• SONAR
  • Concerns about reliability and the subscription model (p.14)
2015/05/31 22:05:48
John T
Anderton
even if some people want to sniff "Of course, I see no value in the content." (I always wonder if they've actually tried it...) Well, I see value, and so do other people. That's who I do it for, and that's why I do it. When someone posts in these forums that they found the pedalboards incredibly useful in their songwriting, that's the payoff.
 

I'd like to throw this in, on this point. I personally make very little use of "the content stuff". But I'd hesitate to make that a measure of value.
 
Most of it, I don't even install. But, you know, it's not all about me, and I don't expect it to be.
2015/05/31 22:10:49
Anderton
ampfixer
People now know exactly what your role is.



My role is the same as always. I believe the only goal that justifies our existence is to leave the world in a better place when we die than it was when we were born. Anything else is meaningless. That may not be possible to do on a grand scale, but sometimes all you need to do is lots of little things to make the world better. As one example, you might be shocked at how many companies in this industry exist, how many people have jobs, and how many products you've used are a direct result of my writing "Electronic Projects for Musicians." I am proud to say that I have changed the world in my own little way, and on balance, I think for the better.
 
I feel there are three main kinds of people in this world: creators, maintainers, and destroyers. I try to create a spirit of accuracy, completeness, and transparency when I'm in this forum, but have learned the hard way that even starting a thread complimenting people for providing tips and techniques and being more specific and accurate in their bug reports can turn into a soapbox of negativity for destroyers. A lot of the "battles" in this forum, and other forums, are between the creators and the destroyers. Unfortunately the maintainers who participate in a steady, helpful way and just want to find out how to get more out of their favorite software get caught in the crossfire. But if the destroyers are allowed to take over, entropy wins and a forum deteriorates. When a destroyer threatens to leave and use other software (as if other people care - solipsism, anyone?), I often find myself hoping they do. Cakewalk is picking up enough new users to compensate.
2015/05/31 22:12:23
Anderton
komposer
Let's take a step back for just a minute. Cool down. I wasn't intending to bring up Rap Pro.



FWIW the part of my post you quoted had absolutely nothing to do with anything you said. It was a general comment about those people who automatically assume there's some kind of devious angle to everything. If Cakewalk gave everyone a free car, someone would probably say "They're just doing it because they can write it off on their taxes or something. Besides, it's only a Honda. What a cheap a$$ company."
2015/05/31 22:17:48
Anderton
ampfixer
Thank you for clearing that up. I sincerely apologize if you felt that I was inferring anything about your character. People now know exactly what your role is. I hope you will continue with your contributions and being an idealist.



No problem, you asked a question, I gave you an answer. That's the way things should work.
2015/05/31 22:52:16
Doktor Avalanche
Anyway as I said here
 
http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3230834
 
'Chasing a moving target is the real issue, define what you like as important something is always going to be more important than something else for somebody else.'
 
We now have somebody posting here stating the drum map issue is a simple little bug, for me though a PITA I have maps everywhere. So I think that underlines the point. For what I perceive as a step forward (not to be viewed as a negative comment) click above to save repeating myself.
2015/05/31 22:58:56
gswitz
UbuntuStudio releases 'Stable Releases' which are supported for years as well as non LTS (Long Term Support) releases.
 
This way, people who depend on the reliable version can stick with the LTS version (very risk averse) and those of us who want all the latest goodies can always grab the latest.
 
I think this is a little more work for the developers because they are forced to patch old code longer, but it kinda sounds like some Cakewalk Users are asking for something more reliable and steady with a longer support window.
 
While I continue to mix on my Windows computer at home, I am using my laptop booted to UbuntuStudio more and more in the field. This is primarily due the fact that it's really hard to use a laptop once every few months and be sure it's going to work at very low latency. When I use my daughter's laptop or even my old one, I get surprises. Virus scans. App notifications. Things that interrupt the recording sometimes and this can cause a critical failure. I want to be able to make field recordings without having to apologize for losing tape. Ubuntu has not surprised me yet. I just don't have access to the built in FX in the UCX. That's my only gripe with Linux for field recording.
 
For mixing, missing out on all my Melda, Nomad, TH2, and everything Sonar brings me back again and again to my Windows computer at home.
2015/05/31 23:49:04
charlyg
Some folks will never be happy. It is what it is.....
2015/06/01 03:31:04
Bristol_Jonesey
Kylotan
brundlefly
Kylotan
WE CURRENTLY CANNOT USE THE DRUM MAPS AT ALL.

