• SONAR
  • When will SONAR Platinum at least have a simple pitch[varispeed] control?
2016/02/15 01:27:33
bobguitkillerleft
Hi,
I love most of what Platinum,has been capable of,and have only experienced minor weirdness[white"not responding"outs] rarely,but to the Topic: even VLC has pitch/speed control,I also have another slightly interesting $40 thing Riff Station,that allows 2 track stereo files of varying type to slow down a slightly amazing 10 times slower than standard[quality obviously suffers the slower it gets] that is specifically made to work out song parts or fast guitar solos,and I've just read from this Jack Endino article:http://www.endino.com/archive/tuningnightmares.html that PT even had it at version 5!!! Can this be real?
 
Anyway,as he explains in the article the "Studer" 24 track tape machines were able to "speed up",or "slow down" by even a few "cents",which when it comes to tuning to already laid multiple rhythm tracks,sounds very handy.
 
Perhaps I'm missing something?, as I remember Craig Anderton describing"some sort of work around",but more to the point,it could/would be Extremely Useful,Especially if there was JUST a "Single Dial"[with Qwerty Number entry also-obviously]or less preferably"a Slider"-saying "Pitch/Speed of Project control",anyway if it is true that PT has had it since way back when?,and most FREE media players have this ability,then why does Platinum in the very least,Not have this capability?,or instead from memory,just an extremely convoluted work around.
 
I use R.station to find the "tempo" of .wav files as it's sometimes far quicker than creating a new project [,and sometimes more accurate] than eventually getting to "audiosnap",and finding the files tempo prior to importing.
Best Regards to All from Bob S.
 
2016/02/15 05:12:11
bobguitkillerleft
Hmmm over 3hrs,and not even a Bleep? Surely someone at least finds Jack Endino's article about tuning interesting?,even if you don't care[pretty much guaranteed today] that I'm clueless when it comes to project pitch/speed?
2016/02/15 05:44:15
tenfoot
Hey Bob.  Sorry you seem to be left hanging there mate! Folks are usually pretty quick to chime in around here.  This is far from my area of expertise (if in fact I have any) but I certainly don't  know of any 'one knob'  way to achieve what you want here. I guess the best thing would be to throw up a feature request and see who bites. 
 
Cheers:) 
2016/02/15 06:46:01
1andyf88
Perhaps this would help:

http://www.soundonsound.c...es/sonar-tech-0614.htm

Also, ARA integration with Sonar currently doesn't support Melodyne's universal time editing features, but that is on the board for an upcoming update, according to the forum. It should work as a vst plug in.
2016/02/15 08:39:24
jpetersen
Speaking as a programmer, a truly simple varispeed button in a multifaceted DAW environment is not easy to do.
 Craig's suggestion got me to where I wanted to go, with minimum loss of quality.
 
This may be a niche market for an enterprising VST developer for a semi-standalone varispeed with playback and simultaneous record, like tape multitracks of old.
2016/02/15 09:06:52
Paul P
bobguitkillerleft
Hmmm over 3hrs,and not even a Bleep?



A lot of us were asleep .  And many will be sleeping in this morning [evening] since it's a holiday in the US.
Expect a quiet moment for a few hours more.
 
It would probably be more useful to play with pitch and speed at the clip/track level rather than the entire project. 
Maybe something like Image Line's Edison ?
 
2016/02/15 10:08:02
fireberd
My Goldwave (audio editor) has pitch function.  If I have a track I need to change, I export it as a wav file to Goldwave, do what I need to do and then import it back into Sonar (new track). 
 
I also have a Karaoke program that will change keys.
2016/02/15 10:10:26
Anderton
The issue with varispeed is way more complicated than with something like VLC or Riffstation as it deals with multiple tracks, audio and MIDI, automation, and sync to tempo. The other issue is that if you want to change tempo and maintain duration, you cannot avoid artifacts, which degrades fidelity. You may not hear this with small changes, but I've found that even using high-quality stretching algorithms can't help but modify a file's fidelity. This is not an issue if (like tape varispeed) you're willing to allow tempo changes to change duration (the basis of what I suggested, which isn't really a workaround as much as a way to emulate true tape varispeed, like an old ATR-102).
 
In the days of tape you couldn't always count on a multitrack to have variable speed, but the two-track deck to which you mixed down often did. So it was common to live with the recorded tempo on the multitrack, and apply a speed change to the final two-track mix. That is what I do with SONAR, as it accomplishes speed changes without artifacts.
 
That said, although you won't have a continuously variable knob, you can change the tempo of an entire project as described in my Friday's Tip of the Week for week 33.
 
Finally, this is why in my "Recording on the Fast Track" seminars I recommend starting the songwriting process with MIDI-based instruments so you can change tempo and key easily until you nail what's needed.
2016/02/15 10:11:51
jpetersen
@fireberd: Does it have a continuous control like a multitrack tape recorder or do you have to keep trying different values until it's what you want?
2016/02/15 10:50:27
bobguitkillerleft
Anderton
The issue with varispeed is way more complicated than with something like VLC or Riffstation as it deals with multiple tracks, audio and MIDI, automation, and sync to tempo. The other issue is that if you want to change tempo and maintain duration, you cannot avoid artifacts, which degrades fidelity. You may not hear this with small changes, but I've found that even using high-quality stretching algorithms can't help but modify a file's fidelity. This is not an issue if (like tape varispeed) you're willing to allow tempo changes to change duration (the basis of what I suggested, which isn't really a workaround as much as a way to emulate true tape varispeed, like an old ATR-102).
 
In the days of tape you couldn't always count on a multitrack to have variable speed, but the two-track deck to which you mixed down often did. So it was common to live with the recorded tempo on the multitrack, and apply a speed change to the final two-track mix. That is what I do with SONAR, as it accomplishes speed changes without artifacts.
 
That said, although you won't have a continuously variable knob, you can change the tempo of an entire project as described in my Friday's Tip of the Week for week 33.
 
Finally, this is why in my "Recording on the Fast Track" seminars I recommend starting the songwriting process with MIDI-based instruments so you can change tempo and key easily until you nail what's needed.


I had a VERY good idea that once it involves ALL of what Platinum already does,that it must be a very BIG,and difficult "thing" to implement,but Thank You for steering me back to where I was sure I had indeed glimpsed your solution,also  what about "Jack Endino's Comments" that PT way back to 5[?] could do it?
Any Truth in that?
 
Also I apologize to all for forgetting about the quite massive time difference,sometimes get's me every time.
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