wst3
 
If a problem is directly related to a Sonar software bug then that's one thing. But DAWs are complex beasts, and if you start with the assumption that it is a Sonar problem, and it isn't a Sonar problem, then you spend valuable time chasing the wrong path.

True. For example, there was a thread that stated SONAR had either a design flaw or a bug because the OP thought that bouncing a MIDI clip to itself forced all notes to acquire the same channel tags, even if they had all been set to different channels prior to the bounce. Several people chimed in to say that if you set the MIDI Channel field to "none," all channel assignments were in fact preserved during a bounce. Clearly there was no bug, just that the OP expected a particular default instead of having to choose whether or not to assign all events to a single channel.
 
Problems are not marginalized here if bugs are described in detail, especially if there are steps to reproduce. If fact, the OP providing steps to reproduce the "bug" made it easy to identify the reason for the pilot error. As a result of the steps to reproduce, the community DIDN'T waste time looking for a bug that didn't exist. But generalized statements with no data presented for troubleshooting, dismissing offers for help because of the assumption that it has to be a SONAR issue, and not contacting support will probably not help solve a problem. And if there IS in fact a bug, then if support can reproduce it, it's likely the bug can be fixed and the entire community will benefit. 
 
I can think of at least two instances in the past year where I was able to reproduce a bug and asked the forum to confirm. The bugs were confirmed, and Cakewalk then had the information needed to fix them. I've also confirmed several bugs noted by others. I run a lot of projects with 50 or more tracks, some as high as 130 tracks when doing sample library development. If complexity of a project caused SONAR to crash all the time, believe me, I would have switched to another DAW a long time ago...as would the people running projects equivalent to the complexity of the ones done by the OP if they crashed all the time.
 
This doesn't minimize at all the fact that some people have problems. I get that. But to make a sweeping statement that the verdict on Platinum is that it's infested with bugs that causes constant crashing goes against my experience and that of most other people. Therefore the task is neither to whine about SONAR or pretend problems don't exist, but to try and isolate the source of the problem. If it's not a bug, problem solved. If it is a bug, hopefully the problem will be solved eventually. But it won't be solved if it's not identified and cannot be reproduced reliably. 

jatoth

Anderton
 
No. It's unreasonable to expect Cakewalk to test Platinum with a wide variety of bad installations to see what happens. The source of the problem wasn't SONAR's scanning process, the problem was multiple installations of the same plug-in in multiple folders. That's wrong from the gitgo. The user was lucky that it worked okay in X3 but the fact is the scanning process continues to be improved in several ways (e.g., from what I understand it now works in Vista, which it didn't in X3). If the scanning process is more rigorous, it's reasonable that it would be less tolerant of user-created problems. 
 

 
So you are saying, X3 did it wrong, but it worked. Platinum does it right, and therefore it crashes.
X3 was obviously more forgiving. Was it a development decision to make Platinum less forgiving? Or did the bakers just miss the reasons X3 was coded to be more forgiving?
 

The thread in question involved migrating from 32bit X3 to 64bit Platinum and 32bit plug-ins crashing. The resolution (installing the 64bit version of the plug-ins) was complicated by installation issues on the PC. The user resolved the problem by uninstalling the plug-ins and reinstalling them. IOW, in this example, 32bit X3 worked correctly and 64bit Platinum does too as long as the correct version of the plug-ins is installed.
 
This is different than the original problem mentioned here except for the use of 32bit plug-ins. I believe the 32bit plug-in used in this thread has not been updated in some time. It is reasonable to expect problems over time when updating everything else but the abandoned software. The issues may be made worse by relying on bridging technology to extend the life of old plug-ins.

jatoth
So you are saying, X3 did it wrong, but it worked. Platinum does it right, and therefore it crashes.

