John T
I would guess that the insertion of a mono effect is also changing the bus interleave, though I've not checked that.

My guess is that the FX override the Interleave...I was changing those with no results while the Mono FX (SSL Comp) was in there. I can change the interleave but it has no effect.

Man I tell you, there is nothing like having a technical issue when you are trying to be creative. If I want stereo effect OR Pan-ability, use stereo effects. 
 

Elvenking71

John T
Once the signal passes through a mono processor on a bus, there's no stereo position information. Remember that it's the source track that is panned; the bus itself knows nothing about that position.

Stereo information or not, why would a pan not work on the output of the bus no matter what effect I had in the bin? There seem to be different rules around panning when it comes to buses and tracks. Never had a track I couldn't pan. Buses seem to be more particular. 

Well, as the incoming signals work their way through the effects in the bus, they hit the mono effect.
 
Now, those incoming signals could be panned differently. You could have one thing on the left, one thing on the right, something down the middle, whatever.
 
Once those signals hit a mono effect, they can't be positioned differently. The effect doesn't handle that. All it has is one mono output.

John T

Elvenking71

John T
Once the signal passes through a mono processor on a bus, there's no stereo position information. Remember that it's the source track that is panned; the bus itself knows nothing about that position.

Stereo information or not, why would a pan not work on the output of the bus no matter what effect I had in the bin? There seem to be different rules around panning when it comes to buses and tracks. Never had a track I couldn't pan. Buses seem to be more particular. 

Well, as the incoming signals work their way through the effects in the bus, they hit the mono effect.
 
Now, those incoming signals could be panned differently. You could have one thing on the left, one thing on the right, something down the middle, whatever.
 
Once those signals hit a mono effect, they can't be positioned differently. The effect doesn't handle that. All it has is one mono output.

Thank you for taking the time to explain!!  :)
 
 
My question is how does the mono output of the effect get routed into a stereo bus and then not have an ability to pan. Does it actually change the nature of the bus. My initial thought is ...well why doesn't it just pan it like it happens in a mono track. Why does the stereo track think there is no way to pan by simply lowering the channel its panning away from. Is the bus now made a "mono bus' technically by the nature of the FX in the bin?...(even though i thought there were no mono buses in Sonar)

The pan control in a stereo track or bus doesn't work in the same way as on a mono track.
 
On a mono track, the pan control dictates what its position in the stereo field of its destination bus is.
 
On any type of stereo track or bus, the pan control works more like the "balance" control on a hi fi. Moving to the left turns down the right channel, moving right turns down the left channel.

John T
The pan control in a stereo track or bus doesn't work in the same way as on a mono track.
 
On a mono track, the pan control dictates what its position in the stereo field of its destination bus is.
 
On any type of stereo track or bus, the pan control works more like the "balance" control on a hi fi. Moving to the left turns down the right channel, moving right turns down the left channel.

The only thing confusing I have with what you say is this. We are always auditioning the signals through left and right channels. Where does that concept go on the Mono bus. Are we really just dealing with a single output there...or a mono signal that is divided between two channels rendering the pan uneeded? See what i mean...there is always a concept of L and R...I never just have one speaker in front of me.  
 
I guess I am a fan of never losing the concept of stereo no matter what since we always listen to L and R
 

Elvenking71

John T
The pan control in a stereo track or bus doesn't work in the same way as on a mono track.
 
On a mono track, the pan control dictates what its position in the stereo field of its destination bus is.
 
On any type of stereo track or bus, the pan control works more like the "balance" control on a hi fi. Moving to the left turns down the right channel, moving right turns down the left channel.

 
I guess I am a fan of never losing the concept of stereo no matter what since we always listen to L and R
 

we all are man :-)
but routing / going from stereo to mon, exc can only do so much.
this is not just Sonar either, the same thing happens to me using an analog desk as well.
that's just the way a signal path works

No, it's still a stereo bus, but after the mono effect, it contains no stereo information. Everything up to that point is now summed to mono by that effect.
 
 

John T
No, it's still a stereo bus, but after the mono effect, it contains no stereo information. Everything up to that point is now summed to mono by that effect.
 
 

Okay....well-explained and thank you again. I get it I get it. It's an emulation of real outboard stuff. THAT makes sense and I can accept. (As if I had a choice...ha!) Like I said.....wisdom is the prize here. Thanks again all who contributed!!

I had to delete the Bus in the project I was working in, I couldn't ever get it to pan again. Only if I created a new Bus. How does a bus become corrupt is the question. I was moving pans all the way up the signal path with NOTHING WAS PANNING. Gahhhdd...so frustrating!! JUST WANT TO FRIGGIN PAN!!!!!!!!!!! LET ME PAN...put a button in that says override BS and PAN!!!! PAN!!!!! With no FX in the chain...how the hell do I not get a pan??? 
 
LOL...I put the Mono Compressor back in on the bus...I could pan it then...so everything I thought I learned...doesn't apply.. Does anyone have any valid information on Sends that describes how this is supposed to work? Stereo FX...mono FX all pan on a new bus.  Can something happen to my old bus...is it buggy?
 
The incredible lack of consistency in how this operates is enough to make you doubt your signal path. I think there are bugs in the sends for sure!