Shouting something does not make it true. If you reload the map, or reset the output of just one note number, the map will start working. It's only on initial load of a project with an existing map that they don't work. Yes, this makes switching projects frequently kind of a pain, but it's far from unusable.


So, you found a workaround, well done. This is hardly obvious and I wouldn't have found it myself. At the point where I posted, as far as I was concerned, this was true - the drum maps were not working, at all, in any project.


I'm afraid this isn't a workaround, at least it doesn't work for me.
I've tried with 3 different projects so far with zero success.
 
What is strange is that I can trigger notes by clicking on the keyboard inside the PRV/Drum Map and they sound as they should, but no audio is triggered when the transport is rolling - the Midi is triggered as evidenced by the meter activity on the midi track, but no audio.
2015/06/01 05:52:19
kevinwal
I'm not that good of a musician, nor am I especially talented at recording, mixing or mastering. My workflow in Sonar barely qualifies for the name. I know relatively little about professional music production, so I haven't had a lot of value to add to the discussions between the very capable composers, musicians, engineers and producers on this forum. I have, however, been a software engineer for many, many years, and this subject is one that I do know something about, so I finally feel qualified to add something beyond a short comment to a discussion. I accept at face value the statements about how badly impacted folks are by some of these defects, and I can understand the frustration and doubt they are expressing.
 
Now, the posts in this thread have not been overly negative or egregiously alarmist in nature, just reasonable concerns voiced by reasonable people. But in the course of exchanging opinions they quite naturally state and restate their positions again and again, back and forth until eventually people voicing reasonable concerns begin inching toward some pretty unreasonable conclusions. These reasonable people are concerned that maybe Cakewalk is moving too quickly, maybe they don't know what they're doing with testing, maybe their QA process is shaky and that maybe the developers aren't testing even the most basic scenarios.
 
Such ideas, voiced again and again on this and other forums tend to transform themselves magically into statements of concrete fact that can and will fatally damage a good company's reputation. And left unaddressed, as Craig so ably stated, these "facts" become impossible to overcome. That's why I wholeheartedly agree with and totally support Craig's unstinting efforts to correct these misapprehensions.
 
We're talking here about two or three bugs that I've counted over the course of this thread, maybe there's more but that's all I remember. That's a pretty damned good outcome for a release of this magnitude if you ask me. I know, you didn't ask me, my "workflow" wasn't impacted at all and some guys were stopped dead in the water. Thank goodness Cakewalk left you the option to roll back or not upgrade at all. It sounds like just maybe the model anticipates and accommodates such situations, right? For crying out loud, give the model credit where it's due. 
 
When I join a forum I tend to go back in time and read a lot of the old posts to avoid asking lots of redundant questions and to learn stuff I don't know. I've been a member here and a Sonar user for a long time but haven't really participated regularly until recently. One thing that struck me while reading a lot of the older posts is the number of complaints about how long it has taken Cakewalk to fix defects that customers bring to them, and at long last Cakewalk has done something about that.
 
This release model represents nothing less than a strategic push focused at least in part on addressing the age-old perception that Cakewalk is not concerned about the large backlog of defects. And make no mistake, this is a huge change for them, it just has to be. As a career software engineer, I understand how big and costly an effort formal releases are when executed only once a year, let alone once a month. I also understand what kinds of growing pains plague a product team when they move from a traditional long release cycle to an agile "release early, release often" process model. And I understand the organizational upheaval that takes place when a company makes changes like that.
 
I don't mean to belittle anyone's considered and well articulated opinions here, not at all, but holy crap, it's only been four months! I'm amazed and impressed that Cakewalk is getting it so right so quickly out of the gate. That tells me that they must have been an agile shop (or at least semi-agile) for some time internally. Yeah, maybe the release management side might have had a few burps, but as with playing a musical instrument, you just get better at the stuff you do really frequently, so I expect that aspect to improve over time as well. And I'll bet my next two paychecks that the drum map project loading scenario is now part of the formal regression test suite, lol.
 
Most of all, I am hugely impressed that the executive leadership approved such an audacious program to go with the transformation to a "membership model" when they could have done something a lot less aggressive and let the buckaroos roll in for a while.
 
Finally, I am personally grateful for the new content (which I have found immensely useful, thank you Craig!)
 
That is all. I will now fall back to my terse one line responses. Carry on.
 
2015/06/01 06:45:21
mudgel
Nice post Kevin. Keep those posts coming
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