I recently did a raw sum comparison with Sonar 5 and Pt 6.9.
15 tracks all at unity gain and the results were much in the favour of Sonar5 with 64 bit selected.

I recently did a raw sum comparison with Sonar 5 and Pt 6.9.
15 tracks all at unity gain and the results were much in the favour of Sonar5 with 64 bit selected.

Hello,
I'm just currious,
how can a "raw sum comparison" favor one DAW over another.

I'm assuming that means you did you an A/B of the final mixdowns?
Would you mind providing more details about your method?

Thanks,
Tom.

ORIGINAL: Jonny Mumra

I recently did a raw sum comparison with Sonar 5 and Pt 6.9.
15 tracks all at unity gain and the results were much in the favour of Sonar5 with 64 bit selected.

in all fairness, summing 15 tracks at unity gain is the equivalent of driving a bus
at 80 miles an hour into a concrete embankment and seeing who survives. this is not
a realistic scenario which any trained audio engineer would even consider. while the double
precision pipeline of Sonar can handle this particular scenario .. it's preposterous
(imho).

jeff

Is that right.

Well the results were significant enough for me to comment.

There was actually quite a big difference.

I cant wait to hear the responses from all the computer scientists listening through Alesis Mk2's.

Placebo = no way.

Can i post results = to a select few.

As a user of both ProTools and Sonar, I'm really sick of this topic :)

Robustness, interface options for video and hardware support are definetely Protools Strengths

However anyone suggesting that paying $10,000 for processing power that amounts to last years celeron chip
and software that in features and functionality is not only inferior to Sonar but Logic Nuendo and Cubase must put a very high priority
on the above mentioned strengths.

How many big label pop records over the past 20 years were mixed on SSL Consoles, So what? I betcha there is more than a few studio owners that wish they had that Neve A series console back that they traded in for tan E or G series SSL.


Unless your opening a for hire studio where compatibilty becomes a major issue, this whole topic is pretty inane.

They are both good. Make hits, make good music. Either DAW will do fine. I like the price of sonar and I like the way it works. Guys, im working on a record with a known artist on Sonar, and big thing are happening for us. His last album was done in Sonar and I got to travel all over Europe because of it through Warner Bros... Both of the programs are at the point where its all about if ya got the skillz or not to make hits, and the connections in the biz to reap the benefits. Dont wanna make hits, just goo dmusic? Well, same goes for that, both DAWS are fine!!! If i had pro tools to start I probably would have stuck with it because I honestly dont have time to play with programs as Im busy making hits :)... Sonar has a good price tag on it, and I was greatful to know it has the juice to make hits, and I really am not sacrificing by not having pro tools. Sound quality? You can get the sound out of sonar that you can from pro tools no problem, period...

I've only once been asked if I have protools at the studio and that was from someone who wanted me to edit some midi files.

heh.

That's the kinda thing we're dealing with here ;)

Kind regards

Dave Rich

Alot of PT's dominance comes from the fact that it is used in Post Production.

ProTools is not very popular with composers, but it is the (current) tool of choice with recording engineers and post production houses....why? Well for a number of the reasons mentioned above...
- reliability (due to intergrated hardware and software), 24 hour support
- I hate to say it....but easy of use...two screens...that is all edit and mix....just like a tape machine.
- Accredited training courses (also helps with the marketing!)
- the tie in with parent company AVID who have a large part of the video market sown up. For example the whole of ITV News (those who have gone digital) are running AVID's newscutter system, why...reliabity, easy of use and training
- Compatability with other post houses

What is Sonar missing for Post work...well so much basically, such as
- Locking clips/tracks (that is the most basic of all) - CW promised for an up coming version
- A real transport with fast forward and rewind (not by bars!) - CW promised for an up coming version
- instant and unlimited fades and X-fades,
- Real-time Editing, the ability to edit whilst still recording on the same track
- Source/Destination Editing
-EDL import/export
- plus much more

I would say that most Sonar users are either composers or project to medium scale studios, also I see Sonar users as very loyal to their software.

If you look at what the top league composers are using, for example film composers, you will see a strong mix of Logic and Digital Performer, with Nuendo and Cubase (goe knows why!!) following up the rear. Also bear in mind that many, many composers (traditional) use notation packages such as Sibelius and Finale. Most of the articles I have read by film composers tend to suggest that they use Logic or DP as a front end for Protools, composing in Logic and then the post production work, including Foley, dubbing, SFX etc being done in PT (or more recently Pyramix or Sadie or sequioa (for classical work)). This maybe come more common given the new tie in with Euphionix System 5 http://www.euphonix.com/post/products/system_5-mc/system_5-mc.htm

It would seem from the Pro Sonar users list, that there are more dance based acts using Sonar, probably because it rocks at doing looped based work. But give it time (and a few extra features) and we maybe hearing of a few major composers using Sonar (me...fingers crossed) but then again, I do use Sibelius for all notation work, and Samplitude for my audio work...and Sonar for everything else. I just wish it had some of the scoring features which I really miss from Digital Performer (especially the wonderful tempo finder)....but hell would freeze over before I go back to Apple!!!

Please note...I use Sonar! I like Sonar, but it is not (currently) an application for Post work....get over it...I have to!

Go out there, make some music and dazzle the world....guess what most people will be saying...that is an awesome guitar line...not hmmm is that Sonar or Protools!

Peace

Neil

Although I would never consider using Pro Tools, one reason for its major market mentality not yet mentioned is that its work flow is strongly aligned with the recommendations of professional organizations such as the Producers and Engineers Wing at Grammy.com.

The more professional relationships a place of business must maintain, the more it prefers to follow a workflow based on industry standards. Pro Tools works well for those who must produce a project where formats, backups and other inter-business proceedures are standardized. Even though many decide on Pro Tools to be "Standardized" they often are unaware of what the standards actually are and often do not follow them. They simply assume they are following standard proceedures simply because they use Pro Tools.

One can follow these same workflow standards in Sonar as well, but the work flow would not be as intuitive in Sonar. Sonar is designed to get the job done by a person doing it without concern or care about if standards are followed. There is more than one way to skin a cat as they say.

By standards I am not talking about the quality of the product, but rather the archiving and workflow habits that become an industry standard for purposes of communication and portability of both personel and projects.

Nonetheless, a person well familiar with those standards can follow them using Sonar and produce Pro Tools compatible transfers and backups in an industry recommended manner.