jb101

Beepster
 
There have been a few other seemingly frivolous actions/liberties Cake has taken recently that have also raised my eyebrows as to the direction things are going. 
 

 
Hey, Beeps.
 
I am just interested to find out what "actions/liberties" you have come across.
 
Hope all is well in Beeps-land.
 
J

Hi, JB. Been having a bit of a rough go lately but we truck on through. Hope you've been good too (and healing up nicely).
 
I don't really want to derail/go off topic here (it's heated enough already) but I've generally been commenting on these things as they come up. I might even be coming of as a bit of a crank but things are definitely changing and I don't think it's actually Cakewalk themselves behind some of these actions.
 
It seems some folks have been taking some of my posts out of context to bash Cake and the forum too which of course is the exact opposite of any intent behing my more critical observations. I just want the program to continue to grow in a positive way... which it mostly has been. Just a couple odd little things that seem out of place. I think outside forces are influencing some of these things.
 
Yeah... I'd better not elaborate here. Sorry.
 
Take care, bud.

irvin
Do I need to post the link again? 

No, but in fact that thread provides an interesting discussion not unlike this one, with Stephen Slate taking the role Craig is taking here, essentially saying no, this is not something I would use to master tracks for a client, but yes, it's interesting and has many potentially valuable uses, if you have the creativity to envision them and not just dismiss it out of hand without checking it out a bit. And yes, there are of course others hopping up and down with righteous anger about it. So it goes. 
 
The LANDR developer does in fact acknowledge in that thread that Reaper was used in the beta-phase demo in question, but refers to it as their 'test platform' which was in use because everything went pear-shaped that day and the main server with whatever custom analysis and processing they use was down and inaccessible. I have no way of knowing whether that's true, or a 'lame excuse', or if any such processing exists, but the developer does not, in the course of that thread, admit that LANDR is nothing but Reaper and a few plugins. He rather maintains that their full system is now stable and running and 'learning'. Whatever that means. 
 
In any case, I will withhold further comment until after I've had a chance to try the service out myself - which I will do - and compare it to my own usual bus-processing chain. My gut instinct is that I'd be unlikely to pay for it very often, but if I had a track that was worth something to me, and it sounded better with whatever they use than my usual chain, I don't really see the downside - especially if it doesn't cost anything to give it a whirl.

AllanH

coolbass

Paul P

coolbass
It should be an option to exclude it from the sonar experience.

It is.

Well I now did uninstall it, but I was not given the option not to install it while updating.

LANDR does not fully uninstall. 

This is correct, searching "LANDR" in the registry will reveal them (one for the audio export dialog, one for the shared utility menu, which in turn points to a Landr***.exe" file left in the Shared Utilities folder). I forget the exact name, but it begins with Landr.
 
This particular update could not have happened at a more inopportune time for CW. Those who did not early adopt SONAR and/or renew under the "pressure" of the pulled-in 2/28 renewal deadline are rapidly approaching renewal still; and now sit looking at this - as potentially their last update in their membership.
 
To add insult to injury is the ardent "ram it down your throat" mentality adopted by the people who made/implemented this decision. Not even the slightest hint of "Oh, we didn't think of that, sorry, we'll fix it." I truly hope I am not the only one offended by this.

Beepster
This is no diss to Craig, LANDR or any of the people who like this new thingie. It is just my opinion on how this has been foisted upon us and some general blatherings about other, semi related things that would be extremely useful to my little setup.

 
I don't take it as such. How something is installed and distributed is a separate issue from whether the service offers anything of value. I have commented only on the latter. As to the former, a separate install would have avoided many of the negative posts. 
 
But as to dissing me, to intrepret "I wouldn't use LANDR to master my own music" as proof that LANDR is crap is absurd. What it proves is I know how to master, so I master things. I used to change the oil in my car rather than go to a service center. That doesn't prove service centers are crap. It proves I know how to change my oil. Why on earth would I pay someone to do something I know how to do, and at least according to my clients, is something I do very well?

Anderton

Beepster
This is no diss to Craig, LANDR or any of the people who like this new thingie. It is just my opinion on how this has been foisted upon us and some general blatherings about other, semi related things that would be extremely useful to my little setup.

 
I don't take it as such. How something is installed and distributed is a separate issue from whether the service offers anything of value. I have commented only on the latter. As to the former, a separate install would have avoided many of the negative posts. 
 
