I understand but the case of Strum Session mentioned above is a bit strange.

Yeah, I do not get that one, especially since that came with X3. What bothers me more is a CW plugin that is locked to Splat. Ironically this is not all of them but was odd to see this opening things in X3.

A big win would be to make SONAR as "collaboration friendly" as possible, but even between SONAR versions this is painful.

hmm... So the new Strum only works in SPlat (that's a ridiculous moniker BTW)?
 
Well, I had been under the impression that the majority of plugs that came with Sonar were locked to Sonar but I was pleasantly surprised when I installed another DAW (not to abandon Sonar but for other reasons I won't get into) and a huge amount of the Sonar stuff showed up in the VST options for the new DAW.
 
So yeah... it would really be nice if the plugins that should be proper, full VSTs/VSTis would continue to operate in this manner. Of course this poses a HUGE problem with the monthly memberships and whatever deals Cake has with those third party providers.
 
As mentioned folks could potentially get a $200 third party thingiemadoodle by just signing up for a month so of course the other vendors don't want that going on BUT for the people who pay full price should get what's coming to them like we are used to (full access to the plugs no matter what).
 
I don't think Cake or the vendors want to deny us that because that's the way it's worked for so long but it is ripe for abuse so SOMETHING needs to happen. This was the most confusing part of the new system for me because it did not make sense that someone paying $50 (or whatever the monthly sub is) got all that crud same as somene who pays for a full membership.
 
So instead of locking plugs to Sonar my suggestion is this...
 
Set it up so those who have a FULL 12 month membership get unlocked versions of the plugs. Those who pay month to month get the locked versions UNTIL they pay for a full consecutive 12 months. At that point they would receive a new download of the unlocked version (or whatever needs to happen... could be as simple as a registration key or something that unlocks what they already have installed).
 
Might be slightly more complex in some ways but actually a lot more fair and simpler to understand for the users in other ways. Also it would definitely encourage folks to purchase the full product or keep them paying their monthly fee to acheive the 12 month mark.
 
Knowaddimean? Does that make sense? Should this be mentioned to the Bakers?
 
They're smart dudes and probably have already thought of this but maybe not so I think that would be a pretty slick, solid way of hammering down this little oddity of the new system and likely make the third party cats happy.

pwalpwal
 i wouldn't expect an included plugin that worked across the board to suddenly become locked in after an update and without warning

 
Is that what happened? Can you no longer use the version that came with a previous purchase outside of Sonar as before?  Did the update do a search and destroy and remove the previous version from your system or inactivate it? If so it is a whole new benefit of the membership model. Cakewalk can begin to take away plugins they "sold" you previously, even if (because?) you are a current subscriber. That is different from providing you with a new version with improved features that is locked to Sonar. Just because a previous version worked universally does not imply that you have a contract to receive an updated version that does so as well. But if your old universal version is involuntarily disabled as a result of an upgrade, that does look like a taking.

In DAW-land, bundled plug-ins that aren't locked to a host are the exception rather than the rule. I was always surprised when I could use SONAR plug-ins in other DAWs.
 
A feature request would be for Cakewalk-developed plug-ins to work on other platforms, as Cakewalk controls the fate of their plug-ins. However with third-party plug-ins, it's up to those companies to decide whether to lock or not. My assumption is that Cakewalk pays less for plug-ins that are locked to SONAR, which makes them more affordable to bundle. I think third-party companies would be reluctant to give the benefits of full ownership for a low price, if for no other reason than out of fairness to customers who paid full price and therefore would expect more in return for what they paid.
 
However, I do think that if you upgrade to a full version of a plug-in, then it should work in any host for which it is compatible. I'm pretty sure that's the case with most companies.

Anderton
In DAW-land, bundled plug-ins that aren't locked to a host are the exception rather than the rule. I was always surprised when I could use SONAR plug-ins in other DAWs.
 
