bitflipper


I've misplaced my old help files for GlissEQ. Does anybody know if versions 1 and 2 work the same way as the current version? Is it the Quality button that turns on oversampling, and does it only oversample during Render mode?

Yes. I have version 2.9.1


"Normal/High Quality" 


High Quality uses a two times higher sampling rate. 

does it only oversample during Render mode?

There is an Auto-Quality mode that does turn on oversampling for off line rendering if the host software supports that (per manual). 

bitflipper


Interesting thread. I would not have guessed that oversampling would have a deleterious effect. 

However, because I have more than one frequently-used plugin that performs badly with a fast bounce, I've long been in the habit of using the slow bounce option for both exporting and bouncing. A slow export is still faster than having to re-do a fast export, especially if you don't notice the degradation right away. (Or the worst-case scenario: the client points it out to you after you've burned them a test CD.) 

Most of the time it's a soft synth that's the problem. Omnisphere is the worst offender, and it may be related to memory allocation and/or disk streaming. On my RAM-constrained system Omni will often produce unrecognizable garbage when bounced fast. Kontakt, however, never does this despite being equally resource-intensive.

rainmaker, your post has inspired me to do some tests of my own. It would be great if others would do the same, perhaps resulting in a helpful list of plugins known to not do fast bounces well. Hopefully, someone will compare SONAR to another DAW and see if that makes a difference.

Unfortunately, there are plugins that cannot be tested reliably with a null test. Anything that has random modulation cannot be tested this way. For example, a tape echo emulator will likely produce different results each time it's used. 

Equalizers, however, I would expect to be consistent, even ones with dynamic action such as GlissEQ. I'll test that one with and without oversampling, as well as the previous version of the same plugin. I'll also compare it to other equalizers that support oversampling.

Dave, I'm curious why you would be more inclined to trust EQs to be Consistent; even if they're not Linear phase type?

They're applying fixed rules, unlike, say, a modulator that applies random variations. Running any given set of data through an equalizer should give the same results at the output every time, even in the case of a dynamic equalizer such as GlissEQ. My experiments verified that's the case.

That's not to say they don't modify the data beyond their primary duty as an EQ; they do indeed cause a phase shift. But that's still consistent.

Now I cannot reproduce the case described in my first post... :( while running the latest Voxengo plugins.

Well I think it is good :) There was definitely something wrong going on, but now it is ok - fast bounce or slow bounce.

What a relief to me-

I DO NOT want to have to slow bounce - ouch!!! That would be a huge step backwards from where we are today!

Lance

kind of late on the draw here, but as bitflipper and ba_midi stated, I have only had problems with Omnisphere and certail large Play libraries. Never crossed my mind that slow bounce would be better quality. All I know is fast bounce sounds like my mix--thats enough for me.

Very interesting subject.   Can you show exactly how you did the comparison?    I just tried a fast bounce and a slow bounce on exactly the same material.   This was midi data running to Kontakt5, with a good deal of tempo changing and controllers used.   
 
Imported both the resulting audio files into Samplitude, used <Effects><Stereo/Phase><Invert Phase><Both Channels>  on the fast bounce and exported the combination to a new audio file.    It was not by any means silence ... it was more or less the same sounds at a rather lower volume level, with a little bit of whistling that might have been in the source. 

This is an old thread.

Hey, John.  Strange to see ba_midi again, God bless him.
 
His advice is greatly missed on this forum.