No. I'm saying that if a plug-in is installed incorrectly, all bets are off whether a program will be able to deal with it successfully or not. scook's explanation of the additional complications caused by migrating from 32 bits to 64 bits further explains why the situation is something it is not fair to expect SONAR to anticipate.

mgh
although i haven't anything to add from a technical POV, Jamesyoyo is far from a newbie and was a stalwart of the Songs forum back in the day when I used to frequent here a lot. You can rest assured he is using a pro set-up from a hardware perspective and will have done all the basic tests to try to find the culprit.
 
right, as you were...

+1.
 
It would be nice to be able to mark a post 'helpful' more than once. I think I'll request that.

I can't add any technical expertise here, as I use Sonar 8.5, and am not knowledgeable anyway about the technical details of DAWs. However, perhaps I can offer the OP a little moral support. 
 
Awhile back, I was having problems with display driver failures in Windows. It affected both Vista and Seven drives. It was extremely frustrating. Nothing I tried worked. I got help from the Windows forums, but still no solution. I came to the conclusion that Windows was to blame. I would not hear of any other explanation. The reason was that the problem only happened in Windows, not in Linux. Ergo, Windows was at fault. I got a bit snippy, causing the forum folks to get defensive. I finally uninstalled all Nvidia drivers, and installed VGA drivers. I lived with crappy graphics for awhile, until one day I removed the memory upgrade I had done a couple years previously. I can't even remember why I did this, but the problem immediately went away.
 
So the problem was caused by a bad memory module. The forum folks had suggested this as a culprit, but I was so convinced it was Windows' fault that I stubbornly refused to try something that would have solved the problem. Instead, I started bashing Microsoft, and pointlessly trying to learn Linux so I could switch to that. (Not advisable for DAWs, of course). Now, I can profess to love Windows and Microsoft again, and regret the fact that I bad-mouthed them. I went back and apologized to the forum hosts.
 
I understand your frustration, James. You spend money and expect it to work, and when it doesn't and the problem is not obvious, you look to cast blame somewhere. But technology is extremely complicated, obviously, and we all have different setups. But the only solution will come from taking the extended hands of Craig and the Cakewalk and forum staffs, and work with them to help you solve the problem. It is solvable; even I know that. Because a lot of really bright people who also care about helping other musicians, are more than capable of dealing with any issue that comes up. Don't let your emotions blind you. Get the help you need, and the problem will be solved. Listen to the voices of reason here!

Michael:
 
You should be a counselor.  Your advice applies to much more than technical issues with computers and software.
 
Paul

I was one. I'm retired now. And thank you.

I agree that the problem does not necessarily lie with Sonar. But I also can't stand responses that say "if you are a pro you shouldn't be using it until it's stable". While obviously any pro needs to take his/her own precautions to create a stable working environment, that kind of comment only deflects from the problem that's being discussed and somehow makes it sound as if the user is at fault for buggy software (or OS or memory). No matter how tiring it may be for developers or passionate users, the attitude should always be one of commiseration and problem solving. Otherwise just don't say anything.

Obviously the person who has the problem has to want to work with the community too and try to not get stuck in the frustration of it all.

I have not read the updated posts since this morning but as I was logged out I wanted to mention/ask this...
 
Is this a project started in X3 that you opened in Platinum to continue working on or is it a new project started in Platinum?
 
My quick answer for both scenarios are...
 
If it is the former, finish the project in X3 and if you could maybe start a test project in Platinum and report back whether that fresh, started in Plat project, behaves in the same way. 
 
If it is the latter then yeah, something is screwy.
 
Long winded blathering...
 
When I upgraded to X3 I had been working on a project in X2. I tried to continue the project in X3 because I wanted to use some of the new goodies. The project would not play all the way through. It would get stuck at a certain point and I'd get a dropout. It refused to play beyond that point... amongst other issues. There was no rhyme or reason to it. It work fine in X2 (as well as anything really could in X2 which drove me nuts). Any new projects I work on that were started in X3 however were perfectly fine and more stable than anything I had ever previously experienced with Sonar (I bought in at X1 Prod Suite).
 
