• SONAR
  • Vocals processing
2018/04/29 21:28:19
LENovik
I have Sonar X3 and a bunch of hardware synths. I just recorded a vocal. Of course, it's never loud enough for the mix. I have read some excellent material in these pages, suggesting, ie, that I do 2 takes, and then, from one of them, make a clone. Then put all 3 together, with 2 and 3 panned maximally in each direction.
However, prior to doing that, there is still "making the vocal louder," with, I would think, compression. And then there's, of course, effects, such as reverb. 1 question: do I compress first, or apply effects? I should say that the first thing I did was pitch correcting in Melodyne, so that's done now. Perhaps I don't even compress, but that's the thing that has seemed to make the voice more "present" in the past.
If I should be visiting another part of Sonar for this type of question, perhaps  you could steer me that way.
Thanks 
LNovik
2018/04/29 22:14:24
Lynn
A good rule of thumb is to compress first, then add EQ and f/x.  However, nothing is written in stone.  If you're having trouble getting the vocal to be loud enough, remember, you can always turn everything else down until the vocal sits right.  You really won't be sacrificing headroom.
2018/04/29 22:27:06
dubdisciple
This probably could also go into “Techniques” forum, but I will leave such decisions to the mods. There are a lot of general tips and techniques that may help, but hard to pinpoint your issue without hearing material. Many times when voice isn’t “present” it is not so much a matter of loudness but an issue of how vocal sits in mix. Use a good analyses like the free SPAN meter by Voxengo to see if your instrumental is fighting your vocals for space. Making a vocal louder that has no space to fit in mix is like thinking being fatter will make you more succeful at musical chairs. Being bigger only means you are trying to cram more into a space that is not available. Once you are sure proper space is available where the vocal lives frequency wise, a couple things may help. Saturation can help give presence to get on top of mix. Another method is using something like a micro-delay. Good luck
2018/04/29 22:57:15
bitman
duck the music with the vox using a side chain.
Also push the music out to the sides to clear out the middle. leaving the drums and bass there. And put the vox in the center.
2018/04/29 23:08:34
35mm
You have started one of those threads where you will get every opinion under the sun. But, in short, stereo space + eq + compression = the basic 1st steps. No one yet has mentioned bringing the mix down to fit the vocals in or at least leaving room for the vocals in the mix. If you are up for a technical challenge you could use a spectral editor to subtract the vocal from the mix, then add it back in. There are many ways to crack this nut but it depends on the sound/style you want to go for and you haven't mentioned that. So you will get many opinions, but no answer.
2018/04/30 01:02:24
dahjah
Try the CA-2A on the vocal
2018/04/30 02:01:10
gswitz
Putting EQ before compressor is a way of causing the compressor to trigger more on certain frequencies. Sometimes, people push up one zone prior to the compressor then pull it down after.
 
I rarely do that. Instead, I use a side chain input on the compressor and apply the EQ to the sidechain signal. That enables you the chance to highpass the signal or lift the highs to de-ess without having to undo it later.
 
Using the high-pass filter on the side-chain version of the channel helps preserve bass dynamics.
 
The issue of making room for the vocal is a little different. Sometimes folks will use a multi-band or massively-multi-band compressor to compress the mix around the vocal range. This can be pretty exact and useful where the vocals are strong. The thing is, that the amount of room created is proportional to the strength of the vocal. When the vocal is quiet or subtle, this effect becomes less pronounced. It's a technique useful for loud bands where the singer isn't usually subtle. :-)
 
Another trick that can be used to make room for vocals is automated EQ. You can suppress the mid-range of the rhythm guitar during the singing for example. It's usually easy to see when the vocal is happening based on the wave form. Just pull the mid-range that competes with the vocal only when the vocal is present.
 
Sometimes a little exciter effect is enough to make it possible to make out the words in the vocal. I have long guessed that the gloss feature on the PC EQ was a touch of exciter.
 
2018/04/30 02:46:58
Anderton
Here ya go. Part of this article describes using phrase-by-phrase normalization and gain changes in Sonar to do the "heavy lifting" before adding dynamics processing, but of course it applies to Calkwalk by BandLab as well. I also wrote up a similar tip for the PreSonus blog, where I can use more graphics to get a point across than in Sound on Sound articles that cover multiple related topics. The principle is the same for either program.
2018/04/30 04:29:01
BenMMusTech
If a recording hasn't got the right level - relative to the rest of the mix - use the gain knob to reset it to around -18 rms and -3 peak. Simple.
2018/04/30 04:29:01
BenMMusTech
If a recording hasn't got the right level - relative to the rest of the mix - use the gain knob to reset it to around -18 rms and -3 peak. Simple.
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