• Hardware
  • Motu Z-Box - Recording Guitar Directly to interface? (p.2)
2015/02/26 16:10:35
pentimentosound
This is the whole Craig Anderton SOS article page list, though you can't read them all (some?)unless you are a subscriber.
http://www.soundonsound.com/articles/Sonar.php
 
I love the Radial stuff! I've got an X-Amp, plus the Gold Digger and Cherry Picker. I had a Classic ToneBone and am wondering what to replace it with, but ....certainly want to get at least 2 JDI Duplexes for my keyboards, and then there's a .............LOL
 
Thanks for the article link you intended, Beep. I used my Mackie(s) like that, too, back when I had a VLZ 24-4 and a 24-8
(I had several 1202's, too).
Michael
 
2015/02/26 18:01:47
tlw
Most guitar amps have a very high input impedance, around 1MegaOhm is typical in a valve amp. Many effects pedals with poor bypasses, DI boxes and interface inputs are lower than this, which can result in the guitar losing volume and treble (it's called "tone sucking" on guitar forums).

Some amplifiers also have a "low" input which usually has lower impedance which means a cleaner but less bright sound.

MOTU don't seem to say what the input impedance of their product actually is. Boss pedals all contain a permanently-on buffer circuit with input impedance of around 1MOhm, as do some pedals by other manufacturers. Whether the Motu can do anything a simple Boss or similar pedal can't I have no idea, but unless it adds something beyond simply having the correct impedance...

Incidentally, I'd be curious how someone measured the input imoedance of the Z-Box. Input impedance isn't generally something that can be easily measured, at least not without taking things apart, tracing the circuit and a bit of calculation.
2015/02/27 13:39:52
Beepster
tlw
Most guitar amps have a very high input impedance, around 1MegaOhm is typical in a valve amp. Many effects pedals with poor bypasses, DI boxes and interface inputs are lower than this, which can result in the guitar losing volume and treble (it's called "tone sucking" on guitar forums).

Some amplifiers also have a "low" input which usually has lower impedance which means a cleaner but less bright sound.

MOTU don't seem to say what the input impedance of their product actually is. Boss pedals all contain a permanently-on buffer circuit with input impedance of around 1MOhm, as do some pedals by other manufacturers. Whether the Motu can do anything a simple Boss or similar pedal can't I have no idea, but unless it adds something beyond simply having the correct impedance...

Incidentally, I'd be curious how someone measured the input imoedance of the Z-Box. Input impedance isn't generally something that can be easily measured, at least not without taking things apart, tracing the circuit and a bit of calculation.



I would be curious as well. However I have seen it mentioned many places on the intertubes (and you everything on the intertubes is guaranteed to be true and fer realz) that it does indeed have 1 megaohm impedence. I recall our discussions in regards to the Boss pedals and have created an elaborate routing/cabling scheme around my little studio room that allows me to use my TU-2 as a splitter. That way I can plug into any of my amps or other gear and still have a line going from the TU-2 directly into the Inst input of the Scarlett.
 
After a few very precursory tests though I don't really think I'm getting the best signal I can from this. It's a bit noisy (due to other issues), messy and kind of a pain. Also I have to worry about getting power to the TU-2. I prefer battery power but can't be constantly sinking money into 9v and adapters add more noise potential and an extra wire getting in my way.
 
Still it is a great setup and I am very happy to have those options using the gear I already have. What I really need though are some proper splitting options.
 
The Z-Box just seems like it would be much more convenient and it is pretty low cost but how useful it actually is remains to be seen. Seeing what that youtube fellow did and seeing how much more nuanced the signal appeared in his freq analyzer I think it's safe to say it does SOMETHING (unless he was intentionally bullpooping us) and it did look desirable for my needs. If I get the initial texture I can do the rest. Working with a crippled signal just makes things harder. I certainly do not expect it to work miracles though. Just nudge me a little closer to a better sound.
 
Personally I think something like that would be extremely easy to build if one had the knowhow. Just snag some caps and wire the bugger up. I could be wrong (I'm not an electronics dude which is probably apparent) but it does not strike me as complicated stuff.
2015/02/27 21:10:32
tlw
A clone of the highly respected buffer in the Klon Centaur can be put together very simply and cheaply. PCB or bread-board, three capacitors, six resistors and one IC. Kits for that and other good quality buffers can be found online. Here's one example of a Klone buffer kit from the UK -
http://shop.pedalparts.co...r/p847124_6346591.aspx

The instructions give the complete circuit diagram as well.

The output is low impedance, but unbalanced of course, though over a short cable run that shouldn't really make much difference. I've not tried that kit, nor have I ever played through a Klon. I do have the EHX Soul Food however and if it really is the same circuit it's a very transparent buffer (and a seriously nice transparent low to mid gain overdrive as well).
2015/02/28 15:21:18
mikebeam
I just got the Moto z-box in the mail and plugged it in for a trial run.
 
I recorded three takes, one in the Hi-Z, one in the Lo-Z, and one straight into the interface with no other changes. 
 
The effect is definitely VERY subtle.  It clearly is doing "something".  The first impression that I had was that it just lowered the volume...  But after comparing at similar volume levels, I think the sound is a little bit warmer.  It looses a bit of abrasiveness that was coming from the direct in.  
 
Then I recorded three takes and compensated for the volume by adjusting the input on the interface.
 
I noticed a subtle difference.  I'm not entirely sure that I would be able to pick it out in a blind test though...  Maybe after using it more.  I noticed a bigger difference with single notes rather than playing chords.  Warmer - smoother.  Sounded like a starter amp.
 
It will also be interesting to see if the effect is more dramatic when running through some amp sims.
 
Seems like a decent purchase for $40.  I wouldn't pay much more though.  Good option for a musician on a budget, but perhaps not worth it if you are a pro or can afford better options.
 
 
2015/02/28 17:57:07
Beepster
Yeah, try it through the sims. One of the big problems with DI guit and sims is that "fizzy/screechy" quality. That generally needs to be notch EQd out so it makes sense the dry signal would sound a little duller. It's probably yanking out those obnoxious upper mid range frequencies that causes problems allowing the "good" tones hit the sim properly. Curious to see how it works out in the long run for you.
 
It may be more noticeable on other sims though like Guitar Rig which I always had to fight WAY more than I do with TH2. I still notch with TH2 but it's never as extreme or finicky. I think they may have compensated a bit specifically for direct input.
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