The threads only on page 2, I don't see why it can be claimed to have degenerated, just for a couple of comments. Just continue discussing the OP's point. If it has legs it'll continue

Scoot

Rain

I've already stated I'm reverring to people I know. Brighton in England probably has more Macs per population that the rest of the UK. I'm not relying on the interent, I'm stating my experience
 
My issue with iTunes is it's got worse, iTunes store has lost fuctionality. Trying to get through to their customer services is a ball ache. Its not the blissful experince Mac users tell you to your face, but more the experience they tell each other
 
 

Well, if relating other's experience can be added to one's personal experience, we'll never get out of this.


Someone posted a similar thread in the Sonar forum about a friend of his who apparently had to re-build sessions from scratch. However, my own experience (screenshots to prove it) is that Logic saves back ups if it quits unexpectedly (as can happen w/ certain 3rd party plug-ins). 


I've also heard many pro engineers gloat about how Pro Tools is "superior" to anything else for audio editing. 99% of the cases, they just didn't know how to accomplish the equivalent using other software. These guys are fairly competent in their own domain - which only makes things worst because it makes it look like they know what they are talking about.

  As for what Mac users supposedly tell each others - how would you know that? Of course you can read forums dedicated to Mac only software, but that's only a portion of the users. And furthermore, why would it be such a concern?

 I don't know, man. Whether it's Mac users pretending that Mac are crash-proof (which they obviously aren't) or PC users trying to dispel the myth w/ virtually no first-hand experience, both sides are as biased and unreliable.

If anything, fanbois are less annoying, since they don't carry that unexplainable negative grudge.

Rain



As for what Mac users supposedly tell each others - how would you know that? Of course you can read forums dedicated to Mac only software, but that's only a portion of the users. And furthermore, why would it be such a concern?

How do I know that??
Do I have to keep repeating, I know pleanty of mac users! Prertty easyy to walk into these conversations when you pop to the kitchen for a cup of tea, and they are all chatting about an issue. Yet when you have an issue with your pc and are chatting to make users, they bleat on about switching to macs because they never have problems. No "suppsosidly" about it.
 
I've been told by mac users you don't need an IT department if you just have a mac based office, yet my friend Kree headed an IT department for a mac based office of Graphic desingers and publishers.
 
Just for the record, I have said at no point I hate macs, or that I think PCs are great
 
 
Regards having to re-build logic projects, my old flatmate did that on his Mac too. He used both Macs and PCs and had nightmares with both, his PC was a Carillon, but it was from around 2002.
  
  
 

I think Apple have aims for monopoly that make anything that MS have done look like they are a freindly local community store in comparison.

Or is Apple just better at planning?


Apple has mastered vertical integration to the point of monopoly. It seeks, and largely succeeds in having control not only all of the hardware, but the software (albeit via licensing in some cases) and media that makes the hardware run. Microsoft has essentially benefited by a natural monopoly in being the first widely adopted OS in the PC market, and thus the de facto standard to which the vast majority of hardware and software vendors must conform.


Metro, and the Surface tablets are yet another attempt by Microsoft to replicate the vertical monopoly that Apple has perfected. The model that MS is envying most is not the iPod vs the Zune contest, but the Ap Store and iTunes. That is how they plan to market Metro apps. The future is all Apple, just the names will change.

I can't see Cakewalk making much money from entering the Mac areana, with the cost involved doing so, thet'd be competing directly with Logic, and to a degree Protools. When asking the advice of other Mac users, buyers we be advised to go with Logic as a Apple programme. So to make a dent in that market, they would need to blow Logic out of the water. Knowing Apple, they would repsond to the threat. and start serious investment in securing their foothold

Scoot

Rain



As for what Mac users supposedly tell each others - how would you know that? Of course you can read forums dedicated to Mac only software, but that's only a portion of the users. And furthermore, why would it be such a concern?

How do I know that??
Do I have to keep repeating, I know pleanty of mac users! Prertty easyy to walk into these conversations when you pop to the kitchen for a cup of tea, and they are all chatting about an issue. Yet when you have an issue with your pc and are chatting to make users, they bleat on about switching to macs because they never have problems. No "suppsosidly" about it.
 