A feature request would be for Cakewalk-developed plug-ins to work on other platforms, as Cakewalk controls the fate of their plug-ins. However with third-party plug-ins, it's up to those companies to decide whether to lock or not. My assumption is that Cakewalk pays less for plug-ins that are locked to SONAR, which makes them more affordable to bundle. I think third-party companies would be reluctant to give the benefits of full ownership for a low price, if for no other reason than out of fairness to customers who paid full price and therefore would expect more in return for what they paid.
 
However, I do think that if you upgrade to a full version of a plug-in, then it should work in any host for which it is compatible. I'm pretty sure that's the case with most companies.

Ya... this is the thing I'm talking about. It would really suck for the third party guys like XLN who are providing their full program with Sonar to have people getting a full license by just signing up for a month when the intent was obviously for those who bought the full Sonar to get that stuff.
 
Then there are the in house plugs that Cake has indeed graciously made available on other DAWs (for now) but again people could do a month and get those plugs (or maybe there is a crippling system that I am unaware of).
 
But, and ask you this as a dude who knows the industry, do you think the idea of "lock the monthly version plugs... unlock the full member plugs" setup is feasible/a good way around this quirk of the new system?
 
Of course third party companies are another matter and those deals gotta be hammered out on a case by case basis so that's separate BUT if they WANT to provide full versions to FULL members but NOT month to month members this seems like a simple and logical way to approach/market it.
 
Ya?

Anderton
However, I do think that if you upgrade to a full version of a plug-in, then it should work in any host for which it is compatible. I'm pretty sure that's the case with most companies.

A good moral guideline for Cakewalk plugins, and one that they could follow for their own plugs and synths. But if you mean it to apply to bundled plugs from other sources, that is even more of an issue between the end user and the plugin developer. Cakewalk would have virtually no leverage in compelling the plugin guys to offer an upgrade at all, let alone specifying that the discounted price they give to a Sonar version owner would include universal compatibility. Part of the value of offering to sell a Sonar locked license via Cakewalk is the hope that users will get hooked on it and buy the (usually more full featured) retail version. In other words it is part of their demo strategy. One that works on all hosts is an added value, and if they already have Sonar locked versions in their library, it costs little extra to sell those as an upgrade. Say a two tiered upgrade $100 to a full featured Sonar only version or $200 for one that works in every host. Until recently Cakewalk was essentially selling perpetual licensed versions of universally compatible plugins, albeit usually with limited features. One might expect that the plugin sellers would see the light, as CW has done, and put an end to what most companies currently do, if there is a better deal in it for them. 

slartabartfast
...Say a two tiered upgrade $100 to a full featured Sonar only version or $200 for one that works in every host.

I can't see companies wanting to develop and support too many different versions. Having a locked "lite" version and a full version that works in all DAWs would probably be the path of least resistance. I suppose if a company's market research showed that a significant number of SONAR users would upgrade to a SONAR-only full version but not a standard full version, they might change their minds. But they'd have to make enough to justify creating and supporting the SONAR-only version; and if they had deals with other manufacturers, for consistency they'd probably feel the need to do the same thing for other DAWs. If they also have several products, that adds a significant overlay of complication.
 

slartabartfast

pwalpwal
 i wouldn't expect an included plugin that worked across the board to suddenly become locked in after an update and without warning

Is that what happened? Can you no longer use the version that came with a previous purchase outside of Sonar as before?  Did the update do a search and destroy and remove the previous version from your system or inactivate it? If so it is a whole new benefit of the membership model. Cakewalk can begin to take away plugins they "sold" you previously, even if (because?) you are a current subscriber. That is different from providing you with a new version with improved features that is locked to Sonar. Just because a previous version worked universally does not imply that you have a contract to receive an updated version that does so as well. But if your old universal version is involuntarily disabled as a result of an upgrade, that does look like a taking.

Susan G the Strum Session update in Foxboro went from working as a VSTi in other DAWs to being SONAR-only

hth

I see both the original and updated versions installed in SONAR. Just to be clear...did the original work in other programs (sorry, never tried it) and if it did, does it no longer work in other programs? Or did the original work in other programs and still does, regardless of what's happening with Version 2?