williamcopper
Come on Beepster.   I'll readily agree that I don't write well or clearly.  But help me out ... I think you know what I'm trying to show, why not say it clearly as you believe it might be better understood?

Go back through my step by step posts in a CLEAN/NEW project and report back on the results.
 
It really could not be more clear.

And just because I'm the helpful guy I am do this....
 
http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3328846
 
and if that futzes up do this...
 
http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3328855
 
Okay?

Can't you understand, helpful guy that you are, that BOTH (those links in the last post)  and ALL of your procedures begin with "Freeze"?
 
That is NOT a first step that is THE SIGNIFICANT STEP for what I'm trying to show here. 
 
edit .. Freeze and Sonar's version of render midi through a vst to audio called "Bounce to Tracks" are or should be the same thing.  BUT FAST/SLOW, 64 bit or not, Freeze or Bounce, those are giving different results -- they are NOT the same.   Other than loading and unloading a ton of pig feed by hand, this is all I've done today.      grrr

williamcopper
And I'd scour this forum for posts like this one.

 
Unfortunately no one from Cakewalk could benefit from the information you provided in this thread. There is virtually no information on which anyone can act - no data on how to reproduce, no indication of the exact nature of the project, whether you used multiple single instances of Kontakt or multiple instruments within a single instance of Kontakt, whether there was scripting involved in the Kontakt programs, etc. etc.
 
It's all well and good to follow false trails...but it's probably better not to ask people to follow you on your false trails until you can present at least somewhat more substantive information than a couple sentences and screen shot from another program, which you apparently don't know very well if don't know how to invert phase - so there's another variable. (FYI you can invert the right and/or left channels in the Object Editor. Or select the object and choose Invert Phase for either or both channels from the Real Time effects.)
 
What you've presented contradicts all the experiences I've had with multiple projects over several years that involved rendering and bouncing. Therefore if I've never encountered the issue and you can't provide a method to reproduce, I don't find your information particularly compelling. Nor do I understand why you brought the files into Samplitude. Once the MIDI has been converted to audio, it's audio and a start time differential would show up in any program, including SONAR. Maybe you exported the audio outside of SONAR...who knows...
 
Those whose motivation is improving the program and who cannot provide steps to reproduce send projects to Cakewalk so that they can be analyzed. Cakewalk has an extensive collection of programs, including Kontakt, with which they do extensive testing because it's a popular instrument among SONAR users.

williamcopper
Can't you understand, helpful guy that you are, that BOTH (those links in the last post)  and ALL of your procedures begin with "Freeze"?
 
That is NOT a first step that is THE SIGNIFICANT STEP for what I'm trying to show here. 

IF YOU DO NOT FREEZE IT THEN THE EXPORTS WILL BE SUBJECT TO THE RANDOMIZATION OF THE SYNTH AND EFFECTS!!!!
 
ANY TESTS DONE LIKE THAT WILL LIKELY NOT NULL DUE TO THE RANDOMIZATION!!!!
 
THAT IS THE FREAKING POINT!!!!
 
You are accusing the Sonar export process(es) of being inconsistent. WHAT I DESCRIBED IS THE ONLY WAY TO TEST IT!!!!
 
If you do not understand why this is then you are most definitely not qualified to claim you are some kind of "expert" that deserves consultation fees.
 
If you DO understand this then you are just wasting people's time intentionally... thus making you a troll.
 
And, if as I presume, the latter is the case don't think you have wasted MY time because if I have saved ANYONE else's time by exposing this then it was time well spent.
 
Do the tests, with the freezes or any point you have is "null"... pun intended.

whew.   the reason I used samplitude is another bug in sonar that I reported six months ago or so:  the pictures of audio in sonar, apparently under the influence of tempo changes, are not at all accurate.    Thanks for the info on phase inverting in samplitude; I did in fact use the help system, though on my installation it comes up in German for some reason, and found it out too. 

BTW William, I don't know of anyone on these forums who has been more critical of SONAR's automation than Beepster. But his criticisms are mixed with a substantial amount of assistance and tips. No one gets on his case for being critical, because that's not all he does.

Beepster


IF YOU DO NOT FREEZE IT THEN THE EXPORTS WILL BE SUBJECT TO THE RANDOMIZATION OF THE SYNTH AND EFFECTS!!!!
 
ANY TESTS DONE LIKE THAT WILL LIKELY NOT NULL DUE TO THE RANDOMIZATION!!!!
 
THAT IS THE FREAKING POINT!!!!
 
You are accusing the Sonar export process(es) of being inconsistent. WHAT I DESCRIBED IS THE ONLY WAY TO TEST IT!!!!
 
If you DO understand this then you are just wasting people's time intentionally... thus making you a troll.

Do the tests, with the freezes or any point you have is "null"... pun intended.

I have to think you don't use midi ever, so it's probably better for you to bow out of this.   As I've said before to you, am not troll ruff ruff ruff. 
 
If Kontakt 'randomizes' a specific sample, no scripting involved because I made the instrument as described far above, then yes that's a Kontakt problem.   But it seems to me that in such a case Kontakt would also randomize the same Bounce to Tracks done the same way, and I've also shown that that is NOT the case.  

williamcopper
the pictures of audio in sonar, apparently under the influence of tempo changes, are not at all accurate. 

Waveform drawing precision has been greatly enhanced in post-Hopkington fixes.

williamcopper
I have to think you don't use midi ever, so it's probably better for you to bow out of this.   As I've said before to you, am not troll ruff ruff ruff. 
 
If Kontakt 'randomizes' a specific sample, no scripting involved because I made the instrument as described far above, then yes that's a Kontakt problem.   But it seems to me that in such a case Kontakt would also randomize the same Bounce to Tracks done the same way, and I've also shown that that is NOT the case.  

Dood... you do not understand what is going on (or are being intentionally obtuse). There is nothing left I can say that will make you understand WHY the export engine needs RAW, CONISTENT audio for these types of tests.
 
So I'll just say this... your entire thread premise is faulty. There is nothing wrong with Sonar export and you have absolutely NOT proven anything to the contrary.