I've been told by mac users you don't need an IT department if you just have a mac based office, yet my friend Kree headed an IT department for a mac based office of Graphic desingers and publishers.
 
Just for the record, I have said at no point I hate macs, or that I think PCs are great
 
 
Regards having to re-build logic projects, my old flatmate did that on his Mac too. He used both Macs and PCs and had nightmares with both, his PC was a Carillon, but it was from around 2002.
  
  
 

I guess we have different evaluation grids. My friends and relatives experiences are their own, I take them all w/ a pinch of salt. My wife is the closest person to me - but she is Mac biased (even if she's quite a computer geek in her own way.) Those people experiences are valid, but they're theirs. I don't think I would enter a debate and try to make a point w/o my own experience. I make mistakes, friend make mistakes, and our knowledge has its limits and its flaws.


What we are told - be it by Mac fanbois or PC addicts is just that. Their opinion. People will make their computer what they want them to be. 

Next time your friend has an issue, tell him NOT to discard the pop up which offers to re-load the version that Logic automatically saves when it quits unexpectedly. ;)  It's easy to identify - see below. I can't say I've had many crashes, but Logic never failed to generate one of these.

Scoot


I can't see Cakewalk making much money from entering the Mac areana, with the cost involved doing so, thet'd be competing directly with Logic, and to a degree Protools. When asking the advice of other Mac users, buyers we be advised to go with Logic as a Apple programme. So to make a dent in that market, they would need to blow Logic out of the water. Knowing Apple, they would repsond to the threat. and start serious investment in securing their foothold

Absolutely agreed. Though I'd love to see a Mac version of Sonar, that's just for my own selfish self. 

slartabartfast

I think Apple have aims for monopoly that make anything that MS have done look like they are a freindly local community store in comparison.

Or is Apple just better at planning?


Apple has mastered vertical integration to the point of monopoly. It seeks, and largely succeeds in having control not only all of the hardware, but the software (albeit via licensing in some cases) and media that makes the hardware run. Microsoft has essentially benefited by a natural monopoly in being the first widely adopted OS in the PC market, and thus the de facto standard to which the vast majority of hardware and software vendors must conform.


Metro, and the Surface tablets are yet another attempt by Microsoft to replicate the vertical monopoly that Apple has perfected. The model that MS is envying most is not the iPod vs the Zune contest, but the Ap Store and iTunes. That is how they plan to market Metro apps. The future is all Apple, just the names will change.

Thank you.

Vertical monopoly is a good way of putting it.  Milking machine is another.  You get to enjoy the grass on the proviso you keep donating regularly.  Folks are accountable just as much as the corporations in fact moreso because they stick their hands up to volunteer.  Apple didn't engineer (or did they?) the uncontrolled file sharing (piracy) that led toward iTunes providing a sanitized, legal, pay us instead version, that played right into Apples hands. It doesn't promote free-enterprise within the boundaries of nations, it kills a large part of it stone dead.  Like I said MS are struggling to keep up now and look almost quaint in their attempts to join in what's already happened.

Vertical monopoly and yet a vast herd is OK with that to the point of wanting to shut anyone up that isn't?

btw did anyone say if Logic was available outside the app. store yet?  It's quite a big thing that relates to the OP if the original vendor is having to pay the host commission just to appear on their format.

Jonbouy


btw did anyone say if Logic was available outside the app. store yet?  It's quite a big thing that relates to the OP if the original vendor is having to pay the host commission just to appear on their format.

There are copies left in the music stores I guess. I sometimes see it online over at Amazon and such. But I don't think it'll be the case for the next version.

Rain

Jonbouy


btw did anyone say if Logic was available outside the app. store yet?  It's quite a big thing that relates to the OP if the original vendor is having to pay the host commission just to appear on their format.

There are copies left in the music stores I guess. I sometimes see it online over at Amazon and such. But I don't think it'll be the case for the next version.

Thanks, I'll take that as a 'no' then.

Music stores used to take it I imagine because it contributed a line to their sales potential, now that business is Apples exclusively.  That's what I'm talking about.