But as to dissing me, to intrepret "I wouldn't use LANDR to master my own music" as proof that LANDR is crap is absurd. What it proves is I know how to master, so I master things. I used to change the oil in my car rather than go to a service center. That doesn't prove service centers are crap. It proves I know how to change my oil. Why on earth would I pay someone to do something I know how to do, and at least according to my clients, is something I do very well?

Yes, that exchange was rather over the top. All due respect to that user and his opinions (and they posted some interesting data points) but veering off into hyperbole and attacks.... well that just clouds (I swear that wasn't a pun... puns are evil, lol) the issue.
 
I understood exactly what you were saying. If it's of use to someone (and who knows... maybe I'll fall in love with it) then great.
 
I'm glad you are acknowledging what I and others are saying though about the weird way their uploader is being jammed in there.
 
That's my only beef.
 
The other stuff about some nice chains and examples using Sonar kit would be brilliant though. If you can ever find the time or Cake can commission some pros to conjure up their own little setups.
 
Cheers!

I think of all the valuable time I have wasted here on this forum listening to the Nay Sayers and Prophets of Digital Doom ... 
 
IMO, basing an online argument on an old thread from a G S forum post dated from August 2014 seems to be grasping for straws ...Yes ? No ?
 
Even S Slate had nice things to say about LANDR a year and a half ago ...Yet that was conveniently omitted  .
 
 
LANDR ? I will find out for myself .....
 
 
Kenny

I'm doing my best to be objective about LANDR. I agree with the view that LANDR should be an option if it must be offered ,meaning I should have the option to have a ZERO footprint left on my computer if I don't want it.
 
I can only speak for myself. I am paying for Sonar and improvements in that program..or I thought I was. I don't think we can really get away from the idea of it being a kind of bloatware which by definition is a limited version of a program offering limited features that you must pay extra to get...so yeah...it's bloatware no matter how you sell it. This reminds me of all the double speak when Sonar became a subscription. People said it wasn't a subscription, but yeah....it's a form of a subscription. I think some are working way too hard to try and make others think things are different than they really are.
 
It all boils down to how you feel personally about having these 3rd party "additions" to the core program. I like demos I can later remove. I don't like the present model of acquiring 3rd party programs unless they happen to be a part of Sonar, like the Nomad plug-ins. 
 
The same tools you use to mix, you can use to master, so we already have mastering tools in Sonar.This just needs further development. More than anything what I don't like isn't necessarily LANDR, it's the trend, the direction Cakewalk is headed in with these 3rd party things...pretty soon I'll be looking at a billboard instead of my tools menu. I don't want another useless icon on my desktop that takes up HD space.
 
Cakewalk has been big on the use of training videos, so why not make a few on Mastering inside of Sonar?  From what I gather LANDR is mastering for dummies. I would like to optimistically think that most Sonar users are interested to learn how to do basic mastering. Those people who have no inclination or interest whatsoever in mastering probably don't have a real interest in mixing either, and if they are totally clueless they probably aren't looking to buy Sonar, instead they're hiring a mixing/mastering engineer.
 
Cakewalk needs to do what helps Cakewalk and this was probably a deal that helps Cakewalk. Some of the competition is doing the same thing. If those other guys do it, I don't think it's a good idea for them either. LANR must have a heck of a good marketing dept.
 
I agree that the Bakers shouldn't feel pressured to have a shiny new toy every month...just iron out the bugs here and there and gradually improve the program. That's a real value for me.
 
Even if I wanted/needed a mastering engineer I would prefer to opt for a real set of ears over some algorithm. I keep hearing statements similar to, " LANDR got close to my master", "LANDR didn't do much of anything to my mastered material". IOW LANDR is doing something similar in most cases to what was already done.And for demo...who want to master with an Mp3? Not me.
 
In the time it takes to use LANDR you could set up a  mastering chain and be off to the races. 
 
 
 

charlyg
there is no "software", it's a file "conversion" and  link, kinda like soundcloud. At least that is how I understand it. I could be wrong.

The posts in this thread makes it pretty clear this "addition" adds about 18% or so to the installer file size.  It is way more than just a drop down and a link to the internet.  

I would have preferred LANDR as separate install. In the future if Cakewalk bundles an installer like the did this time with LANDR please provide clear instructions on how to avoid installing it or at least a process to remove the product which is more complete than the Windows uninstall process.

tenfoot
 

Snehankur
Isn't there anything in SPALT-N other that LANDR?

Depends.  Do you know how to insert a track? :) 

Only TWO ways so far : from Menu and Right Click. Should I need to know more?