Danny.

Much to the consternation of many of the 'experts' I used nothing but my onboard card for a year or two.  I totally agree with your statement.

For mixing it is perfectly fine

but ASIO4ALL is a very aggressive program and will override (in some cases) any native ASIO drivers for other soundcards, so I won't have it on my DAW.  I've often seen where ASIO4ALL will be used before any other ASIO drivers are used regardless of how you have it set up in sonar the last time you used it.

having said that, I do still have my onboard soundcard (soundmax, not realtek:  pedantic) available to be used if needed and it is sent to my mixer and I can choose to use it whenever I wish and DO use it for checking my mixes.

but I don't use ASIO drivers with it - I only use it with WMP or other program, that way I don't have to change my settings in sonar.

My Sigma-Tel card works just fine here with ASIO4ALL....and I have no issues with mine. But then, I also use a couple of mixers as well ...

Danny Danzi


I don't get it...I love my Realtek's and use them all the time for various things. They are all I use on all my service boxes and my laptop. I'd not compare it to any of the super great cards I have...but I don't understand why everyone bashes them. Use one with asio4all in Sonar and it works perfectly and can go down to 64 buffers without a problem, glitch or hiccup.

This isn't perfect as I just did it real quick as a goof while beta testing a bunch of stuff. Worked on the mix for about an hour....but here is Sonar, a Realtek, a Mackie 32x8 and me being me doing a cover of Daughtry's "Over You".
 
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/4909348/OverYou2Master16.mp3

It's ok if no one likes it...that's not the point. The point is, I've heard WAY worse from people that are better engineers than me using far better gear. This sounds pretty acceptable to me for what it is and I dig how it turned out...even with a Realtek. *shrugs*

Would it have come out different using my other cards? I'm sure. Would it be better? I would say no...just "different". It's only going to record what you send into it.

-Danny

You're correct, of course.  RealTek is fine for a lot of uses.  Having spent money for a decent sound card, though, there's not much point in using the RealTek.  So, there they sit--unused.  


This may be comparing apples to oranges, but here goes.  I had a little situation that illustrates the difference from a few years ago.  I used to play Call Of Duty.  When I started, I was using the on-board audio.  I kept getting to one spot where I'd get killed.  I found a good deal on my first E-mu card and installed it.  A little while after I installed it, I played COD again and was able to finish the game because I could then hear footsteps of the enemy sneaking up on me.  A small, unexpected benefit from the upgrade.  Because of that, I'd rather not use RealTek for critical listening.  

Beagle


but ASIO4ALL is a very aggressive program and will override (in some cases) any native ASIO drivers for other soundcards, so I won't have it on my DAW.  I've often seen where ASIO4ALL will be used before any other ASIO drivers are used regardless of how you have it set up in sonar the last time you used it.

having said that, I do still have my onboard soundcard (soundmax, not realtek:  pedantic) available to be used if needed and it is sent to my mixer and I can choose to use it whenever I wish and DO use it for checking my mixes.

but I don't use ASIO drivers with it - I only use it with WMP or other program, that way I don't have to change my settings in sonar.

I use ASIO4ALL just to aggregate my Windows Drivers with the native ASIO driver of my interface, which allows me to record any Windows playback via an ASIO input in real-time.

As long as you disable ALL the ASIO4ALL drivers in Sonar's Audio/Drivers tab (uncheck them) then it doesn't interfere with Sonar at all although the A4A task bar will show up breifly at launch..

ASIO4ALL rocks and doesn't interfere with native drivers at all and uninstalls totally clean when you want to remove it.

yes, but that's my point - they are a problem if you don't disable them first.

I do use ASIO4ALL on an older machine with a soundblaster soundcard in it for other purposes.  just not on my main DAW.

yes, but that's my point - they are a problem if you don't disable them first.

Yes but you only need to do it once.

Then you can duplex with any other app while Sonar is running, say if you wanted to record the audio output of a stand-alone soft-synth for example.

I've had my DAW setup that way for years, anything my computer can playback can be recorded at the same time as a result, without needing to use another interface and all the different clock timing issues inherent with attempting that.

ASIO has a limit of one driver at a time, A4ALL gets round that by aggregating the Windows driver into another virtual ASIO driver so you can run something else at the same time.  You don't ever need it turned on in Sonar for that so you disable it there and forget about it.  It's just available for anything else you care to use.

Jonbouy

yes, but that's my point - they are a problem if you don't disable them first.

Yes but you only need to do it once.

Then you can duplex with any other app while Sonar is running, say if you wanted to record the audio output of a stand-alone soft-synth for example.

true.
 

ASIO has a limit of one driver at a time, A4ALL gets round that by aggregating the Windows driver into another virtual ASIO driver so you can run something else at the same time.  You don't ever need it turned on in Sonar for that so you disable it there and forget about it.  It's just available for anything else you care to use.

 
not quite true.  you can have multiple ASIO drivers, you can't have multiple hardware (according to the ASIO spec).  and it's not ASIO spec itself that lends itself to having problems with using multiple ASIO drivers, it's ASIO4ALL that has a problem with it.  that's my point as well.  ASIO4ALL is aggressive and does not play well with other native ASIO drivers, even tho that's NOT a requirement of the spec.

Beagle

Jonbouy

yes, but that's my point - they are a problem if you don't disable them first.

Yes but you only need to do it once.

Then you can duplex with any other app while Sonar is running, say if you wanted to record the audio output of a stand-alone soft-synth for example.

true.
 

ASIO has a limit of one driver at a time, A4ALL gets round that by aggregating the Windows driver into another virtual ASIO driver so you can run something else at the same time.  You don't ever need it turned on in Sonar for that so you disable it there and forget about it.  It's just available for anything else you care to use.

 
not quite true.  you can have multiple ASIO drivers, you can't have multiple hardware (according to the ASIO spec).  and it's not ASIO spec itself that lends itself to having problems with using multiple ASIO drivers, it's ASIO4ALL that has a problem with it.  that's my point as well.  ASIO4ALL is aggressive and does not play well with other native ASIO drivers, even tho that's NOT a requirement of the spec.

I think you may be referring to trying to get two interfaces working together, all I'm talking about is aggregating the Windows driver of my interface to use alongside the native ASIO one.

It works perfectly.

'Agressive' seems a strange term to use for something that doesn't interfere with your setup at all.  It does exactly what I ask of it and nothing more.  When I want to remove it goes away completely.  I'm having a hard time with the term agressive here.

The reason I use the term "aggressive' is because of the way it behaves when there are also native ASIO drivers on the system.  it will assert itself as the primary driver in most cases regardless of how you set the system up as long as you have not disabled it. 

What I mean by that is that if both ASIO4ALL and a soundcard's native ASIO drivers are both enabled in sonar, but you have the native ASIO drivers being used and "at the top" - then close the system, ASIO4ALL will now be your output the next time you open sonar.

I can't say this happens on ALL systems.  but I have experienced it myself and I have talked to a lot of folks in the SHS and MC forums which have experienced this as well.

I suspect (but have not tested) that it might behave that way in the windows environment as well.  have you see any behavior like that in your windows setup? 
 
NOTE:  ASIO4ALL does not use the ASIO drivers of the soundcard with native ASIO drivers.  ASIO4ALL is a WDM wrapper.  so if you're using ASIO4ALL to run your soundcard which has native ASIO drivers, you're not using that soundcard in ASIO driver mode, you're using it in WDM driver mode but fooling the host into thinking you're using ASIO drivers.