off as bragging... it's really just an encouragement to engage in an extremely rewarding hobby that can save you some serious $$$ as you go and open your world up to tone you only ever dreamed about obtaining!
 
2016/05/25 20:17:09
streckfus
MakerDP
streckfus
I don't think anyone would make the argument that amp sims are preferable to the real thing. But there's a reason amp sims exist - because most of us can't afford nor have the space for a huge collection of classic amps.  So if I have a choice of spending a few hundred bucks on some amp simulators or tens of thousands of dollars on real amps and their matching cabs (and a new house to keep all the stuff), sorry, I'm going with the amp sims.




I hear you, but I guess it depends on your goals.
 
If you are looking to define "your signature sound" then you should spend the $$$ on ONE top-quality amp and pedals if you think you need them (or do what I do and save thousands by building it yourself) that will define your signature sound.  Learn how to mic it properly (or use impulse responses and a reactive load box) and be able to quickly reproduce that setup live and in the studio.
 
If your needs are akin to a session guitarist and you need to sound like anybody at any given moment in your own home studio, then yeah, buy some quality sims.
 
Not to toot my own horn but to show what you can do if you are DIY savvy... This is my current amp collection:
Matchless DC30
Fender-ish (custom modified build - think Princeton/Deluxe Reverb on steroids)
Marshall 18-watt (1974)
Marshall JTM45 (preamp section only)
Custom self-design harp amp based on old 1954-ish Fender Tweed Super
 
If I were to buy all those original amps outright, I would spend well over $15,000.
I built them all for less than $2,000 and only the DC30 was from a kit, the rest from scratch (less $.)  A DC30 alone will cost you around $4,000 but I built my clone from a kit for less than $700 including cabinet and speaker. Still not chump-change but geez if you know your way around a soldering iron and have the willingness to learn a bit as you go, you should really go for it!
 
Hope this doesn't come off as bragging... it's really just an encouragement to engage in an extremely rewarding hobby that can save you some serious $$$ as you go and open your world up to tone you only ever dreamed about obtaining!
 




Nope, don't see that as bragging at all. Some folks are quite skilled in the DIY world, yourself obviously being one of them. Myself, however, not so much. Not at all, to be honest.
 
And yeah, you are correct: if you are a bona fide guitar player looking for your signature sound, then yes, absolutely. Spend the money and get an amp or two. But for hacks like me, I play the guitar but I'm not a guitarist, catch my drift? Most of the stuff I write is classic rock/bluesy with some folk/country thrown in. So in my case, sometimes I want my Les Paul to snarl through a TubeScreamer into a Marshall stack. Other times, I'd prefer to have my Telecaster twang through a Twin Reverb. Or maybe run the Strat through a Soldano...and so on. Different tunes call for different tones, and in that regard amp sims are more a matter of necessity than preference. Ideally, yeah, I'd love to have all those amps for real. Then again, I'd also like to have the real guitars I mentioned above as well.  My Les Paul is an Epiphone (although it is the Joe Perry Boneyard, which is pretty slick). My Telecaster is a Squire Classic Vibe. My Strat does have "Fender" on the headstock, but it was made in Mexico. 
 
Not saying this about you, but we as musicians are a competitive bunch and unfortunately there's a tendency to play the superiority card when it comes to gear. "If it don't say Gibson, it ain't a Les Paul." "If you ain't tracking through a tube pre-amp, you ain't tracking through nothin'." There are obviously advantages to having top-of-the-line stuff, but it's not as though a person can't make good music with cheap gear.  (Real life example: I played an American Telecaster then picked up the Squire...the Squire sounded better, believe it or not.)
 
I will say, though, that I don't see that so much on this particular forum. Gear snobs are rampant elsewhere on the web, but overall this particular community is refreshingly focused on helping each other out and much more "tolerant" of those who don't have all the expensive toys. :)
2016/05/25 22:31:20
MakerDP
You are absolutely correct streckfus... in your case and for those in similar situations sims make the most sense.
 
I was somewhat impressed with the TH3 bundled with SONAR. It has a pretty decent sound to it.
 
And to be brutally honest, if someone isn't going to go through all the effort required to get a really good mic'ed-up tone for whatever reason then they are better off with modelling.
 
BUT just as easy though is a great sounding amp with a reactive load and impulse response cabinet sims for silent mic-less recording. I am going to start experimenting with this type of setup hopefully this summer.
 
2016/05/26 04:32:10
Genghis
MakerDP
BUT just as easy though is a great sounding amp with a reactive load and impulse response cabinet sims for silent mic-less recording. I am going to start experimenting with this type of setup hopefully this summer.


I've been recording my 5150 III with mics and using a THD hot plate to get it down to a reasonable level, but wanted to have a way to record silently for late night as well. Since it will load an amp as well as attenuate, I picked up a Torpedo Cab and just started playing around with it today.  I think it will do the trick for the night time recording, plus when I record during the day I can mix in a track of a simulated 4x12 along with a mic or two on my attenuated 1x12 and it sounds really thick and juicy.  Really happy with it.  Of course they have the software Wall of Sound as well if you would rather just buy a few select cabs and do it on the cheap, but I like having the hardware version myself.
2016/05/26 11:32:48
MakerDP
I've been looking at the Radial Headload Prodigy or the Suhr Reactive Load and RedWirez or Ownhammer for IR's.
 
I've experimented a little bit with a preamp going into the demo versions of some IR's and was happy with the results. I'd imagine it would only get better with the power amp factored into the equation as well.
 
But, I've also decided that, no matter what method I use for tracking I am going to start using a splitter and always record a dry DI guitar track so I can go back and reamp if I need to do any major tone tweaking or layering. I just got an ART RDB reamping box yesterday and so far I really like the functionality and price.
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