Good discussions.    The essential thing:  "Tracks" are nearly infinite, while "Channels" fall into the Midi standard, only 16.      Still in the very latest Sonar Platinum there are things that treat midi channel as a meaningful thing, forgetting that we work with hundreds of tracks.

williamcopper
Good discussions.    The essential thing:  "Tracks" are nearly infinite, while "Channels" fall into the Midi standard, only 16.      Still in the very latest Sonar Platinum there are things that treat midi channel as a meaningful thing, forgetting that we work with hundreds of tracks.

 
In theory we have unlimited MIDI tracks too. The analogy would be comparing a MIDI port to an audio track:
 
MIDI Port -> Audio Track
MIDI Channel 1-16 -> Track L/R
 
DAWs got around the 16 MIDI channel limitation by introducing the concept of a MIDI port, which itself is not part of the MIDI spec.
 
It is unfortunately this port concept that keeps tripping Sonar up. The initial bug was that MIDI events from one port would bleed into another unrelated port (they should all be unrelated and completely isolated). That's like the left channel of audio track 1 bleeding into the left channel of audio track 2. Something that would be completely unacceptable by most people, yet we had MIDI bleed all over the place for countless years. The fix a while ago did address the worst of the issues, but there are still some issues that linger.

.

I used to have that weird MIDI crosstalk thing, but not anymore since I raised the midi buffer to 1000 for some reason.

Spencer
I used to have that weird MIDI crosstalk thing, but not anymore since I raised the midi buffer to 1000 for some reason.

 
Over the many years of dealing with the MIDI crosstalk bug I tried everything, including setting every buffer I can find to their extreme values. Nothing worked accept the partial fix that Noel did in X3d. It is possible that you had a different workflow from mine, which might explain the discrepancy.

I read all this before realizing it was an old thread.   I do not have any of these problems, but I do three things that might help someone with them:    no midi echo; no "omni" setting; no midi out from any VSTI synth.   The last one might be interesting to mess with one day, but it seems to me to be easier to get layering of sounds in other ways. 

williamcopper
I read all this before realizing it was an old thread.   I do not have any of these problems, but I do three things that might help someone with them:  

OK...

williamcopper
  no midi echo;

Since MIDI echo is what makes a software or hardware synth react to the controller as it is being played I'm not at all sure how you can manage without it. Seems kind of essential to me.

williamcopper
no "omni" setting;

"Omni" has its uses. One example is a beginner who, perhaps knowing little about MIDI, just wants to plug in a controller and have it work without worrying about MIDI channels. Omni can also be useful when recording MIDI controllers sent by a multi-tymbral synth that uses a seperate MIDI channel for each voice.

williamcopper
no midi out from any VSTI synth. The last one might be interesting to mess with one day, but it seems to me to be easier to get layering of sounds in other ways. 

MIDI out from VSTi's is something many of us were flagging up as a serious omission for years, and later, when it was supposed to work and didn't, major bug. As well as allowing e.g. a third-party VST sequencer to control one or more VSTIs in the box it also allows for the use of vst programming plugin and control interfaces with external MIDI hardware such as real synths or guitar multi effects.

There is more to life than software synths and samples. The hardware synth market is pretty big at the moment with new models and reissues of old synths coming out all the time. If Sonar doesn't make it easy to work with them then that'll be a pretty hefty chunk of the market closed to Cakewalk.

williamcopper
I read all this before realizing it was an old thread.   I do not have any of these problems, but I do three things that might help someone with them:    no midi echo; no "omni" setting; no midi out from any VSTI synth.   The last one might be interesting to mess with one day, but it seems to me to be easier to get layering of sounds in other ways.

If you don't use VST MIDI out you won't run into the problem. However some of us absolutely rely on it, so it isn't just a "nice to play with one day", it is a requirement. If you do use it, you also have to use the MIDI echo feature in order to route the MIDI back into another track.
 
It is not simply about layering sounds. For example you can use JamStix to drive any other drum synth. But then you rely on VST MIDI out to work properly.

+1 for next update.

SilkTone
 
If you don't use VST MIDI out you won't run into the problem. However some of us absolutely rely on it, so it isn't just a "nice to play with one day", it is a requirement. If you do use it, you also have to use the MIDI echo feature in order to route the MIDI back into another track.
 
It is not simply about layering sounds. For example you can use JamStix to drive any other drum synth. But then you rely on VST MIDI out to work properly.

I have been learning about MIDI output the hard way