• SONAR
  • what college course is required to learn how to use this monstrosity (p.7)
2015/07/03 17:36:08
John
azslow3
John
azslow3
This thread is a good exercise for Hosts. "Newcomer" question, 2-3 reasonable answers and 50 offtop posts. Also it has popularity comparable with "My thoughts on SONAR “Everett” 

Its a good exercise for Hosts, how?

This thread has touched near every topic in the list of forum sections: from SONAR (well, not so much...), throw Hardware and Software down to Coffee House.
So, the question "where it should really be" is not so easy to answer.


Its very simple. The OP is finding it hard to learn Sonar. That is all its about. What other posters have to say hasn't changed that.  
2015/07/03 17:45:46
Anderton
John
 
Its very simple. The OP is finding it hard to learn Sonar. That is all its about. What other posters have to say hasn't changed that.  



Sure, but it also looks like he/she/it/they doesn't want to learn about SONAR. There were plenty of people here primed and ready to help, but they can't help a no-show...
 
Consider the antagonistic initial attitude, yet people were still ready to assist. I was hoping he/she/it/they would return and describe what the problem was because that might have been useful info for the new start screen, or maybe provided an idea for article or blog post. But I have no clue where the pain point come in, and it looks like I never will.
2015/07/03 18:29:56
OldTimerNewComer
Grumbleweed_
I just want to be in this thread.

Grum.

P.S. And now I'm in it I feel a little dirty.

ROFL!!!
2015/07/03 19:34:42
YouDontHasToCallMeJohnson
So, what college courses use Sonar?
2015/07/03 20:10:31
John
Anderton
John
 
Its very simple. The OP is finding it hard to learn Sonar. That is all its about. What other posters have to say hasn't changed that.  



Sure, but it also looks like he/she/it/they doesn't want to learn about SONAR. There were plenty of people here primed and ready to help, but they can't help a no-show...
 
Consider the antagonistic initial attitude, yet people were still ready to assist. I was hoping he/she/it/they would return and describe what the problem was because that might have been useful info for the new start screen, or maybe provided an idea for article or blog post. But I have no clue where the pain point come in, and it looks like I never will.


True. I just choose to look at it with some charity of spirit. We know nothing about the OP except who ever it is is having a hard time getting to grips with a very powerful program. We don't know how mature the OP is. The OP could be a kid that is frustrated by a very daunting prospect. Where to start?
 
I have been thinking about the new Sonar and the depth it has.  I take it in stride because its only a bit more to examine and learn. A new user is in a very different situation. We know about digital audio. Most of us know about MIDI. If these are totally new concepts to someone I shutter to think how I would have to deal with it at this point in time.
 
To you and me its very old hat. Heck we can argue about sample rates without looking foolish. What about those people that have never heard the term sample rate? 
 
In the end we gain a lot by having an open mind about a single post even if it turns out to be trolling by showing the world just what sort of forum we really are.  Where are values truly show.
 
If it is meant to bash Sonar there will always be time to deal with that. 
Besides you and I are hosts. People charged with making the forums a welcoming place. We can do this by holding in abeyance any opinion that would need more evidence.  
 
I do feel silly explaining this to you my hero. It is my view on this and I believe in it. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
2015/07/03 20:21:02
OldTimerNewComer
John
Anderton
John
 
Its very simple. The OP is finding it hard to learn Sonar. That is all its about. What other posters have to say hasn't changed that.  



Sure, but it also looks like he/she/it/they doesn't want to learn about SONAR. There were plenty of people here primed and ready to help, but they can't help a no-show...
 
Consider the antagonistic initial attitude, yet people were still ready to assist. I was hoping he/she/it/they would return and describe what the problem was because that might have been useful info for the new start screen, or maybe provided an idea for article or blog post. But I have no clue where the pain point come in, and it looks like I never will.


True. I just choose to look at it with some charity of spirit. We know nothing about the OP except who ever it is is having a hard time getting to grips with a very powerful program. We don't know how mature the OP is. The OP could be a kid that is frustrated by a very daunting prospect. Where to start?
 
I have been thinking about the new Sonar and the depth it has.  I take it in stride because its only a bit more to examine and learn. A new user is in a very different situation. We know about digital audio. Most of us know about MIDI. If these are totally new concepts to someone I shutter to think how I would have to deal with it at this point in time.
 
