• SONAR
  • X3 Producer: Why is it so difficult to record audio from a soft synth? (p.2)
2015/02/15 20:36:52
FastBikerBoy
timg11
 
2) Presets don't fully "preset". They save some settings but not others. Notably, the Destination track and the Source Buses/Tracks are not part of the preset, and your settings are not remembered, even between sequential uses in the same project. They have to be manually set every time.
 
 




 
Presets can be adjusted and either saved over or a new preset created. Click on the disk icon beside the preset selection field to overwrite or type a new preset name to create a new one.
2015/02/16 15:38:40
Earwax
timg11
…I still don't understand why the direct recording of the synth is not allowed.

Yes, it is extremely frustrating. It seems counterintuitive that you can’t do this. Craig, is this a hardware and/or software limitation? Is there any DAW that allows you to do this? It would seem to me that, if I can sit down at a keyboard controller and play a solo piano piece through Ivory, I should be able to record what I’m hearing, as I hear it, if I so choose. Is this physically impossible for any DAW to do, or is it a Sonar limitation? If you can play and record VST effects “live”, why can’t you play and record VSTi’s “live”?
2015/02/16 16:05:08
brundlefly
Earwax
If you can play and record VST effects “live”, why can’t you play and record VSTi’s “live”?



Actually, you can't print FX in real time, either. Both are technically quite feasible, just not implemented in SONAR. My understanding is that Ableton and Pro Tools allow it.

2015/02/16 16:29:56
Sanderxpander
I still don't understand why you would want to. Freeze or bounce is much quicker.

Oh and yeah Ableton does allow this, but I'm pretty sure that's because it lacks dedicated bounce to tracks functions and it used to be the only way to "bounce" things like Melodyne edits. I much, much prefer the Sonar set of options here, personally.
2015/02/16 16:42:47
brundlefly
The two examples I commonly see are:
 
1. The synth patch has random elements that a performer can interact with in a dynamic way during live performance that won't be replicated on freezing.
 
2. There are synth parameters that can be tweaked in the GUI that can't be automated with MIDI.
2015/02/16 16:50:59
Sanderxpander
Fair enough, I haven't encountered those yet. Sonar has been great at capturing anything I do with midi and automation.
2015/02/16 17:37:26
Earwax
Sanderxpander
I still don't understand why you would want to. Freeze or bounce is much quicker.

Actually, it's impossible for any other method to be "quicker" than real time recording. When you stop playing, you're done recording. And, brundlefly's response exactly mirrors what most people wanting to record "live" want to do. If I'm playing music on an instrument that I'm interacting organically with as I play it, I want that emotional performance and all of its nuances captured "live" and immediately. If I choose to edit it in some fashion after the performance is captured, that's fine. Some people are interested in capturing a MIDI performamnce. Others are interested in capturing an audio performance. Different mindsets, I guess.
 
2015/02/16 17:39:30
Earwax
brundlefly
Earwax
If you can play and record VST effects “live”, why can’t you play and record VSTi’s “live”?



Actually, you can't print FX in real time, either. Both are technically quite feasible, just not implemented in SONAR. My understanding is that Ableton and Pro Tools allow it.


You're right. I wasn't thinking of Sonar when I typed that. Sorry for the confusion.
2015/02/16 17:46:42
Sanderxpander
With instruments that are unable to have their behavior properly captured by midi/automation, I immediately concede the point. I personally have never used any so it was never a concern.

We have some folks with weird notions in here sometimes (e.g. one guy who insisted you need to bounce each and every synth to audio for mixdowns because of latency) so I just want to make sure that live recording of a synth is actually what you really need, as opposed to simply turning a recorded softsynth performance into audio.
2015/02/16 17:55:11
John
Earwax
timg11
…I still don't understand why the direct recording of the synth is not allowed.

Yes, it is extremely frustrating. It seems counterintuitive that you can’t do this. Craig, is this a hardware and/or software limitation? Is there any DAW that allows you to do this? It would seem to me that, if I can sit down at a keyboard controller and play a solo piano piece through Ivory, I should be able to record what I’m hearing, as I hear it, if I so choose. Is this physically impossible for any DAW to do, or is it a Sonar limitation? If you can play and record VST effects “live”, why can’t you play and record VSTi’s “live”?


One reason it is not an issue for most of us is that we record the MIDI. That is the important part. The audio is only used for mixing down to a stereo file for distribution. The MIDI is far and away the part that is the whole point of Sonar. Keep in mind that Sonar has roots in MIDI sequencing not audio. Its this quality that most of us appreciate. Now the audio is very much an important aspect for many but Sonar has not forgotten its roots.
 
 This is one reason that many of us don't understand the need to record audio from a soft synth. To us we can have audio at any time by playing back the MIDI. Some of us use hardware synths along side soft synths. If we want to record the audio from those hardware synths we can in real time.
 
The only reason to be able to record audio from a soft synth in real time is to record a performance in real time that can't be done with the MIDI alone due to randomness of the synth's output. Outside of that there is no good reason for recording the output of a soft synth. Even then is a weak argument. Because if randomness is important which "run" of random output is the "right" one? The same thing can just as easily obtained with a bounce or freeze.      
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