I finished the project in X2. Annoying but whatever.
 
That said... I have more or less successfully transferred my main X3 project into Plat without any noticeable problems so far. However It is mostly audio based (only MIDI drums) and all my plugs/synths are 64 bit (and actually came with X3... so aside from Addictive Drums 1, TH2 (full) and Melodyne it's all Cake stuff (and those are Cake included/"approved" tools). Also all I've really been doing is tracking and some light editing.
 
I did however start running into some problems with a CWB that was created in Plat, sent to me and opened in Plat. There were a lot of things that could be causing that though. Frozen synths (that I do not own), lots of MIDI tracks, missing plugs, the project went corrupt after loop recording (which is notoriously screwy and my HDDs aren't set up correctly making things worse) and... well it's a CWB which brings up other possible issues.
 
Anyway... as I said if it's an X3 project I, personally, would just wrap it up in X3 then move on to Plat for new stuff.
 
To anyone concerned James may be trollin... that is very doubtful. He's opinionated but AFAIK he's a true pro and contributes a lot (although usually in the Songs area). I am not feeling well right now and not smart enough to solve problems for a dude like him so I'll let you all do the troubleshootin'. Just wanted to toss those little nuggets into the fray.
 
Cheers.

michael diemer
I can't add any technical expertise here, as I use Sonar 8.5, and am not knowledgeable anyway about the technical details of DAWs. However, perhaps I can offer the OP a little moral support. 
 
Awhile back, I was having problems with display driver failures in Windows. It affected both Vista and Seven drives. It was extremely frustrating. Nothing I tried worked. I got help from the Windows forums, but still no solution. I came to the conclusion that Windows was to blame. I would not hear of any other explanation. The reason was that the problem only happened in Windows, not in Linux. Ergo, Windows was at fault. I got a bit snippy, causing the forum folks to get defensive. I finally uninstalled all Nvidia drivers, and installed VGA drivers. I lived with crappy graphics for awhile, until one day I removed the memory upgrade I had done a couple years previously. I can't even remember why I did this, but the problem immediately went away.
 
So the problem was caused by a bad memory module. The forum folks had suggested this as a culprit, but I was so convinced it was Windows' fault that I stubbornly refused to try something that would have solved the problem. Instead, I started bashing Microsoft, and pointlessly trying to learn Linux so I could switch to that. (Not advisable for DAWs, of course). Now, I can profess to love Windows and Microsoft again, and regret the fact that I bad-mouthed them. I went back and apologized to the forum hosts.
 
I understand your frustration, James. You spend money and expect it to work, and when it doesn't and the problem is not obvious, you look to cast blame somewhere. But technology is extremely complicated, obviously, and we all have different setups. But the only solution will come from taking the extended hands of Craig and the Cakewalk and forum staffs, and work with them to help you solve the problem. It is solvable; even I know that. Because a lot of really bright people who also care about helping other musicians, are more than capable of dealing with any issue that comes up. Don't let your emotions blind you. Get the help you need, and the problem will be solved. Listen to the voices of reason here!

 
I'm happy you're a member here Michael. I 2too2 had daw problems a while back. WIN8.1 and sonar X3 was a pain. Not X2 - that version ran well. But x3 was almost unusable at times. It was frustrating trying to correct this problem (glitchy graphics and overall sluggish x3). What kept me from believing it was x3 was the fact that so many people here proclaimed x3 to be the most stable version to date. So I knew it had to be a problem here. As it turned out I had 2 problems that were discussed here. First, I had a failing graphics card - Jim Roseberry pointed that out to  me and suggested a card that I did indeed install. And secondly... I had made the mistake of loading Win8 over top of Vista. I knew it was a bad idea, but I somehow thought I would be exempt. What was I thinking? Anyway - a new graphics card and a fresh install of Win8.1 over a clean drive all equaled peaceful success. So I'm absolutely supporting your post.