To you and me its very old hat. Heck we can argue about sample rates without looking foolish. What about those people that have never heard the term sample rate? 
 
In the end we gain a lot by having an open mind about a single post even if it turns out to be trolling by showing the world just what sort of forum we really are.  Where are values truly show.
 
If it is meant to bash Sonar there will always be time to deal with that. 
Besides you and I are hosts. People charged with making the forums a welcoming place. We can do this by holding in abeyance any opinion that would need more evidence.  
 
I do feel silly explaining this to you my hero. It is my view on this and I believe in it. 
 
 
 
 
 
 


I just don't go into a thread expecting a spoofer/troll/whatever, at THIS forum.
There is SO MUCH useful info here.
I just hope the limited info I am able to contribute helps SOMEONE,
if not the OP.
 
Mel
2015/07/03 21:14:58
Anderton
John
I just choose to look at it with some charity of spirit. We know nothing about the OP except who ever it is is having a hard time getting to grips with a very powerful program. We don't know how mature the OP is. The OP could be a kid that is frustrated by a very daunting prospect. Where to start?
Besides you and I are hosts. People charged with making the forums a welcoming place. We can do this by holding in abeyance any opinion that would need more evidence.  
 



Well, my first post in the thread was:
 
Just remember that SONAR has the equivalent functionality of a recording studio that if it was hardware, would have cost hundreds of thousands of dollars not all that long ago. That's a lot of gear! And they had engineers to run it. 
 
The first crucial step is to connect the interface to your computer and make sure SONAR recognizes it. Not much is going to happen until that's sorted out.
 
My second one was in response to those who were upset that not everyone was "welcoming," and explaining perhaps why that was the case:
 
I think the problem is that entering with a negative tone about needing a "college course" and calling SONAR a "monstrosity" when it's actually a sophisticated and well thought out piece of software kinda gets peoples' dander up. Those who come in simply asking for help, instead of making negative value judgments about a program they clearly know little about, are more likely to get a positive reception. Also, previous "one post + agenda" people do very similar posts, which muddies the waters for legitimate users. I've been fooled a few times.
 
That said, I agree that he needs more time to cool down and re-enter the dialog if he does actually does want to learn the program.
 
Later on, when the lack of dialog became palpable, the thread veered off into a direction that took into account that he appeared to have just done a "vent dump" then left. No point worrying about someone who's not around any more.
 
But consider this. I really do appreciate your wanting to show kindness, but the sad fact is that I'm not sure all people are assets to the forum. Granted, there have been plenty of people who made a similar entrance, saw that help was on the way, got things sorted out eventually, and have become contributors to our "group consciousness." There are others who are never satisfied, and come here simply to vent or promote some pet agenda. Yet even those people can make a positive contribution via constructive (and admittedly, sometimes not-so-constructive) criticisms, but not all do. If someone truly has their mind made up and a "don't confuse me with the facts" mindset, they will not benefit the forum, or those who come here to learn how to get the most out of SONAR and how to make better music. If they don't come back, I don't think it's any great loss.
 
Had he stayed, I would have recommended downloading Propellerheads' free Figure and Take apps, along with TASCAM's free recording app. They all teach the basics of what's brought to fruition in SONAR, and make Garageband look like rocket science. But if he's not motivated enough to learn, then it's not surprising if a forum isn't motivated to teach. 
 
One time I was with Chuck Surack (head of Sweetwater) who was extremely distressed because a customer claimed to have had a bad experience. Chuck had tried everything to satisfy the customer. After hearing the chain of events, I realized Chuck was dealing with someone who would never, ever be satisfied. My advice was to recognize that you can't make things right if a person doesn't want things to be right. I'm not saying for sure that's what happened here, but clearly, people were offering help and for whatever reason the OP did not avail himself of it. 
 
2015/07/03 21:27:23
Doktor Avalanche
Will I dream?
2015/07/03 21:53:07
John
We are pretty much on the same page Craig. Its a good page to be on. 
2015/07/04 00:33:03
YouDontHasToCallMeJohnson
Anderton
Chuck had tried everything to satisfy the customer. After hearing the chain of events, I realized Chuck was dealing with someone who would never, ever be satisfied. My advice was to recognize that you can't make things right if a person doesn't want things to be right.  




"My customer is always right. But, YOU are not my customer."
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